Okay Guys,

I find this very interesting that no one has posted anything about Creatine and about Inmates using this Stuff.

My son was having Grand mal Seizures and we were able to narrow it down to CREATINE!

As a mother I should have known better than to order him something without researching it first on the internet!

This STUFF IS SERIOUS!

Some may not have any side effects but some do, like my son!

I thought maybe he inherited the seizures from his Dad who had been having Grand Mal Seizures and it started in Prison. When I asked his Dad if he was taking CREATINE he said yes and that it wasn't Creatine that caused his seizures! CRAP! He thought it was something the guards put in his food! He said many people in Prison had Grand Mal Seizures! DUH! Maybe it was because those who were taking CREATINE where the ones who had the Seizures!

I will try and find a few articles that I have read in the past and post to this Thread!

If you loved on is taking CREATINE, please add your point of view on this Subject!

Love
Kathy

Consumer Review: My Husband Nearly Died From Intense Seizures While Taking Creatine.

It is interesting to note that the general public (until recently, me included) believes all health supplement problems are made public--they aren't. Most are not publicized until someone of public importance is adversely affected. Creatine is responsible for causing seizures. Not little ones; ones that are classed as tonic-clonic grand mals that can pop joints, compress vertebrae and possibly even break bones. Did any one read anything of the sort? If you contacted the FDA website on adverse events, you would have. Is this public? Yes because we have access to it. It is news though that is not "cost effective" enough to make it REAL public because, as I mentioned before, no one of public importance has been harmed yet and the creatine business is booming.
As educated people, my husband and I did the responsible thing--we waited three years once creatine came out to "see" what problems may occur. We searched the web, and it honestly never occurred to us to check the FDA website since we believed naively that we'd have surely read or heard something on the news by now. We learned about the wrestlers and that creatine was not believed to be the source of the deaths. We read magazines and advertisements, asked medical people who didn't know of any severe side effects (until this past month regarding kidneys).

It wasn't until my husband, in his early thirties in great condition with no vises by way of drugs, alcohol was admitted to hospital in a severe, violent seizure that we learned more potent TRUTHS about creatine supplementation. The end result is a "general public" athlete who could have died. He stopped breathing for two minutes or so, and compressed vertebrae in his back during severe seizures that lasted from three to six minutes followed by about an hour of fighting and with hours of confusion that followed. During the course of a week with three seizures in total, he dislocated both shoulders, breaking the tip of his humorous during one seizure. Poison control was called and! we learned for the first time about creatine and seizures.

I've since been searching for answers, a bit more smartly; this is how I got to your website. Did you read about this event or any other related? Was it on the news? My husband is not famous, so you probably didn't. And painfully, we have come to the realization that doctors are not informed either, nor do they seem to care to be. I have had to do so much pushing to get this event recorded and recognized by doctors it scares me--I'm just a consumer, not medically trained. All I can do is urge to think carefully and be informed that way IF something does happen you can get the RIGHT help.

When making choices about supplements keep in mind that adverse events only affect a few people perfectly as expected, most people slightly and with livable side effects, but some of us--we NEVER expect to be THE statistic otherwise we wouldn't go there in the first place--are affected severely, sometimes permanently. Keep in mind the event with the phen-fen diet of two years ago--women flocked to it as a means of losing weight and many now have permanent heart damage or have died--the mayor of Miami's wife died from this therapy. It was then the public began to open its blinded eyes to phen-fan.

Warnings are just that. It is the POTENTIAL of being a statistic and it is our inherent denial that we could ever BE one that leads us to make such decisions. You are now warned that something that can't be reversed can happen to you; then again you may be one of the lucky ones and benefit fully from creatine. It has helped people significantly in other therapies. It is the supplementation that you need to be concerned about since it is assumed that you do have normal levels of creatine in your body anyway.

