Welcome to the Prison Talk Online Community! Take a Minute and Sign Up Today!






Go Back   Prison Talk > U.S. REGIONAL FORUMS > TEXAS > Texas Prison & Criminal Justice News & Events
Register Entertainment FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Texas Prison & Criminal Justice News & Events Current news items and information on events related to the Texas prison & criminal justice system.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-03-2009, 07:46 PM
retired-37's Avatar
retired-37 retired-37 is offline
Irrelevant, ignorant & ill-informed
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: i'm irrelevant
Posts: 1,086
Thanks: 2,964
Thanked 1,113 Times in 521 Posts
Exclamation Ad Seg....the ugly truth...

"Jason died in a cold, lonely cell in a prison where he felt no one gave a damn about him. This is the fault of a system, and a state, that has lost its sense of humanity. I have thought a lot about this, because I have seen it happen to many men in here. I sit not knowing if I am ever going to get out of prison, and the thought had passed my own mind that I could end it all and not have to endure this kind of existence. But I have not reached the end of my rope. I know that it could happen to me, or anyone living in here, because I have seen men say what I am saying today, and later they give up. Jason is an example, and I am still affected by the fact that his solitude killed him. That and the fact that he could find no one in this environment who treated him as a human being. He realized that he was nothing more than a number and a product of the system."

-Life and Death in a Cold Lonely Cell by Sid Hawk Byrd- The Texas Observer

Read the whole story at the following: http://www.texasobserver.org/article.php?aid=2626

I want to thank Lilinstig8tor for opening my eyes to another TDCJ abuse that I didn't even know existed....the world of Administrative Segregation...Ad Seg. You keep fighting Lil....someday, Texas Prisons will be humane places because of people like you!!...andy
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to retired-37 For This Useful Post:
4real4real (10-03-2009), Eternal Sunshine (10-04-2009), KathleenTX (10-04-2009), txmatt409 (04-29-2010), wentu (10-05-2009)
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 10-03-2009, 10:43 PM
4real4real 4real4real is offline
HE'S HOME!
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Cincinnati OH
Posts: 715
Thanks: 385
Thanked 481 Times in 302 Posts
Default

That was a good read but a very sad one. I followed the link to Time Mag. I'm counting my blessings once again that I have no loved ones in a SuperMax or a Texas prison. Thank you Lord! My prayers and my heartfelt love goes out for those who do. God Bless You All!
__________________
I'm a Prisoner of Hope
The Following User Says Thank You to 4real4real For This Useful Post:
retired-37 (10-03-2009)
  #3  
Old 10-04-2009, 12:02 AM
Eternal Sunshine's Avatar
Eternal Sunshine Eternal Sunshine is offline
Living and Learning
 

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 2,094
Thanks: 2,195
Thanked 1,736 Times in 1,022 Posts
Default

Thank you for posting this. My man has spent many years in ad seg so I wasn't surprised reading this....just very sad.
__________________


Don’t make someone a priority in your life when you’re only an option in theirs.
  #4  
Old 10-04-2009, 01:04 AM
Drucifer Drucifer is offline
Account Closed
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 1,564
Thanks: 1,009
Thanked 1,759 Times in 689 Posts
Default

How about some personal experiences as opposed to re-prints???? Come on Andy. I can find plenty of incendiary things on other sites about TDCJ but thats not fair. Why are you trying to alarm people who havent bitched or complained??? Better yet, what is the solution Andy? Let these people go? Put them in a cabin in a forest?? What do you do with a psychopath who WONT rehabilitate? There is a reason for prison. Hello??? Not everyone is minimum security going home. Some of these people DONT NEED THE LIGHT OF DAY. Lets be real for a minute. What are YOUR expectations? You sure bring a lot of gloom and doom here. Do you know EVERY UNIT and HOW IT OPERATES? There are 112. I know DAMN GOOD AND WELL some are BAD...some are REAL BAD but posting stories here from 1981 and 2007 is just....well...I dont know Andy. Seems like you are reaching....again.

Next you will complain about the psychopaths on DR getting gassed. DUH???

Last edited by Drucifer; 10-04-2009 at 01:24 AM..
  #5  
Old 10-04-2009, 07:32 AM
IamFEAR IamFEAR is offline
Registered User
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Texarkana, TX
Posts: 48
Thanks: 0
Thanked 34 Times in 20 Posts
Default

It's a given that Administrative Segregation is bad. Offenders are put there for a variety of reasons, but the overall unifying one is that they are a threat to other offenders. Maybe they have violent tendencies, or they're a high ranking member of a confirmed Security Threat Group (AKA a gang). Either way, the reality is that every Ad-Seg offended CHOSE to be there.

