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  #151  
Old 11-16-2017, 01:21 AM
jeswannabhiswyf jeswannabhiswyf is offline
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I'll point out that it's interesting....not just here but on other threads......women almost unanimously are opposed to their men being involved sexually with another inmate. Men on the other hand seem to be more permissive of it. Now, I personally am not stepping out. Others do have permission.

I am not sure why there's a gender difference exactly. I don't think it's an issue of us men being "dogs" so to speak because clearly we are all very much in love with and very supportive of our women. I was having a terrible day today and 15 minutes on the phone with Dee completely lit up my world. We are a team in all regards except one right now and that's going to cease to be an issue in exactly 4 months (and a few hours.)

Anyone have any thoughts on the gender gap?

-E

Some men fantasize about 2 women. That can be a turn on for them. For most women, it's not attractive for your man to penetrate another man, and especially unattractive for him to be penetrated. For me personally, I'm too strong of a woman to respect him as my man if he's accepting the same organ I accept. Either emasculates him in my eyes. I require a strong, manly man. Please understand that I have nothing against men who have sexual encounters with other men. That's their choice and it doesn't affect me. However, that group of men is eliminated from my relationship/sexual encounter choice pool.
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  #152  
Old 11-16-2017, 01:30 AM
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Some men fantasize about 2 women. That can be a turn on for them. For most women, it's not attractive for your man to penetrate another man, and especially unattractive for him to be penetrated. For me personally, I'm too strong of a woman to respect him as my man if he's accepting the same organ I accept. Either emasculates him in my eyes. I require a strong, manly man. Please understand that I have nothing against men who have sexual encounters with other men. That's their choice and it doesn't affect me. However, that group of men is eliminated from my relationship/sexual encounter choice pool.


All due respect.....the women Dee was around......not exactly my idea of fantasy-worthy. So at least in my case there wasnít an issue of being aroused of the idea of her with other women (others may view it differently in their own situations.)

I think your response does make an interesting point about some of the differences in the preferences of men with an incarcerated woman in their lives vs. women with an incarcerated man. Thereís different views of what is and isnít acceptable not just in our specific relationships, but what has become acceptable/unacceptable in gender roles. Penetration seems to be a big deal.......thereís something very intimate and personal about penetration and....all due respect....two women canít exactly be quite that way. Something about male genitalia seems to make the matter more serious for some reason. If you ask most men, youíre probably onto something....much more tolerance of their women being with other woman than if they had a sexual relationship with, say, a male correctional officer.
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  #153  
Old 11-18-2017, 03:31 PM
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All due respect.....the women Dee was around......not exactly my idea of fantasy-worthy. So at least in my case there wasnít an issue of being aroused of the idea of her with other women (others may view it differently in their own situations.)

I think your response does make an interesting point about some of the differences in the preferences of men with an incarcerated woman in their lives vs. women with an incarcerated man. Thereís different views of what is and isnít acceptable not just in our specific relationships, but what has become acceptable/unacceptable in gender roles. Penetration seems to be a big deal.......thereís something very intimate and personal about penetration and....all due respect....two women canít exactly be quite that way. Something about male genitalia seems to make the matter more serious for some reason. If you ask most men, youíre probably onto something....much more tolerance of their women being with other woman than if they had a sexual relationship with, say, a male correctional officer.
I agree with jeswanna..I think many (not all) men have this thing about 2 women together and so they are just more ok with the idea of their LO being with another woman as opposed to a woman being ok with their male LO being with another man. I also think society is in general more approving of 2 women together than 2 males together, for whatever reason.

Personally, while it is not for me, and it is not for my husband, I think it truly depends on the situation and people shouldn't be judged for whatever their arrangement is. Obviously, if someone has a sentence that they're never going to see the light of day again, we may all feel differently about what they do or don't do inside than if they were going to get out in a few years. Just like if we were the ones free on the outside, I can't imagine we would choose to be celibate forever in the same scenario, but as I constantly tell people, you never know what you would do unless you are in the same situation, so you can't judge.

I would definitely bet if research were done however, that women do engage in more sexual relationships in prison than their male counterparts. I would think that is because women do so more for the emotional connection. Men probably don't need that as much and are not seeking that. Imagine how many of these women are away from their children. Many of us our nurturers, and I am sure these women crave that as well as crave being nurtured by anyone. One thing however in a woman's prison that must be something to see, is that there must be some high drama! That is for sure!! The amount of hormones going crazy, sneaking around, jealousy, time of the month issues. I cannot imagine!