If you develop seizures and you have taken creatine TELL YOUR DOCTOR AND MAKE HIM/HER LISTEN TO YOU! MAKE THEM FILL AN ADVERSE EVENT FORM reporting it! INSIST ON FOLLOW THROUGH. That is how these adverse events make it to public knowledge. Several! people, I believe, have had seizures related to creatine but because their doctors are not aware of the "public" knowledge, many may have been misdiagnosed with adult onset epilepsy or, if they currently have health problems, as a complication of the health problem. Just because a substance is naturally occurring in our bodies does not mean higher levels are safer. Be informed.

I am 24 years old and an avid weight lifter. I got married about a year ago and, up until that point, I either lived alone or had a private room. A few weeks after moving in with my wife, I woke up in the middle of the night to find her crying hysterically. Apparently she thought I'd had some type of seizure in my sleep. She said she tried to wake me, but I was unresponsive. The strange thing was I felt absolutely normal! Besides the expected confusion of waking up at 3 A.M. to find all the lights on and my wife in tears, I felt fine! I expected that there would be some residual effects if I'd had an actual seizure, so I kind of blew it off as a bad dream. In retrospect, I was showing an utter lack of common sense by doing this as I later found out.

The event happened again about a month later, but this time there was a noticeable "aftermath." After my wife finally managed to wake me, I literally could not talk! I tried to tell her something and it came out as senseless babble. It took almost 10 minutes before I could communicate with her normally! But again, had she not been there to wake me, I would have slept right through it.

This second occurrence got me concerned enough to see see a doctor and, in my consultation, I realized that I had been having what he called "absence seizures" for the past 4 years! I would have strange spells of dizziness or "disconnection" but I always attributed it to a "minor" side effect of medication I'd been taking for asthma. Again, a total lack or common sense, or at least knowledge, on my part.

How this all ties in is that I'd been taking creatine as well as ephedra (ma-huang, ephedrine) since I've been about 20. It stands to reason that I very well could have been having full, grand-mal seizures over that entire period and not known it because I'd been asleep. Upon talking to my college roommate about it, he mentioned that he had heard "strange noises" coming from my room occasionally like I was choking, exactly how my wife had described it, but he said that it always quickly passed. The first time it happened (over 3 years ago) he was concerned that I might be in distress and came into my room to check, but when he got there I was asleep, breathing normally. He mentioned it to me and we passed it off as some kind of "snoring."

Taking your advice, I checked the FDA website for occurrence of the words creatine and seizure. I found that, as you said, there were references to situations where people had reported taking creatine at a time when seizures had occurred. There were 5 that I could find. Of the five, three indicated that the patient was also taking a ma-huang supplement. Out of curiosity, I searched for seizure/ma-huang connections and found close to 70! And since I'm not familiar with the FDA database, I'm sure that there are probably cases for both creatine and ma-huang that I didn't uncover.

I also found a document written by the FDA in 1997 stating that they had received over 600 reports from health care professionals citing ma-huang supplements as a possible cause of seizure, as well as other nervous and cardiac system problems!

I'm wondering if your husband was also taking supplements containing ephedrine (in the form of ma-huang or otherwise). Several 'Diet' or 'Themo' supplements contain these substances as well as several that promise a 'Ripped' physique or increased 'Metabo'lism. Not mentioning any names!

I'd be very curious to know if there might be a connection in his case.

My husband is 21 years old, never had any health problems and has definitely always had a healthy heart. Until, he began taking creatine. He was on creatine for 2 1/2 months when he began having palpitations. We were both scared to death. We went to the dr. the next day, where he has been undergoing several tests (echo's, blood work, heart monitors, etc) & they have linked his problem with his creatine. We are hoping that medicine will fix this problem. For those of you who think creatine is just fine & dandy, then that is your opinion. But, please do not encourage others to take this!! It obviously affects people in different ways & if you are willing to endanger your health for a little more weight then go for it, but just remember that your health or even life could be at stake!!!!!

(3) Creatine monohydrate

Creatine is a chemical that occurs naturally in the body.

Creatine monohydrate is a synthetic form of creatine commonly used by athletes to improve their muscular strength and endurance.