I didn't finish the article, in all honesty. The conditions described aren't accurate tho, from what I've seen. Firstly, I've seen one cat that didn't get taken off the unit within a day of it's discovery. Despite the fact people like them, they are carriers of disease when not properly vaccinated and living off live animals. Secondly, pests aren't nearly as big a problem as described. Daily, I see offenders (with maintenance supervising) come through and spray the perimeter of all buildings with pesticide and spray the inside of the buildings with bleach-water. (Offenders are responsible for the cleanliness of their own cells - We provide cleaning powder.)

Alot of offenders I've spoken to actually prefer Ad-Seg to General Population as well, per their own words. An offender who is working on a book or some other kind of literature would prefer the quiet, obviously. Some don't like dealing with other offenders at all. Some need protection (Protective Custody is a category of Ad-Seg). I've seen a great many offenders go into Ad-Seg and then leave for General Population again. Many, after a couple of years, become G2s or better.

As a matter of fact, the most dangerous place to be in a unit (in my opinion) is on an Ad-Seg Pod right before the State Classification Committee does interviews. The SCC is the governing committee for all Ad-Seg offenders (as opposed to the UCC, which makes some decisions for G.P.). They'll conduct interviews to see if an offender is stable enough for G.P., and will arbitrarily make them return in some cases. As a result, many offenders desperate to remain in Seg will become assaultive just to avoid this. Seen it happen entirely too many times.

In short, Ad-Seg is bad, but remember that it is a NON-PUNITIVE status. Offenders are placed there to protect other human beings, and they are in control of how long they remain.

Last edited by IamFEAR; 10-04-2009 at 07:33 AM.. Reason: Typos
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to IamFEAR For This Useful Post:
Drucifer (10-04-2009), WilcoMom (10-04-2009)
  #6  
Old 10-04-2009, 12:25 PM
KathleenTX's Avatar
KathleenTX KathleenTX is offline
Texas and Ohio
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 1,055
Thanks: 886
Thanked 665 Times in 359 Posts
Default

I have read the articles and posts by Achapinguy, Drucifer and IamFear. And I hear the emotions in the posts. The articles are not pleasant to read. And yes they are a few years old, however, for the most part ring very true of where my friend is.

He has been in Ad Seg in Texas for several years. At first he was reluctant to write or talk about it. However, with time we have discussed the good and bad aspects of Ad Seg as it relates to him.

Ad Seg is different for each individual. It all depends on the mental and emotional state of the individual along with any outside contact they may have. I work very hard so that my friend has mental stimulation, goals and the means to accomplish those goals. I try to help him find laughter in everyday life. I write copious letters and send him puzzles, books, grocery ads and other things to keep him in touch with the world. It also has to do with his self discipline and thirst for knowledge.

People are in Ad Seg for a variety of reasons. I will not address the reasons as that is where the arguments will begin. I do not believe that people "choose to be there". I won’t even address why my friend is there. It doesn’t matter. He made choices and now he lives with them. He asks for no pity and accepts none. He will remain in Ad Seg until released.

If one is confirmed then the only way out of Ad Seg is to go through a program and all that goes with it. That can take quite a few years as where he is the program has a long waiting list. It would take longer than the total length of time he will spend there. No one seems to address that even if they go through that program it is rare that they can return to general population as that in itself could be a death sentence. So the option would be to go through the program to get out of Ad Seg and then beg for Ad Seg so as not to be hurt - a bit of an oxymoron there.

It really doesn't matter why they are there. The reality is that many of these individuals will eventually be released on the street. And that is where you and I will have to interact with them. All of us will have to deal with the issues that Ad Seg has placed on them - whether you are the clerk at the grocery store or the loved one - it impacts all of us. That is what needs to be remembered. Unless you have dealt with the prison system in some way then you have no idea of what these people have gone through. I know that I was very ignorant of the challenges facing the incarcerated until a few years ago. I know that when I have talked to some of my friends they don’t have a clue of what goes on after a person enters the system.