And by the way, someone made a comment about no STD's between women? That is false. Women can spread STDs. STDs are spread by bodily fluids. They are not just spread by ejaculating into someone.

At the end of the day, like I said, whatever works for one may not work for all and if it works for you, more power to you. My biggest worry is getting my husband out in one piece (fortunately he's just going to a camp), and what kind of long-term emotional impact it will have on him or what kind of bad changes there may be when he comes out. He's older, so to some degree this is the one time I hope the "leopard doesn't change their spots" statement holds true!
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  #154  
Old 11-18-2017, 05:07 PM
nygirl17 nygirl17 is offline
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I agree with jeswanna..I think many (not all) men have this thing about 2 women together and so they are just more ok with the idea of their LO being with another woman as opposed to a woman being ok with their male LO being with another man. I also think society is in general more approving of 2 women together than 2 males together, for whatever reason.

Personally, while it is not for me, and it is not for my husband, I think it truly depends on the situation and people shouldn't be judged for whatever their arrangement is. Obviously, if someone has a sentence that they're never going to see the light of day again, we may all feel differently about what they do or don't do inside than if they were going to get out in a few years. Just like if we were the ones free on the outside, I can't imagine we would choose to be celibate forever in the same scenario, but as I constantly tell people, you never know what you would do unless you are in the same situation, so you can't judge.

I would definitely bet if research were done however, that women do engage in more sexual relationships in prison than their male counterparts. I would think that is because women do so more for the emotional connection. Men probably don't need that as much and are not seeking that. Imagine how many of these women are away from their children. Many of us our nurturers, and I am sure these women crave that as well as crave being nurtured by anyone. One thing however in a woman's prison that must be something to see, is that there must be some high drama! That is for sure!! The amount of hormones going crazy, sneaking around, jealousy, time of the month issues. I cannot imagine!

And by the way, someone made a comment about no STD's between women? That is false. Women can spread STDs. STDs are spread by bodily fluids. They are not just spread by ejaculating into someone.

At the end of the day, like I said, whatever works for one may not work for all and if it works for you, more power to you. My biggest worry is getting my husband out in one piece (fortunately he's just going to a camp), and what kind of long-term emotional impact it will have on him or what kind of bad changes there may be when he comes out. He's older, so to some degree this is the one time I hope the "leopard doesn't change their spots" statement holds true!
I agree!!!! I just want my husband home.
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  #155  
Old 11-18-2017, 09:42 PM
KaylaPaige KaylaPaige is offline
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As a woman that was incarcerated... I know so many women that would go kiss their husbands at visitation and curl up in bed with a woman at night. So, you really have no idea what's going on inside. It's all about trust.

But to ever really say that you know... most people have no idea. I'm not even counting the sexual harassment by CO's and no, not everyone seeks that out. It happens far more than you would think.

Also, the STD rate is astronomical in prison... but then again, you have a lot of people getting prison tattoos too... which is hazardous to your health.

My two cents, people really have no idea what happens in prison, and most women leave those relationships behind when they hit the gates. Guess what, their men never know.
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  #156  
Old 11-18-2017, 10:31 PM
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As a woman that was incarcerated... I know so many women that would go kiss their husbands at visitation and curl up in bed with a woman at night. So, you really have no idea what's going on inside. It's all about trust.

But to ever really say that you know... most people have no idea. I'm not even counting the sexual harassment by CO's and no, not everyone seeks that out. It happens far more than you would think.

Also, the STD rate is astronomical in prison... but then again, you have a lot of people getting prison tattoos too... which is hazardous to your health.

My two cents, people really have no idea what happens in prison, and most women leave those relationships behind when they hit the gates. Guess what, their men never know.
I totally believe you. I actually wouldn't be surprised if there are actually a lot of male/male relationships that men leave behind the second they hit the gates as well that are never discussed either. The only people that really know what goes on in prison, are the people inside. Those "secrets" stay with those people. How can any of us really know unless we've been there? And I don't think there are too many of us that would want to trade places either. You do what you need to do to survive and get through each day. Totally different than us on the outside, and I know my husband will have it much easier than most people on this site by being at a camp, but I am planning to do the same thing, whatever I can to survive and get through him being away, one day at a time. I'm not planning to have any relationships with women or men for that matter, but my kids are my priority and making sure they're safe and sound and protected are what is most important and that we get through each day as best as we can!
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  #157  
Old Yesterday, 03:55 PM
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I have generally avoided this thread since it started a long time back. As a counter I thought about creating a thread in the PTO lounge section along the lines if a plane carrying your loved one crashed in the Andes would you be ok if they had to do the whole "Alive" thing? For the record, I would have no problem with AM around steak knives after that.