Creatine is an important compound in muscle tissue that your body uses to form a very high-energy molecule called adenosine triphosphate (ATP). ATP fuels muscles during short, high-intensity exercise such as weight training. As ATP is consumed, your muscles become fatigued. By taking supplemental creatine monohydrate, the thinking goes, you delay exhaustion of ATP, work out harder and longer, and recover faster. A small number of studies do suggest that supplemental creatine can increase short-term muscle strength, while other studies have shown no effect.

Health risks of supplemental creatine monohydrate are:

(1) The short-term side effects of taking more than 5 grams a day include nausea and diarrhea. Long-term side effects with daily dosages of greater than 10 grams a day may include harm to the kidneys, especially in those with kidney disease. Teenagers or individuals older than 80 should not take it because of potential stress and harm on the kidneys. Definitely don't mix creatine monohydrate with fruit juice, as is recommended by some manufacturers -- this promotes the formation of creatinine, a metabolic waste product that stresses and harms the kidneys.

(2) Creatine monohydrate is linked to grand mal seizures and tumor.

(3) Creatine monohydrate has been linked to muscle cramps, strains, stomach problems and dizziness.

(4) Creatine monohydrate can promote dehydration by interfering with the body's sweating mechanism, so it is definitely not for runners or others engaged in endurance sports.

(5) Creatine monohydrate can reduce the body's natural production of Creatine.

(6) The safety of long-term use of Creatine monohydrate has not been established. Absence of studies of creatine's long-term effects, a special cause for concern given its popularity among teenage athletes.

Add to the above concerns are Creatine monohydrate's high cost and the absence of quality standards, I must conclude that it is an under-researched, expensive product not worth using.

The best route to building muscle is still the old-fashioned way:

(1) Follow a healthy diet and a commitment to training.

(2) Nutrients are critically important for energy production and maintenance of good energy level. Supplement with these safe and natural energy booster: Vitamins A, B-100 complex Vitamin, C, E and zinc (My favorite multiple Vitamin / Mineral Contains all of them), Magnesium, Coenzyme q-10, L-carnitine, Alpha Lipoic Acid, ENADA (NADH), Schizandra and Siberian Ginseng.

1) 'Andro'

'Andro' (Androstenedione) sales soared in 1998 after McGwire, who hit a record 70 home runs for the St. Louis Cardinals, said he took the supplement. The slugger now says he no longer takes Andro. Andro is particularly popular among teen-agers and even younger children. Mark McGwire was the poster boy for Andro and that really fueled its popularity. Some parents are even buying the supplement for their kids, hoping they will follow in McGwire's footsteps.

Andro is sold as a dietary supplement in health food stores under many product names including Androgen, AndroPlex, and Androstene. Classified as a dietary supplement, Andro is not regulated by the FDA the way prescription drugs are. This means products containing Andro may vary widely in their purity and in the amount of Andro they contain -- some may not contain any Andro at all, yet their deceptive claims that they do will not keep them off the market.

Andro is a steroid hormone that occurs naturally in the body. A 'building block' of the male hormone testosterone, Andro is believed by many athletes to have anabolic -- muscle-building -- qualities. Mark McGwire is no different from any other athlete who believes Andro boosts athletic performance. Despite the widespread claims of Andro's effectiveness, no clinical trials have shown that Andro increases muscle strength or improves athletic performance. It can have dangerous adverse effects, particularly in the very high doses athletes often use. It causes behavioral, sexual, and reproductive problems, liver and muscle disorders, and increases risk of heart disease. Athletes who take Andro along with other steroids believed to enhance athletic performance have a high risk of harmful drug interactions.

In a recent 12-week double-blind study, men participating in high-intensity weight training were given either androstenedione 200 mg daily or placebo. The results showed no increase in testosterone. However, estrogen levels did increase. So did cholesterol levels. It doesn't appear to improve sports performance or increase strength or lean body mass. Worsening of cholesterol levels was also seen in another 4-week double-blind placebo-controlled trial of 55 men.

Published in the Journal of the American Medical Association in June 1999, Iowa State University researchers found that a 300-milligram daily dose of Andro did not increase muscle mass or strength more than placebo pills in an eight-week weight-training program involving 30 men ages 19 to 29. However, use of the supplement lowered levels of HDL or "good" cholesterol.