As far as the conditions go - well my friend was bitten by a brown recluse and bears the scar from it. Since it can take days to get medical attention once you put in a request, he has permanent muscle damage as well as a crater remaining in his leg. Rats are the norm as well as mice and cock roaches. Brownish goo running down the walls in the humid hot summer heat is a reality. Unless the cleaning powder referred to contains bleach or some special agent to kill mold then that does no good. Once mold forms, whether in prison or in your own bathroom, then you must kill the mold to stop it.
Since the educational level of the majority (not all) of the prisoners is not great then I don't really think that many want to be placed in Ad Seg to write books. And what quiet in Ad Seg? My friend lives with ear plugs. He says there isn't any other way to be able to have any peace and quiet due to the antics on the row.

As far as NON-PUNITIVE status goes, what a croc! They bust puppy mills due to inhumane treatment of being in a cage 24/7. I wonder why we treat animals better than humans.

As for my friend? Well, in my lack of understanding of Ad Seg I didn't have a clue that during this last lockdown that the runs are filled with trash that becomes a virulent mess. Now, I wonder why I thought they would have trash cans – how lame is that? Nope, I'm told that anything they need to dispose of is thrown out on the run to be swept up. But that during lockdown no one sweeps. So all the brown bag meals are thrown out on the run along with anything else they need to dispose of.

Will the flu running rampant in Texas (per the CDC this week) I worry not only for my friend but for everyone who works there or comes in contact with anyone there. Leaving trash to basically compost in brown bags is just like asking to get sick. I would hate for the children of the Officers or staff to get ill due to the unhealthy living conditions. I am sorry for anyone who has to live in that but I am also just as sorry for every person that works there.

Do I have the answers? Absolutely not, however, I do worry and know that changes must be made if we ever hope to have these individuals back in society as our neighbors. Which one of you is ready for a person who has been in Ad Seg for the last 20 years to move in next door to you? Are you ready to invite them over for dinner with your family or hire them? I do believe that it should be mandatory for anyone in Ad Seg to have counseling for at least 6 months before they are released.

Just my opinion.

Last edited by KathleenTX; 10-04-2009 at 12:27 PM.. Reason: typographical error
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to KathleenTX For This Useful Post:
Eternal Sunshine (10-04-2009), lds (11-07-2009), Lorraine (10-04-2009), Michelep68 (10-05-2009), retired-37 (10-04-2009), wentu (10-05-2009)
  #7  
Old 10-04-2009, 02:42 PM
mammastalkin's Avatar
mammastalkin mammastalkin is offline
Registered User

Staff Superstar Winner 

Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Delaware
Posts: 5,538
Thanks: 1,829
Thanked 3,295 Times in 1,887 Posts
Default

Very nicely put Kderrick. I think you have shown the kind of compassion that we should be finding on PTO.
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to mammastalkin For This Useful Post:
4real4real (10-04-2009), KathleenTX (10-05-2009), retired-37 (10-04-2009), wentu (10-05-2009)
  #8  
Old 10-04-2009, 04:33 PM
retired-37's Avatar
retired-37 retired-37 is offline
Irrelevant, ignorant & ill-informed
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: i'm irrelevant
Posts: 1,086
Thanks: 2,964
Thanked 1,113 Times in 521 Posts
Default I thought we were better than that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drucifer View Post

Next you will complain about the psychopaths on DR getting gassed. DUH???
They're getting gassed??!! Well, I'm just going to pick up the phone and complain, complain, complain! And if that doesn't work, I'm going to post 'reprints' from 1981 because 'I'm reaching'....again!!

NEVER did I think, I would see the day you attacked me personally. This thread was part of a series of three that would eventually show how ad seg hasn't improved.....from that first 'old' post to the third thread which would have been the most recent. I'm soooooooooo disgusted & hurt by your response Drue. You even started a thread to 'slam me' and my article. I thought we were friends; I also thought WE were better than that................andy
The Following User Says Thank You to retired-37 For This Useful Post:
wentu (10-05-2009)
  #9  
Old 10-04-2009, 04:49 PM
JJS811 JJS811 is offline
Registered User
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Where I want to be
Posts: 4,831
Thanks: 1,725
Thanked 2,608 Times in 1,593 Posts
Default

Gassings on DR are well known about and have been documented. Texas has the worst reputation for a reason. Inmates are simply warehoused until they are either released or executed. TDCJ has no compassion, nor humanity. I accept there will be good in among the bad, but the bad far, far out weighs the good. Maybe if the powers that be, see inmates as people, and not just 'offenders' there may be progress. Until that day, the conditions will not improve, and Texas will continue to be seen as the worst state for inmate human rights in the US.

achapinguy, keep 'reaching' and keep banging the drum for human rights in the lone star state, they badly need people like you!