Sex and same sex relationships happen in women's prisons. AM was pretty upfront with me about the subject. We talked about it at length. Whether or not they make the time go easier is not for me to say. People have a choice about how they are going to do their time. No matter what people say about Vegas/Prison Rules, secrets have a tendency to come out and hurt those you say you love.

That said, there was never a visitation where I needed more than my fingers to count the husbands/boyfriends in a room. They were like the elusive endangered species in an old Mutual of Omaha Wild Kingdom episode. Not Tasmanian Tiger rare, but rare.

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  #158  
Old Yesterday, 06:14 PM
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I have generally avoided this thread since it started a long time back. As a counter I thought about creating a thread in the PTO lounge section along the lines if a plane carrying your loved one crashed in the Andes would you be ok if they had to do the whole "Alive" thing? For the record, I would have no problem with AM around steak knives after that.

Sex and same sex relationships happen in women's prisons. AM was pretty upfront with me about the subject. We talked about it at length. Whether or not they make the time go easier is not for me to say. People have a choice about how they are going to do their time. No matter what people say about Vegas/Prison Rules, secrets have a tendency to come out and hurt those you say you love.

That said, there was never a visitation where I needed more than my fingers to count the husbands/boyfriends in a room. They were like the elusive endangered species in an old Mutual of Omaha Wild Kingdom episode. Not Tasmanian Tiger rare, but rare.
Are you saying that over time, that male just stop visiting their spouses/LOs?

I am sure a lot of stuff happens inside, but if someone's LO is locked up for 10 years, wouldn't you think the tempation for the one on the outside is just as great if not greater for them to do have an outside relationship as well? The difference might be the same sex issue? Like your Alive example, when it's your only option, what choices do they have, if they want the physical intimacy.

As I am watching the Patriots game, it reminds me of Aaron Rodriguez. Who would have ever thought that even he had a boyfriend in prison, only revealed when he committed suicide. So, people will do what they have to do to survive, get by, or just whatever it is they need to do to get through each day. I always say and I said it previously in this thread, none of us know what we would do and shouldn't just one another, until and unless we are in that same situation. We can all say, no way, but really, do we ever know?
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Old Yesterday, 08:41 PM
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Are you saying that over time, that male just stop visiting their spouses/LOs?
I only had a year in the visiting rooom, by no means enough time to draw that kind of conclusion, but AM told me that most around her were on their own before they reached prison.

I saw two older couples regularly, and I came to recognize a few other guys over several months time, but most of the men were fathers or grandfathers. Who knows maybe the other visiting day was the one where all the guys showed up, and I was always in the women and children group. I also avoided Thanksgiving and Christmas Day because they were zoos and AM preferred not go through that as well.
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Old Yesterday, 09:23 PM
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I can't visit my husband this year at Christmas, but I'll have to ask him to pay attention to see if he will want me to come next year or if it is too much of a zoo or not. He will be coming down the home stretch at that point.

Our anniversary will be the day after Thanksgiving next year, so I will probably want to visit that weekend, although it's 5 straight days of visiting, so ya probably will be a zoo!
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Old Yesterday, 11:15 PM
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As a woman that was incarcerated... I know so many women that would go kiss their husbands at visitation and curl up in bed with a woman at night. So, you really have no idea what's going on inside. It's all about trust.

But to ever really say that you know... most people have no idea. I'm not even counting the sexual harassment by CO's and no, not everyone seeks that out. It happens far more than you would think.

Also, the STD rate is astronomical in prison... but then again, you have a lot of people getting prison tattoos too... which is hazardous to your health.

My two cents, people really have no idea what happens in prison, and most women leave those relationships behind when they hit the gates. Guess what, their men never know.
Dee and I maintained pretty open communication, so in my case I knew I was one of those men that would see his lady at visitation then have her go back to a woman she was housed with at times. I had, essentially, two rules.
1.) If it happened I wanted her to be open with me about it and 2.) I didn't need to know details, but I did need to understand, honestly, what if any impact it had on our relationship.