February 2000, Harvard researchers reported in JAMA that a 300-milligram daily dose of Andro boosted blood levels of testosterone as well as two types of the female hormone estrogen in 42 men.

Experts warn that elevated testosterone levels may cause severe acne, male pattern baldness, a lowering of HDL (which could contribute to greater heart disease risk) and possibly liver disease and other severe consequences if taken for extended periods. In women, excess testosterone also can lead to a deeper voice, more body hair and other male traits. Elevated estrogen levels in men may cause the growth of breast tissue and interfere with sexual performance.

The dangers can be compounded when people mix Andro with creatine and other supplements.

Athletes Beware: Andro won't help, and might get you disqualified from competition.

While androstenedione itself is not a banned steroid, a recent study found that many batches of androstenedione are contaminated with a related substance called 19-norandrostenedione. This contaminant is converted by the body to a substance called 19-norandrosterone, and then excreted in the urine. The problem is that a banned steroid called nandrolone is also converted to 19-norandrosterone. Standard urine tests look for this substance in order to identify nandrolone usage. Contaminated androstenedione can increase 19-norandrosterone levels high enough to trigger a positive test for illegal steroids.

Although Andro is not banned in baseball, it is banned by the International Olympic Committee, the National Football League, and the National Collegiate Athletic Association because of its classification as an anabolic steroid.

The bottom line: Andro doesn't work, and it is dangerous.

Thank you for this Kathy, very very interesting!

What I have read on it the problem is they have done nothing with testing the long term side efeect only the short term.

softie

This web page tells you a little and they sell nothing.

http://www.absolute-creatine.com/

The problem with anything like this is when it comes to body building or weight loss, the pharmacy companies know that can get to us. Because as a society we are very in to what we look like. And the media plays it up for all it is worth. They use the public as human guinea pigs. As with most every thing it boils down to money money money.

softie

softie

Thanks for that LINK! I cut and pasted the info. just in case in the future the website goes down. This stuff should really be discused here at PTO if your loved one is in Prison and taking this stuff!

BUT, what I find interesting is this article is it doesn't mention the fact that if you don't drink at least a Gallon of Water a day while taking Creatine your body would have to start taking water from your organs, which would mean the Heart, Kidney and BRAIN. This is how it would cause a person to have Grand Mal Seizures!

All it says under number 2 is this:

"Creatine has been shown to pull water into your muscle cells, which increases the size of your muscles."

SO, can you see how serious this stuff is! If you do not drink a ton of water it will start pulling it from other areas of your body!

Another point I just remembered that I told my son was this:

Creatine really is only making you BLOATED and not MUSCULAR? Think about it! It pulls water from one area and put's it into another to make you APPEAR BIG!

SHOUT MOMENT! I hated that feeling when I had that time of the month! BLOATED and ALL CRAMPED UP!

Sincerely,
Kathy
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Creatine, Creatine Everywhere and No Objective Information Anywhere!

Absolute Creatine was started for one simple reason - to provide objective creatine information. In order to produce the absolute guide to creatine we need to be objective. So, let's make this very clear from the start...

We Do NOT Sell Any Sports Supplements.
So, like a good skeptic you ask - how do we make money? That is a problem, we really don't make nearly enough :) Seriously, you will see banner ads throughout the site. It is our sponsors that make this site possible. However, it should be made very clear that our advertisers have Absolutely no say or control over the content of the site.

Okay, enough about us (if you really want to read more visit the About Us page). If you are here you want to learn more about creatine. Without further ado lets dive right into the beginners guide to creatine...


The Beginners Guide To Creatine

What is Creatine?
Creatine is a compound that can be made in our bodies or taken as a dietary supplement. The chemical name for Creatine is methyl guanidine-acetic acid. That sure is a mouth full - which is why it is much easier to just call it creatine. Here is the chemical makeup of creatine -



Creatine is made up of three amino acids - Arginine, Glycine and Methionine. Our liver has the ability to combine these three amino acids and make creatine. The other way we get creatine is from our diet.


