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  #26  
Old 01-11-2019, 07:15 PM
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I admire your ability to be so vulnerable on here, that shows true strength of character. Forgiveness is personal to you. I understand that you are conflicted due to the fact that there are no mitigating circumstances, because in those situations it’s easy to rationalise how and why a crime happened. It’s often clear as day as to how a situation occurred. Disappointment comes directly from expectations. When you expect a person to behave a certain way and uphold certain morales, and they don’t, this creates disappointment. Humans are inherently flawed, we all make mistakes. Constantly. A favourite saying of mine “Expectation is the mother of all frustration”. Expectation is the silent killer in all relationships. Now it’s ok to have boundaries, we don’t just have to tolerate partners behaving like absolute fuck wits. It’s up to you to decide what your boundaries are, what you can accept and what is a deal breaker. It sounds like you have accepted what has happened and it’s not a deal breaker for you. My advice? Stop looking back. Stop focusing on his crime. It happened, unfortunately, nothing you or he can do will change that. Focus on the future and moving forward, how you 2 can grow from this. Time is a great healer, just try not to focus too much on the negative. Our minds are our greatest enemies at times.

Re: family visits. Again, try not to focus on the negative. Is it ideal? No. Does this mean you won’t enjoy it? Also no. It’s an option for you guys to spend time together, away from prying eyes of prison staff. It can only be good for your relationship. I’m willing to bet once he gets a bonk out of the way, the incessant sex talk will stop. Poor guy just needs to get laid, and so do you lady! Unfortunately, woman have been sexually oppressed for en eternity. Screw anyone who makes you feel like you shouldn’t desire it, or that desiring it is a negative thing. Sex is amazing! Enjoy yourself
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  #27  
Old 01-12-2019, 04:45 AM
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Y
How do you forgive some one then ? Good books ? I ordered Love & Respect . .

I have a lot that are religiously - based but that strongly deters me from compromise on the „ his needs ” part of the problem. I hate that it is „ one or the other . ”
Great advice above from Kiwi

I would also say that if you feel overwhelmed and not able move on from the resentment, it might be a good idea to speak to a therapist. They can offer you a fresh perspective and also give you tools for how to 'train your brain' so to speak, show you how not to let your beliefs & emotions control you. I am in an entirely different situation compared to you; I am MWI and never lived with my guy....but he did get released a year and a half ago and then was arrested again - so in essence he delayed our future together by messing up and I am doing a second bid with him. This obviously upset and angered me when it all happened...and before I made my decision to stay with him of course I considered leaving - but when I made the decision to stay, I told myself it would have to be "onwards, not backwards" - meaning, any resentment I had about what happened would need to be left behind if I was going to stay. I'm pretty hardline when it comes to stuff like this, so it hasn't been easy always...but my approach was that either I forgive him and really mean it, or if it seems I am unable to forgive then I should leave. I'm not perfect so of course on a bad day the resentment might try and pop its ugly head up....but I try to not express it to him too much because I don't think it's constructive to be throwing it in his face, knowing how much he already beats himself up about it and is very aware of how he fucked things up. Luckily he also understands my position so we've been able to navigate through the challenging moments also. I am hoping that you guys will be able to do the same

Another great saying: Don't look back, you're not going that way
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  #28  
Old 01-12-2019, 05:12 AM
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Thank you for the „ calming ” message, KiwiPP.

Yes, it is true, I must look forward even after this, the deportation situation begins.

A big fear is that I will stand by him in prison and end up living some where I do not want to be only for him to fall out of love and leave me. I do not expect him to stay cause he „ owes me ”for my effort, which to me, is my duty. But rather, my loyalty will not mean so much, and I lose in the end, cause he ‘ ll still have the „ criminal attitude.”

But as you say . . . do not expect some one to act a certain way. Let it unfold as it should.

I had to look up „ bonk ” and the sentence gave me a laugh ! He he he he ....

He calls me repressed / suppressed . Not as an insult, but observation. Too much information time . . . but I still feel bad we had pre - martial sex. Cause you know, here I am, the one who was supposed to „ know better.”

So if I do things he asks now, he might not respect me, as he did. It makes no sense cause he asks for it. Complete cognitive dissonance on my part.