She followed those rules. And it ultimately strengthened our relationships becaouse of part 2: she, at one point, found herself questioning a lot of things about herself because one of the relationships did start to turn serious. At that point I backed off the "boyfriend" role and took an "emotionally supportive" role (not that the relationship ended but the manner which I focused on it changed.) Ultimately, as I said, it strengthened our relationship....Dee doesn't trust easily, she went through a good portion of her time in prison afraid that I was going to leave eventually and how I handled that situation ultimately erased that fear.

I will never know about everything that went on inside....Dee has been very open about her experience, but some things I don't ask about. She went through enough. I don't need to be rehashing trauma any more than necessary. But I do know enough to have a decent idea of what went on in there (and that is part of why I am cautious about what questions I ask or what topics I bring up.....because some of the ones she's brought up on her own have been painful enough.)

I do know that a good number of men who are in relationships with the women don't know what goes on, or they may have an idea that things happen in prison between the women but not suspect that the specific woman they are with has relationships with other women. Dee opened up about a lot of that stuff. I knew some of the men were, at minimum, in situations where the woman was considering attempting a relationship with them post-release but not as committed to it as they voiced, and other men were out-and-out being taken advantage of. There were only a couple of situations where Dee confirmed that what I was seeing was a genuine relationship where the women were either 100% faithful or were honest with their significant other about what they were doing but were otherwise committed (I know some people would argue that this isn't a sign of commitment, and that's fine....I've learned a lot from people with different perspectives on this topic. My point here is from my perspective. Respectfully...some people would disagree with that perspective, and that's okay.)

I appreciate you sharing some of what you experienced.....we don't have a ton of men on this site so getting some perspective from the women, especially the women who have been locked up, is very valuable as it does help fill in some gaps. I do believe that the men who come here are incredibly dedicated to their women and I know that they appreciate the additional input as well.

-E
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  #162  
Old Yesterday, 11:42 PM
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Very well said and I think you nailed it when you said you communicate open and honestly. It's not that she is telling you everything, and it's not that you're pushing. But, she is at least communicating, she met your expectations, and that is what matters the most. I have to hand it to you! She should know how lucky she is to have someone like you.

I'm not worried my husband is going to have any kind of affair inside, emotional or physical, but I am worried about the emotional toll the whole thing will have on him. A lot of inmates probably need therapy when they get out, just to deal with what happened to them when they were in! Different from the therapy they got when they were in!!
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  #163  
Old Yesterday, 11:52 PM
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Are you saying that over time, that male just stop visiting their spouses/LOs?

I am sure a lot of stuff happens inside, but if someone's LO is locked up for 10 years, wouldn't you think the tempation for the one on the outside is just as great if not greater for them to do have an outside relationship as well? The difference might be the same sex issue? Like your Alive example, when it's your only option, what choices do they have, if they want the physical intimacy.

As I am watching the Patriots game, it reminds me of Aaron Rodriguez. Who would have ever thought that even he had a boyfriend in prison, only revealed when he committed suicide. So, people will do what they have to do to survive, get by, or just whatever it is they need to do to get through each day. I always say and I said it previously in this thread, none of us know what we would do and shouldn't just one another, until and unless we are in that same situation. We can all say, no way, but really, do we ever know?
Not to nitpick, but in case anyone's confused, the player in question is Aaron Hernandez, not Rodriguez. (Don't worry, names get confused and your point was otherwise a really good one, just wanted to make sure people didn't think there was a second Patriot with the name Aaron who went to prison and killed themselves....)

Beyond that.....I will say that a lot of women lose their relationships in there. If not once they get to prison then before. There's apparently a statistic...I don't know if it's a hypothetical someone came up with based on their observation or if it was scientifically researched, but in my own experience there's a lot of truth to it....not counting children (only adults) the visiting room at a mens prison is 80% women and 20% men...and the visiting room at a womens prison is 80% women and 20% men. I never counted, but visually I'd say that it is usually 20-30% men visiting when I've visited, and of those at least half were NOT boyfriends/husbands. By contrast, I've heard that most visitors in a mens' prison are spouses or girlfriends (the remainder are usually mothers or close family.) The way Dee has explained it to me it's pretty much expected that if you're in a relationship when you get arrested that you won't be by the time you're released and that they usually end quickly. A lot of men don't have the same level of loyalty, don't have patience. I could hypothesize as to why all day long but honestly I think it comes down to a lack of patience. They didn't sign up for this, so to speak. Most men that I've come across in there either responded to pen pal ads or were otherwise introduced to their women LO's AFTER incarceration. I do think that "knowing you're getting into a relationship with someone who's incarcerated and being okay with it" is why a lot of these MWI-type relationships work as far as the men are concerned. I don't know proportions, but Dee said most of the women who were in relationships were either 1.) in relationships with women who they were housed with, 2.) in secret relationships with staff members (keep in mind that, at least at some prisons, not everyone on prison staff is a correctional officer. In some cases they are free-world workers contracted to jobs that happen to be on prison grounds and oftentimes there are inmate workers who work along side them. I've been aware of several relationships like this....out of respect to those inmates I have ALWAYS kept my mouth shut.) 3.) With men who either found them on a Pen Pal site or people that they knew pre-prison who they weren't in a relationship with before who decided to seek them out and check up on them who decided to be with them afterward.