How much Creatine do we have in our body?
This varies based on the amount of muscle mass you have and your weight. On average a 160 pound person would have about 120 grams of creatine stored in their body.

Where is Creatine stored in our body?
It is believed that 95 - 98% of the creatine in our body is stored in our muscles. The remaining about 2- 5% is stored in various other parts of the body including the brain, heart and testes.

So what does creatine do?
Now is when the fun begins. First, before we answer this question - understand that the theory of what creatine does - is just that - theory. It is amazing how little we actually know about what goes on in our body. Anyway, we will outline what the majority of research currently agrees on in terms of what role creatine plays in our body.
1. Provide additional energy for your muscles

Time for a quick and simple biology lesson. In your body you have a compound called ATP (adenosine tri-phosphate). Think of ATP as an energy containing compound. What is important to know about ATP is that the body can very quickly get energy from a ATP reaction. You have other sources of energy such as carbohydrates and fat - but they take longer to convert into a useable energy source. When you are doing an intense quick burst activity - such as lifting a weight or sprinting, your muscles must contract and need a quick source of energy. This immediate energy comes from ATP.

Okay - still with us? Here is where it gets interesting. When your muscles use ATP for energy a chemical process happens where the ATP is broken down into two simpler chemicals ADP (adenosine di-phosphate) and inorganic phosphate. This process of ATP turning into ADP releases the energy which gives your muscles the ability to contract. Unfortunately, we do not have an endless supply of ATP. In fact, your muscles only contain enough ATP to last about 10-15 seconds at maximum exertion. In case you were wondering - no, the ADP can not be used to create more energy for your muscles.

Here is where the creatine comes in - or more specifically the creatine phosphate (CP). We don't want to go into great detail on creatine vs. creatine phosphate now (that is in a later article) - all you need to know now is that the majority of creatine that is stored in the muscles bonds with abundant phosphorus stores in the muscles and is converted into Creatine Phosphate (CP). CP is able to react with the ADP in your body and turn "useless" ADP back into the "super useful" energy source - ATP. More ATP in your body means more fuel for your muscles.

2. Volumization of your muscles

Looks like we just made up that word -Volumization - doesn't it? Actually, it's just a fancy name for the process of pulling fluid into the muscle cells and thus increasing the volume of the muscles. Creatine has been shown to pull water into your muscle cells, which increases the size of your muscles. Don't get to excited - it is not clear how great an effect this has. Point #1 is a much clearer benefit of creatine.

3. Buffer Lactic Acid build-up

New research has shown that creatine can help buffer lactic acid that builds-up in the muscles during exercise. This leads to that nasty burning feel you get in your muscles. Scientifically it is a complicated process - basically the creatine bonds with a Hydrogen ion and that helps delay the build up of lactic acid. More research needs to be done to see if this point is true.

4. Enhances Protein Synthesis

There is some data to indicate that creatine helps put the body in a more anabolic state where protein synthesis can occur. The more protein synthesis - the greater the muscle gain.

Well - there you have what creatine does in a very simplified nutshell. Of all 4 points - point #1 is the most use of creatine in the body. The other points are more debated - but still look to be valid.


Is the 120 grams of creatine in my body enough?
Maybe. The whole idea behind taking creatine as supplement is that if you workout you burn-up a lot of creatine. If you take a creatine supplement you will have more energy - because the ATP energy cycle can go on for a longer time. We go into supplementation in another article - but here is the quick run down. Unfortunately your muscle's creatine supply is not limitless. The average human has between 3.5 and 4 grams of creatine per kilogram of muscle. Once you use up the creatine in your muscle you have to rest your muscles and wait a while before you can exercise the muscle again. Studies have shown that the human muscle can store up to 5 grams of creatine per kilogram. So, by taking a creatine supplement you can raise your levels from 3.5 to 5 grams of creatine - and thus enjoy more of the benefits of creatine.