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Another great saying: Don't look back, you're not going that way
I love it! Simple but true. And thank you for sharing your personal example.
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  #29  
Old 01-12-2019, 07:47 AM
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Honey, look closely at that history of yours, and decide just what about your history of repression was actually necessary to live in the world. For some reason, it's something you hold very tight to, as if it were more important than almost anything else in your life. And yet, it's an artificial construct, created mostly by men to keep women subject to their rules. They certainly don't hold to it for themselves!(It's taught by women, certainly, just as some Arab women hold their daughters down for genital mutilation.)

What about sex is automatically bad, unhealthy, dirty, debased? Other than the ideas in your head, which you didn't ask for.

I'm sorry you're so horribly torn, really sorry, but in this case, forward means jettisoning some of this medieval thinking.
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  #30  
Old 01-12-2019, 02:35 PM
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I have thought about this all day, nimuay. There is nothing to say cause there is no rebuttal. All is truth. They are artificial constructs created by flawed men who can never know truth of a world we’ve yet to experience, if it is there.

Why does it feel physically uneasy to say that ? I have apostate goosebumps !!!

Obviously if nothing changes, we are going to be 2 unhappy people, for a long time. He will be unhappy w a lack of his form of needed affection. I will be unhappy cause it will be a source of contention between us. And, also, well, it is unhappy to try to live according to a created idea of perfection . . which is unattainable . .

It comes down to respect I guess. I was taught that a man would not expect of his wife what he would of a common harlot. Love a wife as oneself, sort of thing. So . . . I think, @ the back of my mind, he disrespects me and does not care so much for my soul, to have it in peril, when he asks for these things [ hyper - sexual communication, stressing to do the PFV on imperfect settings. ]

But like you say, artificial constructs stuck in the medieval mindset. My husband is „ normal ” and I have to get with it . . No wonder they say modernity leads to crisis !

Although I may seem like a zealous frigid bitch, I really do not want to fight any more w him. It’s tiring for nothing.
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Old 01-12-2019, 02:52 PM
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Whoever told you a man shouldn’t or wouldn’t want to bonk the crap out of his wife as opposed to a ‘common harlot’ is plain wrong!! :P Sex is WAY BETTER with someone you love! And a man wanting sex from his wife does not equate to him not respecting you, not at all. Trust me when I say this, men don’t think that deeply about sex. He married you, that tells you right there he respects you implicitly as opposed to other woman he may have only wanted sex from. Wanting to constantly bonk ya shows he’s crazy about you, it’s a good thing!

A good friend of mine has a great perspective on it:

“ Sex is the only thing that is unique to that relationship/marriage, because you can laugh play eat talk etc to anyone else in your life, but sex is exclusive to your relationship.”

It’s a special intimate act that only you and your husband share, that’s pretty damn special.

Go and get that ‘vitamin D’ girl
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  #32  
Old 01-12-2019, 03:25 PM
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Whoever told you a man shouldn’t or wouldn’t want to bonk the crap out of his wife as opposed to a ‘common harlot’ is plain wrong!! :P Sex is WAY BETTER with someone you love! And a man wanting sex from his wife does not equate to him not respecting you, not at all. Trust me when I say this, men don’t think that deeply about sex. He married you, that tells you right there he respects you implicitly as opposed to other woman he may have only wanted sex from. Wanting to constantly bonk ya shows he’s crazy about you, it’s a good thing!

A good friend of mine has a great perspective on it:

“ Sex is the only thing that is unique to that relationship/marriage, because you can laugh play eat talk etc to anyone else in your life, but sex is exclusive to your relationship.”

It’s a special intimate act that only you and your husband share, that’s pretty damn special.

Go and get that ‘vitamin D’ girl
You're 100% right, but I laughed my ass off at your candidness.

Look there is nothing wrong with you husband desiring you and craving you. A good man wants you to have as much pleasure as he does. It makes it even better for them.

Another old world philosophy is the man who cannot satisfy his women is not a man. Hence the term the cuckolded husband when a women has an affair. Men could because of their needs, but he was less of a man if she stepped out.

They are all constructs. Technically, nothing is real unless you believe it. It is a matter of perception. The ideas of right and wrong have become ambiguous to me over the last few years.

Someone my belief systems that I have always believed in, but could not Express because they were not acceptable in my faith, would have me hanging from a tree a 300 years ago.