By no means is this scientific beyond whatever scientific abilities my mind may have. LOL! I did major in Sociology so I do try to take a scientific approach to things like this sometimes. But hopefully this provides some additional insight with the women. I don't have anywhere near as much insight into the men. I do have a cousin who's spent about 6 years of his life in prison and it's sad because he's a good dude but it has warped his perspectives on life a bit (his reason for going to prison: 18 years old, drank, was staying the night at a friend's house, a buddy frantically begged him to drive him somewhere at 3 in the morning, he stupidly decided to do it, they got in a crash and he watched his buddy die. His BAC? Something like .05, legal for 21+ but a DUI for an 18 year old, so he did time for DUI/Manslaughter.) I had a conversation one time with him and he said "I don't know who does what, that's their business, but I didn't do any of that gay (expletive.)" So I didn't really get much insight about male prisons beyond his immediate experience. Too small a sample size....
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Very well said and I think you nailed it when you said you communicate open and honestly. It's not that she is telling you everything, and it's not that you're pushing. But, she is at least communicating, she met your expectations, and that is what matters the most. I have to hand it to you! She should know how lucky she is to have someone like you.

I'm not worried my husband is going to have any kind of affair inside, emotional or physical, but I am worried about the emotional toll the whole thing will have on him. A lot of inmates probably need therapy when they get out, just to deal with what happened to them when they were in! Different from the therapy they got when they were in!!
Oh, I agree, there's a lot of adjustment issues that come both with being in prison and with coming out. Dee's been out a little over 11 months. Fortunately because she was already in a mental health program in prison, part of her requirement post-prison has been to see a therapist connected to her parole office. Once she's off parole they will connect her with mental health services as necessary so she can continue to receive the support. But I've seen her go through a lot of different changes and mindsets. I'm happy to report she is, on the whole, doing well, although coping with outside life does come with its issues. Rebuilding a bond with her children has been a challenge....fortunately they are giving her opportunities to do so, but her daughters in particular are very hurt (her son has less of a memory of her not either getting in trouble or being out here in the free world so he seems to harvest less anger and has been an absolute sweetheart to her.....total mama's boy, and I'm glad because I know how good that makes her feel.) That pain doesn't go away, the pain she feels for letting them down heals slowly, and of course when they get mad at her she takes it VERY personally, so those are the hardest days.

I think that also is a contributing factor, btw, to why women tend to develop romantic and emotional attachments with other women there. It's part of the coping mechanism, and it's part of why I decided to set parameters for our relationship and her possible relationships with women that I did. Because I knew that she needed more emotional support than I could give her by writing letters, visiting when I could/was allowed (long story,) and talking to her 15-30 minutes a day (IF she could get on the phone.)

The thing that I do think needs to be understood about prison sexuality, and this effects both men and women, is that when they find themselves feeling something for a member of the same sex after living a life that had been heterosexual pre-prison, is that it probably is very confusing for them in most cases. I know in Dee's case it made her question a LOT of things about herself. Being able to support her, let her talk things out, assure her that what she was experiencing wasn't "weird" and was so common that there's a phenomenon and definition attributed to people who engage in homosexual activity in prison but not outside of prison and that it actually does not make one homosexual outside of their "situational sexuality," all kind of served to not feel as weird about it. She told me that me accepting her and showing love even in that situation was a huge influence on her getting through the time and our relationship working....so trust me when I say...she gets it.

Of course it also goes without saying that issues beyond sexuality and sexual orientation make for some good therapy fodder both in and out of prison....