What happens to creatine that is not used by the body?
Excess creatine is eventually converted into the waste product creatinine and excreted from the body.
Well, there you have the The Beginners Guide To Creatine. I hope that wasn't too bad for you - because we are just getting started! Follow the links below to read much more about creatine.

Another note I wanted to mention is I have a cousin who is a Coach in Oklahoma and he told me that he had an Athelete who DIED and it is on his death cert. cause "CREATINE"
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http://www.drweil.com/app/cda/drw_cda.html-command=TodayQA-questionId=3299-pt=Question

Miracle for Macho Muscles?

"I recently heard there may be negative side effects from taking creatine monohydrate for building muscle. One person told me that it can be damaging to the liver. Are you aware of any such negative side effects? "

-- Connie Goodman



(Published 06/24/1998)

Creatine is an important compound in muscle tissue that your body uses to form a very high-energy molecule called adenosine triphosphate (ATP). ATP fuels muscles during short, high-intensity exercise such as weight training. As ATP is consumed, your muscles become fatigued. By taking supplemental creatine, the thinking goes, you delay exhaustion of ATP, work out harder and longer, and recover faster. A small number of studies do suggest that supplemental creatine can increase short-term muscle strength, while other studies have shown no effect.
Regardless of the possible effectiveness of creatine, I have several concerns about its possible health risks. Most disturbing is the absence of studies of creatine's long-term effects, a special cause for concern given its popularity among teenage athletes. Some researchers have also questioned whether taking creatine supplementally can reduce the body's natural production of it. While I haven't read anything about creatine's effect on the liver, the FDA is investigating whether the supplement is linked to grand mal seizures in two users and a tumor in another. The agency has likewise issued a warning to consult a physician before using it. (What good that does is unclear. No physicians I know could tell you much about the risks and benefits of supplemental creatine.)

Some things we do know: Definitely don't mix creatine with fruit juice, as is recommended by some manufacturers -- this promotes the formation of creatinine, a metabolic waste product that stresses the kidneys. Don't take high doses for more than a few days -- many users "load" the muscles by taking 20 grams daily for the first five days, but after that the body can use only 2 to 3 grams per day. Finally, be sure to drink at least two quarts of water per day to avoid dehydration.

Creatine has been linked to muscle cramps, strains and pulls, and to diarrhea. It can promote dehydration by interfering with the body's sweating mechanism, so it is definitely not for runners or others engaged in endurance sports. Add to these concerns creatine's high cost and the absence of quality standards, and I must conclude that it is an underresearched, expensive product not worth using.

In my opinion, the best route to building muscle is still the old-fashioned way: a healthy diet and a commitment to training.

You are very Welcomed Valerie!

Love
Kathy

Kathy, My son just called and I told him about Craetine because he takes it.....so again thank you.

WOW! And I bet he told you that everyone in Prison takes the STUFF! My son is always speaking out about the stuff to those who take it!

I hope he doesn't heed your advice and continue taking it!

My son took it when he first went into prison. He had a seizure and stopped taking it because of the seizure. BUT, at that time he did not put 2 and 2 together. It was about 2 years later he started taking it again. IMMEDIATELY the seizures started again.

As a concerned mother asked "What drugs are you taking in there?" His reply "NOTHING MOM HONEST! Just the Creatine that you bought for me!"

THAT is when the light came on!

My research on the internet almost made my heart stop! Especially since he had just called and now I would have to wait until he called again or write a letter hoping he got it within the week. I DID BOTH. As soon as he got my letter with all the info. he called and said he was blowen away!

Hopefully my posting of this stuff will save another LIFE!

Love
Kathy

I was hoping someone else would comment about this subject!

ANY FEEDBACKS?

Love
Kathy

im curious do they allow creatine in prison?? or u send creatine in packages? i have grand mal seizure. but unknown cause.. why i have it, no idea. im still researching.. but my pattern has been always same always while in sleeping i get seizures..i notices my pattern is that when i dont get enought sleep (lack of sleep). i get seizures. my first seizure when i was 18 years old... then i suspect i had few seizures til 1998 finally my friend took me to the hospital.. so went dr.. took some test like x ray, mri, cat scan. brain test whatever..found nothing. dr had to put me on medications i went several medincations. i dislike them all. side effects, sleepy during day time.. mood chanes etc etc...so iusually get seizures about 2 times a year. im not taking creatine. but i understand how ur son goes thur grand mal seizure.

