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Colorado General Prison Talk, Introductions & Chit Chat Topics & Discussions relating to Prison & the Criminal Justice System in Colorado that do not fit into any other Colorado sub-forum category. Please feel free to also introduce yourself to other members in the state and talk about whatever topics come to mind that may not have anything to do with prison.

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Old 12-13-2018, 10:23 PM
Melancholyholly Melancholyholly is offline
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Default Fiancé in the hole: Is there such a thing as extenuating circumstances?

Hi, I am hoping someone can give me advice. My fiancé just called me from the hole. He has been doing so well in the last year, not one write up. But today a man who is very well known for bad antisocial acts and not getting along with anyone was moved onto his pod. He came out if his cell and threw faceces at my fiancé and it went all over him and his cell. My fiancé has severe OCD. He tried to ignore him and succeeded for 4 mins. The CO’s could see something was going on because the man was shouting at my fiancé but didn’t try to intervene. He kept coming back and then my fiancé lost his cool and fought him. He is 60 days into a 90 days programme that will allow him contact visits which he says we will lose, plus the chance of half way house. He asked me to speak to his case manager and get as much paperwork together as I can about his OCD. I don’t know what I can do? Will he just be charged with class one for fighting or is there such a thing as extenuating circumstances? Or does it not matter why he needed up fighting? He has tried so hard to avoid any trouble and this is just devastating.
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Old 12-14-2018, 07:02 AM
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I'm sorry for what happened. Since he is in a Colorado prison, what happens to him will be determined by the staff, and is impossible to predict. If anyone has a good excuse for fighting, your fiance does. I hope the staff is fair to him, and except for doing what he asked you to do, hold off on doing anything else on your own, let him decide.
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Old 12-14-2018, 08:27 AM
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Thank you. I have done what he asked and sent an email to constituent services with reference to his OCD and the extreme provocation he was under. I have asked them to forward it to the relevant staff at the prison. We knew this would happen eventually which was why we fought for residential treatment programme . He won’t even accept a food tray from a CO he saw sneeze on his hands last year... the trauma he is experiencing from having himself and his belonging covered in faeces is massive. I only hope they can see he was under extreme stress. He is so peaceful normally and goes out of his way to avoid confrontation.
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Old 12-14-2018, 07:04 PM
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An inmate doesnt have to have done anything wrong to be in the hole. If an incident happens both parties are normally put there while an investigation happens.There should be a hearing and he can state his case and what provoked him.
Hopefully there will be cctv of the incident.
The hearing officer will decide what the punishment will be if any. Good luck.
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Old 12-15-2018, 06:00 AM
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Yes the whole incident is on cctv so it will show that he did not retaliate for 4 minutes. My fiancé is convinced that no matter what his reasons they will punish him but I feel like the response I got from the wardens office was hopeful. She thanked me for my information and asked me to please understand that they are fully aware of the circumstances surrounding the incident, that investigations take time and for me to have patience and faith in their review process. I feel she could have just said ‘This is being investigated and will be decided in due course’ but she used words that I perceive to contain some comforting aspects? lol Maybe I am looking too much into it!!

My only other worry is his concern with being a rat! He was quite happy for me to tell his side and cite his OCD as a defence but he doesn’t feel he can do the same when questioned! I told him that is ridiculous, he isn’t randomly ratting on someone in the system he is just saying what actually happened to him! He said that’s not how prison works, the bad guys and the gang members will say he is a rat.

I am not in prison so I can’t say for sure but one thing I do know is that he is prone to paranoid thinking especially when he is in emotional distress. He has done 20 years, it’s a long time to lose ‘normal thinking’. We have been down the road of paranoia a few times and despite what he says about ‘knowing how these people operate’ I have always been proven right. (I don’t mean that in an arrogant I am right kind of way)
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Old 12-15-2018, 06:15 AM
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If he won't explain what happened, it will weaken/destroy his chances for a good outcome. Even so, he's the one who lives there, so it's his decision to make.
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Old 12-15-2018, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melancholyholly View Post
Yes the whole incident is on cctv so it will show that he did not retaliate for 4 minutes. My fiancé is convinced that no matter what his reasons they will punish him but I feel like the response I got from the wardens office was hopeful. She thanked me for my information and asked me to please understand that they are fully aware of the circumstances surrounding the incident, that investigations take time and for me to have patience and faith in their review process. I feel she could have just said ‘This is being investigated and will be decided in due course’ but she used words that I perceive to contain some comforting aspects? lol Maybe I am looking too much into it!!

My only other worry is his concern with being a rat! He was quite happy for me to tell his side and cite his OCD as a defence but he doesn’t feel he can do the same when questioned! I told him that is ridiculous, he isn’t randomly ratting on someone in the system he is just saying what actually happened to him! He said that’s not how prison works, the bad guys and the gang members will say he is a rat.

I am not in prison so I can’t say for sure but one thing I do know is that he is prone to paranoid thinking especially when he is in emotional distress. He has done 20 years, it’s a long time to lose ‘normal thinking’. We have been down the road of paranoia a few times and despite what he says about ‘knowing how these people operate’ I have always been proven right. (I don’t mean that in an arrogant I am right kind of way)
Iunfortunately, he is probably right. He will have a hearing and most of the time the guy's just go with it. They don't go into a full explanation especially when there is another inmate involved.CDOC sucks unfortunately. it was nice of the warden to respond but I wouldn't trust a word she says. You will just have to wait for the results of the hearing. If he has been down for 20 years, he knows the system and knows what he is facing. Good luck to you guys!
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Old 12-15-2018, 11:03 AM
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I think he is right too, there is a culture in prison that it can be difficult for us out here to understand ,but he has to live there we dont so its easy for us to offer solutions that would perhaps not bring good results for him and how he is percieved. Hopefully the cctv will be enough without having to go into too much detail about who was to blame.
However the fact he took 4 minutes to respond could be percieved that as him having had time to think before he reacted rather than an immediate reaction to provocation.

Its up to him what he states at the hearing and what will be will be.Hopefully it will be a good outcome.
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Old 12-15-2018, 11:57 AM
Melancholyholly Melancholyholly is offline
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Hopefully it will be ok. It wasn’t the incident, a 4 minute gap and then he reacted. The man was walking away then coming back with more throughout those 4 minutes, shouting the whole time and touching things with his faeces covered hands until my fiancé finally lost his cool and couldn’t ignore it any longer. He tried really hard to ignore him, because he knew fighting back could lose him privileges. He said it felt like temporary insanity, a switch just went in his brain and he forgot all the reasons why he wasn’t reacting.
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Old 12-15-2018, 02:07 PM
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I find it very interesting that a man was throwing shit around in front of guards and no one reacted for four minutes. The video should be enlightening as far as that particular suspension of reality goes.
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Old 12-15-2018, 02:20 PM
Melancholyholly Melancholyholly is offline
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They are never in with the inmates, they are behind their glass. But my guy says he looked straight at them watching. It’s a really hard thought that there could ever be people in a position of authority that would either ignore a problem or worse gain amusement from it. But we know it happens. But being charitable maybe he was mistaken and they hadn’t noticed? Hmmm. I did say in my first draft that they could have prevented it escalating if they had intervened. But then I thought I sounded confrontational so I removed it. The cctv will show them what they need to know without me pointing out the obvious!
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