I wanted to be a nun at one point in my life. Probably around 13 or 14. Sexual repression, thinking it was gross etc. That changed close to a decade later or 2 later. I studied and read about religions and stuff to find what was really real to me.

My beliefs I marriage were always different after witnessing a terrible divorce. I didn't believe in partner ship. Married a man who felt the same. Now I'm with someone who believes more in Male head of the household in some ways, but sharing everything in regard to responsibilities. We discuss balance in that because I got used to doing everything. I liked being in control. With my ex everything was I. Now I say we a hell of a lot more. I joke he can be the head, but I'm the neck. We laugh. We keenly are aware of the others strengths and weaknesses now and use that to our benefit.

At the end of the day, he is who he is and you are who you are. You get to learn so much more about yourselves through this experience. Acceptance first, then comes growth esp when weaker areas become highlighted.

Dont ever be afraid to be vulnerable and say how you feel. It doesnt have to be an attack. It can be, it scares me. In some ways it feels dirty. Help me to see that it is not. The blame is removed from him and he wont feel attacked.

Phone sex took a while for me. I haven't written a dirty letter. I refuse to take pictures. He asks and jokes, but gets that i dont feel comfort. I tell him I'm working on the letter. I get the yeah yeah you have been saying that for 2 years. He laughs. One out of 3 ain't bad.
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  #33  
Old 01-12-2019, 04:45 PM
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I wanted to be a nun at one point in my life.
My problem.

It was a long - term endeavour, as in made up my mind [ „ felt called ” ] very early. From when I was mature enough, it got arranged for me to speak regularly to a nun, have an advisor, learn theology and then older, to spend extended periods at a monastery with the sisters I would hopefully want to join.

And so, that meant, I did not date at all. Boys would ask me out all the time and I had to say no. I got very far behind my peers in sexuality. In my part of Bosnia, there was no sex ed at all. You learned as you go.

And that was fine cause I was told the Theotokos is most perfect example of woman ; emulate her grace, self - sacrifice and humility. I was told I was on the „ angelic habit ” pathway of life. Sounded important .

Finally, it came to the point where I had to enter as a novice and my abbess preferred I take the apostolnik. That is how serious it got. But, after ~ 6 months, the abbess [ kindly . . ] told me, after discussion, to reconsider my vocation. I had to leave and what was left to do ? Go to university . . . go to grad school . . be normal .

But I was in over my head dating. I had never done any thing sexual, never seen pornography, never sexted.

Got tangled up w much older man on parole : came here to this site : took care of him like a mom : he had no intention to marry me : learned nothing from him.

My husband married me cause I was „ good ” and thought, like I said, push me from this bubble.

His „ normal talk ” and PFV was so overwhelming. As well as my germ fear and privacy !!

I really screwed up myself to live in modernity. The future is modern . . not old . .

It is really good to hear frank, crass and candid talk, honestly. Cause it shows . . . how do you say . . some real sense of self - comfort women have.

I like the approach of not putting blame on him. I don’t want to make him feel bad when he is being normal . . . and I’ve only made him feel bad .

A big ura !!!!! for most uncomfortable post . .

Thank you both and ty KiwiPP, you give a laugh when one is needed!
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  #34  
Old 01-12-2019, 04:59 PM
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Glad I could put a smile on your face
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Old 01-12-2019, 06:41 PM
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My problem.

It was a long - term endeavour, as in made up my mind [ „ felt called ” ] very early. From when I was mature enough, it got arranged for me to speak regularly to a nun, have an advisor, learn theology and then older, to spend extended periods at a monastery with the sisters I would hopefully want to join.

And so, that meant, I did not date at all. Boys would ask me out all the time and I had to say no. I got very far behind my peers in sexuality. In my part of Bosnia, there was no sex ed at all. You learned as you go.

And that was fine cause I was told the Theotokos is most perfect example of woman ; emulate her grace, self - sacrifice and humility. I was told I was on the „ angelic habit ” pathway of life. Sounded important .

Finally, it came to the point where I had to enter as a novice and my abbess preferred I take the apostolnik. That is how serious it got. But, after ~ 6 months, the abbess [ kindly . . ] told me, after discussion, to reconsider my vocation. I had to leave and what was left to do ? Go to university . . . go to grad school . . be normal .

But I was in over my head dating. I had never done any thing sexual, never seen pornography, never sexted.