THANKS LILSQUAW for your posting on this issue!

I'm sorry to hear you have these type of seizures!

NOW, what is very interesting is the fact that you had your seizures at night!

MY SON had them right after he fell asleep and one time at 3:00AM.

As for getting the Creatine in prison, what I did was send him the money and he would order it from a catalog. At first we thought it was caused by STRESS. But, since he has stopped taking the CREATINE he has not had another seizure!

My son has not had all the Medical treatments as you have to find if the source was a tumor or something else.

Thanks
Love
Kathy

i forgot to add that part. when i get really stress myself out. i intend to get seizures. so im taking it easy, no stress, get plenty of sleep. my doctor he seem like he dont believe my pattern. i told him all seizures i had while i was sleeping. i told him i dont want medincations. i knew if i take care of myself, get good sleep, no stress, eliinmate some. i iwll be okay without mediciations. he say if i do then he will have to report to umm i forgot ummm.. report to driver safety then dmv etc. they will take away my driver license. which i undertstand its for my safety and other people safety too..but i dont have seizure for a long time without medicantion theni should be okay what more i intend to seizure while iwas sleeping. i shouldbe okay? im fighitng to unblock my case without filling alll papers to prove im okay to drive etc etc.. they did blocked me for getting my license back. it was really pain in the butt. etc etc. i have 2 more yrs to expire then i might have to renew my license via driver safety or something... im looking for case like mine that get license without via driver safety. so glad ur son havent seziure lately. i know its really YUCKY. very tiresome for me. sorry for blabbing. sometime i feel shame to tell someone i have grand mal seizure i thought they might freak out and dontknow what to fo with me. or dont want tot ake resonbility for it u know.i assure them dont worry...mostly i keep it ot myself. depend who i feel comfortable with. but mostly i don't mind. again im blabbing .. thanks for that informations tho. educations myself and for others

Just wanted to Remind everyone again about this STUFF!

Love
Kathy

My fiance uses creatine in prison and so do a bunch of the other guys. I believe though that in Ca., they aren't allowed to have it anymore because they sell it in canteen now. They are starting to use Celtek also, which builds you like creatine. I have never heard of any side effects because of it, but I will look into it now. Thanks for the info!

Shelly

Glad to see this post move up! Thanks Shelly!

I highly recommend the NONE USE of Creatine for the simple reason it is not controlled by the FDA!

It has been exactly 1 year since my son's last Seizure and he hasn't touched Creatine since!

I just wouldn't take a chance on this stuff!

Love
Kathy

I have had all the seizures you can think of when i was younger. Now that i am older, they are more mild.

I was talking to Mark on the phone about it today and he said he's doubling up on the stuff plus taking Celtek which has creatine in it too. He said he was feeling weak and a friend of his about a month ago was having chest pains. It is scaring the crap out of me now. I told him to pleeeease stop taking it.

Shelly

Stop taking it!!! Kathy is right! Stop taking it!

I bet he doesn't know that ANY type of Natural or Human Steroid causes the Penis to shrivel up and also cause ERECTILE DYSFUNCTION, key word; IMPOTENT

So, what is more important to him?

Muscles that look Big because they are filled with Water that was taken from the Brain and Heart?

OR

A BIG PENIS?

He can't have his Cake and Eat it too!

Hope this will help him make an INTELLIGENT DECISION!

But, hey Smoking also does the same! It restricts BLOOD FLOW to the Penis by constricting the Blood Vessels causing a Penis not to get hard.

TRUST ME! I KNOW MEN WHO HAVE TOLD ME!

As his Partner, I would tell him I would rather have a MAN WITH A BIG PENIS than a MAN WITH BIG ARMS!

LMAO!
Kathy
PS Sorry for being so BLUNT!
PSS I can Hear Barb a Valerie Right now!