Quote:
Originally Posted by achapinguy View Post
They're getting gassed??!! Well, I'm just going to pick up the phone and complain, complain, complain! And if that doesn't work, I'm going to post 'reprints' from 1981 because 'I'm reaching'....again!!

NEVER did I think, I would see the day you attacked me personally. This thread was part of a series of three that would eventually show how ad seg hasn't improved.....from that first 'old' post to the third thread which would have been the most recent. I'm soooooooooo disgusted & hurt by your response Drue. You even started a thread to 'slam me' and my article. I thought we were friends; I also thought WE were better than that................andy
__________________
Do not worry if you have built your castles in the air. They are where they should be. Now put the foundations under them. ~ Henry David Thoreau

America - land of the free, home of the incarcerated.

The USA has 5% of the worlds population and 25% of the the worlds prisoners.
The Following User Says Thank You to JJS811 For This Useful Post:
retired-37 (10-04-2009)
  #10  
Old 10-04-2009, 04:52 PM
Drucifer Drucifer is offline
Account Closed
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 1,564
Thanks: 1,009
Thanked 1,759 Times in 689 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by achapinguy View Post
They're getting gassed??!! Well, I'm just going to pick up the phone and complain, complain, complain! And if that doesn't work, I'm going to post 'reprints' from 1981 because 'I'm reaching'....again!!

NEVER did I think, I would see the day you attacked me personally. This thread was part of a series of three that would eventually show how ad seg hasn't improved.....from that first 'old' post to the third thread which would have been the most recent. I'm soooooooooo disgusted & hurt by your response Drue. You even started a thread to 'slam me' and my article. I thought we were friends; I also thought WE were better than that................andy
You just dont get it. This isnt the place. Attacked? Hardly. An attempt to point out that what you are doing here is going nowhere.
  #11  
Old 10-04-2009, 09:35 PM
retired-37's Avatar
retired-37 retired-37 is offline
Irrelevant, ignorant & ill-informed
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: i'm irrelevant
Posts: 1,086
Thanks: 2,964
Thanked 1,113 Times in 521 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drucifer View Post
You just dont get it. This isnt the place. Attacked? Hardly. An attempt to point out that what you are doing here is going nowhere.
I understand that this is going no where, Drue. We need to get our heads together and present some kind of unified solution. I like you, don't have all the answers. But, instead of turning against each other.............can't we come together towards a common goal? Can we not use the simple 'give and take' phylosophy??..........andy
  #12  
Old 10-04-2009, 10:57 PM
JJS811 JJS811 is offline
Registered User
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Where I want to be
Posts: 4,831
Thanks: 1,725
Thanked 2,608 Times in 1,593 Posts
Default

I doubt any one person has all the answers, and a lone small voice is never going to be heard. It is only by people banding together to brainstorm, and shout loud is change even going to be possible. However, change there must be. TDCJ is unjust, unfair and inhumane, these issues are fact, there is documentation by the truck load proving this. The old adage 'united we stand' really is IMO the only way forward in attempting to make things better.


Quote:
Originally Posted by achapinguy View Post
I understand that this is going no where, Drue. We need to get our heads together and present some kind of unified solution. I like you, don't have all the answers. But, instead of turning against each other.............can't we come together towards a common goal? Can we not use the simple 'give and take' phylosophy??..........andy
__________________
Do not worry if you have built your castles in the air. They are where they should be. Now put the foundations under them. ~ Henry David Thoreau

America - land of the free, home of the incarcerated.

The USA has 5% of the worlds population and 25% of the the worlds prisoners.
  #13  
Old 10-05-2009, 05:26 AM
KathleenTX's Avatar
KathleenTX KathleenTX is offline
Texas and Ohio
Donation Award 
 

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 1,055
Thanks: 886
Thanked 665 Times in 359 Posts
Default

Well gentlemen, this isn't a p&##ing contest, please. Let's not duke it out here. For that take it private.

I want to hear both sides, however, not when both get so upset. I would hate to see y'all banned as both have much to contribute.

Chill, it's a good day. There is a saying "God is in heaven and all is okay". Not to offend any non believers.

K
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:45 AM.
Copyright © 2001- 2017 Prison Talk Online
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Website Design & Custom vBulletin Skins by: Relivo Media
Message Board Statistics