Got tangled up w much older man on parole : came here to this site : took care of him like a mom : he had no intention to marry me : learned nothing from him.

My husband married me cause I was „ good ” and thought, like I said, push me from this bubble.

His „ normal talk ” and PFV was so overwhelming. As well as my germ fear and privacy !!

I really screwed up myself to live in modernity. The future is modern . . not old . .

It is really good to hear frank, crass and candid talk, honestly. Cause it shows . . . how do you say . . some real sense of self - comfort women have.

I like the approach of not putting blame on him. I don’t want to make him feel bad when he is being normal . . . and I’ve only made him feel bad .

A big ura !!!!! for most uncomfortable post . .

Thank you both and ty KiwiPP, you give a laugh when one is needed!
Everything makes so much more sense now. Remember you're a beautiful soul! No fault, no blame on anyone. Just life and learning. Hugs and kisses to you! Relax a little. It is freeing.
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  #36  
Old 01-12-2019, 08:13 PM
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You are much too kind but thank you.

Looking back, I am glad it did not work out. I prefer secular education & employment. My mom needs me & I could not imagine her on her own. I would not have been able to move to a new country. I could not travel & see family overseas. Most importantly, I would not have been able to meet / marry my husband. I discovered I like shiny things too !!

But it is „ healing “ now that needs attention . . .

My husband said that it may have been an honourable choice but beauty is not meant to be hidden away. I laugh . . . like I say, he could charm a pearl from an oyster !!

Gonna do my application. Under „ special requests ”, I will see if they accept Lysol wipes . This is why we share. To see a different perspective. . TY to all.
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Old 01-12-2019, 08:49 PM
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A suggestion for you.....

Have you ever done any meditation? Have you done any other centering work? If not, I would suggest that you make a start on creating a calming routine for yourself. We all get twisted when we're violating what we've been taught are norms (at least those of us who aren't psychopaths). We need to be able to set ourselves into a calm, gentle place that allows us to regroup and open up.

You have plenty of time to work on it before your first PFV.

Then, whenever those intrusive thoughts about the 'wrongness' of sex and sexuality, you can go back to that place and reorganize your thoughts.
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Old 01-13-2019, 06:47 AM
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No, I have not done any meditation but, I have „ some ” [ as in very small ] experience w centering.

I saw a therapist for self - esteem „ why is my husband w me when I think I look like Shrek ”. She had a mini - centering exercise that when I had those thoughts to focus on a warmth of love, to feel better. Not very in depth.

My husband tried to teach me some ideas cause he was taught similar things in rukopashnii boi. As in to focus on the „ now ” and redirect bad thoughts into positive useful energy.

I did not listen cause I knew he had motives.

But thank you, I will definitely work on this. It is beneficial and simple. Easy to incorporate every day.
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Old Yesterday, 06:28 AM
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May I ask a question that is a little off topic from the original topic ??

Dirty letters . . . o.k., only words. Still do not think I am „ there ” yet cause it is like being lost @ sea. Phone sex remains out of the comfort zпое.

Photos are another story and I am going to come across as really rude here, but, this is not my intention.

I know mail room sees them and inmates sell them. They get traded / stolen. That is uncomfortable & why NOT to do them . But where does one get the gall ? The gusto ? This self - confidence ? to believe that you are „ all that ” to send these things prolifically ?!

Cause looking around the average population, and demographic studies / materials will show most of the population has average body types or overweight issues. Which is fine : if you have confidence to do that and your loved one genuinely appreciates your body, Godspeed !! All the power in the world ! We are all the apple to some one ‘s eye.

But I can deduce from a law of averages [ yes, a fallacy, I am aware ] that there are going to be lumps, bumps and sagging in many photos. Then again, there is much youth going on and ppl are really into gym these days.

But, I see all these posts w ppl saying, o they send a bikini pic, o they send a lingerie pic, o they send this pic with certain parts covered . . one cannot tell me that ALL these are „ perfect “ shots.

If they take copious shots for a few to make fashion magazines & campaigns, it is a hard mental bridge for me to cross to think all has gone so well with such rudimentary [ in comparison ] set - up.

Is it simply self - confidence and inflation of ego to think it is as good as one thinks ? Are those who send actually aware of issues and decide to look positively? They know what they are, are comfortable, don’t care ?