-E
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Originally Posted by missingdee View Post
Not to nitpick, but in case anyone's confused, the player in question is Aaron Hernandez, not Rodriguez. (Don't worry, names get confused and your point was otherwise a really good one, just wanted to make sure people didn't think there was a second Patriot with the name Aaron who went to prison and killed themselves....)

Beyond that.....I will say that a lot of women lose their relationships in there. If not once they get to prison then before. There's apparently a statistic...I don't know if it's a hypothetical someone came up with based on their observation or if it was scientifically researched, but in my own experience there's a lot of truth to it....not counting children (only adults) the visiting room at a mens prison is 80% women and 20% men...and the visiting room at a womens prison is 80% women and 20% men. I never counted, but visually I'd say that it is usually 20-30% men visiting when I've visited, and of those at least half were NOT boyfriends/husbands. By contrast, I've heard that most visitors in a mens' prison are spouses or girlfriends (the remainder are usually mothers or close family.) The way Dee has explained it to me it's pretty much expected that if you're in a relationship when you get arrested that you won't be by the time you're released and that they usually end quickly. A lot of men don't have the same level of loyalty, don't have patience. I could hypothesize as to why all day long but honestly I think it comes down to a lack of patience. They didn't sign up for this, so to speak. Most men that I've come across in there either responded to pen pal ads or were otherwise introduced to their women LO's AFTER incarceration. I do think that "knowing you're getting into a relationship with someone who's incarcerated and being okay with it" is why a lot of these MWI-type relationships work as far as the men are concerned. I don't know proportions, but Dee said most of the women who were in relationships were either 1.) in relationships with women who they were housed with, 2.) in secret relationships with staff members (keep in mind that, at least at some prisons, not everyone on prison staff is a correctional officer. In some cases they are free-world workers contracted to jobs that happen to be on prison grounds and oftentimes there are inmate workers who work along side them. I've been aware of several relationships like this....out of respect to those inmates I have ALWAYS kept my mouth shut.) 3.) With men who either found them on a Pen Pal site or people that they knew pre-prison who they weren't in a relationship with before who decided to seek them out and check up on them who decided to be with them afterward.

By no means is this scientific beyond whatever scientific abilities my mind may have. LOL! I did major in Sociology so I do try to take a scientific approach to things like this sometimes. But hopefully this provides some additional insight with the women. I don't have anywhere near as much insight into the men. I do have a cousin who's spent about 6 years of his life in prison and it's sad because he's a good dude but it has warped his perspectives on life a bit (his reason for going to prison: 18 years old, drank, was staying the night at a friend's house, a buddy frantically begged him to drive him somewhere at 3 in the morning, he stupidly decided to do it, they got in a crash and he watched his buddy die. His BAC? Something like .05, legal for 21+ but a DUI for an 18 year old, so he did time for DUI/Manslaughter.) I had a conversation one time with him and he said "I don't know who does what, that's their business, but I didn't do any of that gay (expletive.)" So I didn't really get much insight about male prisons beyond his immediate experience. Too small a sample size....
Oops, I'm an idiot! Yes, I know better than that and it is Aaron Hernandez. Wow not sure what I was thinking!

Ahh, now the truth comes out as to why you're much more understanding/tolerant of the whole situation, and even why you're able to handle it better than most. Your background in sociology. You understand people and behaviors probably a lot better than most and are even probably more intuitive than most people.

As for why the men don't stick around and the women do, I think you probably said it, when you mentioned the word loyalty. I'm definitely not trying to bash anyone at all, but women do just tend to be more loyal than men. Again, for the same reason they seek the relationships in prison, they need/crave the emotional connection. Men don't need it as much. Women are the nurturers. Also, and this again is not meant to sound sexist, but many men on the outside, need women to take care of them. I don't mean sexually but I mean on a daily basis for their daily needs. There are not too many men who can take care of themselves. So, to some degree they just don't want to be alone or loyal to a woman in prison when that also means they have to take care of themselves, feed themselves, clean up after themselves, shop for themselves, etc. We see it all the time in society. A woman passes away, they were totally devoted to one another, and bam the man has a new girlfriend within a few months. Again, not all men, but I would bet if research were done on this, it would be the case that the majority of men fall into this category.

So for men, it probably becomes a hassle to visit, they can easily meet a woman on the outside. Don't want the bother, and want someone to take care of them, cleaning, cooking, traveling with them, etc.

Sad but probably true.
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