See, I believe that my husband can get his hands on some dirty magazines and have a solo party. Why does he need my help when that is the occupation of those girls ? • I know all is not what it seems there too. •

I was advised here once that it is more of the case that in a personal photo, it is more about the „ personal connection ” to the woman in it. That is what makes that sort of mail exciting. Dreams of unattainable versus facts of reality. You have to accept reality.

So what is the magic mind that does it ? Help me understand. Truly.

My husband has high standards [ ha ha funny for him behind bars ] and the thought of it is scary, at least to me. The mental critique. He had a relationship w a bikini / fitness model up until he left his country so it is not like I can „ fool him “ to say hot damn, look @ what I got ! His last ex is same body type / different job. I know his standards. Besides the matter, he knows what I look like, so why the need ?

I don’t understand boys, obviously ! !

He dropped a hint, again, last night, after I said I would „ think about” a letter. I am not ready for photos now. I told him, but if he is in there for his full sentence, who knows ??

Am I simply being much too critical ??
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Old Yesterday, 07:41 AM
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May I ask a question that is a little off topic from the original topic ??

Dirty letters . . . o.k., only words. Still do not think I am „ there ” yet cause it is like being lost @ sea. Phone sex remains out of the comfort zпое.

Photos are another story and I am going to come across as really rude here, but, this is not my intention.

I know mail room sees them and inmates sell them. They get traded / stolen. That is uncomfortable & why NOT to do them . But where does one get the gall ? The gusto ? This self - confidence ? to believe that you are „ all that ” to send these things prolifically ?!

Cause looking around the average population, and demographic studies / materials will show most of the population has average body types or overweight issues. Which is fine : if you have confidence to do that and your loved one genuinely appreciates your body, Godspeed !! All the power in the world ! We are all the apple to some one ‘s eye.

But I can deduce from a law of averages [ yes, a fallacy, I am aware ] that there are going to be lumps, bumps and sagging in many photos. Then again, there is much youth going on and ppl are really into gym these days.

But, I see all these posts w ppl saying, o they send a bikini pic, o they send a lingerie pic, o they send this pic with certain parts covered . . one cannot tell me that ALL these are „ perfect “ shots.

If they take copious shots for a few to make fashion magazines & campaigns, it is a hard mental bridge for me to cross to think all has gone so well with such rudimentary [ in comparison ] set - up.

Is it simply self - confidence and inflation of ego to think it is as good as one thinks ? Are those who send actually aware of issues and decide to look positively? They know what they are, are comfortable, don’t care ?

See, I believe that my husband can get his hands on some dirty magazines and have a solo party. Why does he need my help when that is the occupation of those girls ? • I know all is not what it seems there too. •

I was advised here once that it is more of the case that in a personal photo, it is more about the „ personal connection ” to the woman in it. That is what makes that sort of mail exciting. Dreams of unattainable versus facts of reality. You have to accept reality.

So what is the magic mind that does it ? Help me understand. Truly.

My husband has high standards [ ha ha funny for him behind bars ] and the thought of it is scary, at least to me. The mental critique. He had a relationship w a bikini / fitness model up until he left his country so it is not like I can „ fool him “ to say hot damn, look @ what I got ! His last ex is same body type / different job. I know his standards. Besides the matter, he knows what I look like, so why the need ?

I don’t understand boys, obviously ! !

He dropped a hint, again, last night, after I said I would „ think about” a letter. I am not ready for photos now. I told him, but if he is in there for his full sentence, who knows ??

Am I simply being much too critical ??
I'm too self conscious. He knows I'm not comfortable for photos. I'm losing weight and if I get daring maybe, but probably not.

If he goes to the program in the spring we will have limited phone contact. I may write those letters then. Sounds silly but I dont want him to think I'm not thinking of him and what I may be doing etc. He gets nervous.

Playing it by ear.

As for the phone I look forward to our biweekly "date" now. 2 years ago nope, not at all
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Thanks for your honesty on the whole thing. Some times it comes across, in the prison world and even outside, of those w a lot of self - belief. With filters etc these days, every one thinks they are some kind of starlet, and personally, not sure if I am too critical or they boastful.

So it is GREAT to hear the honesty and ways you plan to figure it out. It feels real.
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With filters etc these days, every one thinks they are some kind of starlet, and personally, not sure if I am too critical or they boastful.
I was not as confident as I am now when I was younger - I feel fine sending sexy pictures now, at 50, and I think I have been okay with how my body looks and feels for quite a while now. That does, however, in no way mean that I think I llook like a supermodel and/or that I use filters; I think some people simply are comfortable in their own skin (and with their sexuality) and the whole thing is not really that big of a deal. You are putting yourself under so much pressure, sweetheart; why would you feel you need to be "perfect" - we are all imperfect! When you are loved by your boyfriend/husband, you are the most beautiful creature in their eyes, that's what I believe.

Having said that, you should never do what you're not comfortable with...having read about your beliefs and background, where you come from....I think it's only natural that you're feeling uncomfortable. We're all different, that seems to be my mantra on PTO on several subjects, and also this one. It's okay to send sexy photos, to have phone sex, to write steamy sex letters....and it's also okay not to do it, if it's not your thing. Neither choice has nothing to do with your value as a woman and a human being
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Oh boy... it’s not about thinking we’re “all that”... but about how our partners make us feel. I’m not in a prison relationship but my boyfriend is s professional athlete and travels from April to October. He asks for sexy pictures all the time and I’m happy to send them. Even though HIS body is near perfection because that’s his job and MY body is... NOT that of a professional athlete, he still makes me feel like the most beautiful woman on the planet and his love and admiration gives me the confidence to send him pictures.
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That is the situation w my husband, at least, prior to incarceration.

Pro - fighter [ now former . . ] who got an offer to come overseas. That is partly how he got financial security & definitely how he got known in some circles. But it is also why he has the body of a Greek god . . and though he fought, does not have a squishy nose or cauliflower ears. He is a handsome guy.

So, he’s had women but his long - term Russian [ex - gf ], the one that was his support system, so to say, is a fitness / bikini model. Like I said, his ex is same body type. People associate him w that type. Heavy burden for the rat from BiH.

Happy photos from his IG acct are there to remind me. And I charge his phone from time to time to get contacts from his address book ... and he gets random messages from girls, still, cause they don ‘t know he’s an inmate now ...

One time we were watching television and there was this program about „ average “ [ they were still beautiful] girls out at a resort skiing in bikinis. He said, „ I miss Russia. I wish I never left.” I said o, ya, I understand . . more fun etc.

He goes on and on that women in [ both ] his home countries are so much better than any one here. He said literally „ you know I can do so much better than you.” I don’t argue over empirical fact, so I let it be but it is cemented in my mind. Yes, it was rude, but it was true. So I say he would rather see them than me, but he is stuck w me. While I could write a letter or do a phone call , I believe he would laugh . Yes I know he asks but . . desperation.

Oh yes, he says beautiful, beautiful, beautiful now cause he’s desperate & there is no one else around.

But thanks . . really . . I mean it, that these photos come from a man ‘s expressions to a woman influencing how she feels and not the way I perceived it. I think that is sweet after all. Thanks for the enlightenment.
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He said literally „ you know I can do so much better than you.” I don’t argue over empirical fact, so I let it be but it is cemented in my mind. Yes, it was rude, but it was true.
WHAT an earth?! Do you mean he actually said that to you?

Oh my goodness. I am truly sorry I think I shouldn't even post this right now but rather take a day to digest it and try to offer more constructive advice/comfort...but, I have to say, no wonder your self-esteem is in shatters and you don't want anything sexual, physically or photo-wise to do with him. Honestly, if a man ever said that to me I would be out the door so fast he couldn't finish his sentence (a spoken one, let alone prison related).

Darling....YOU could do so much better than him!!
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Yes, he actually said that.

And it is truth : physically, he can. I have seen it. So, yes, I do not feel compelled to do things like photos thinking it is a let down to him or he would laugh.

Perhaps all that is best of me is my heart and that is enough for him.

He has been very kind to me though, otherwise. He never said any thing like that again. Now he uses words like „ angelic ” and „ exotic .” But . . one always remembers the bad / traumatic words and then suspicious of the good.

But I am glad I asked this question cause I learned new perspectives, that are positive. I know ppl that are „ friends of friends “ that organise photo shoots for their IG and they don’t look the same in real life. I wrongly applied that rhetoric to the situation here.
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My love no one is better than you, different but not better. Would these bikini models be standing by him in these dark times while he is incarcerated? He has a strong beautiful intelligent wife and he is a fool if he can not see that.
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