Well, I said I would never put myself in this spot again and here I am. :(

As most of you know Juan was released from INS detention September 25th. He came back but stayed with a pastor because I wasn't sure I wanted him back in the house until I knew he had changed. Well, after about a week, I realized he hadn't. The thing is, nobody else sees what he is doing, it's my word against his.

He came over one night and said God told him that we should divorce. I was like, fine.... Yes, he is in the Church and is a great christian. God changed his life when he was in Detention. Anyway, the day after he came over and said God wanted us to get a divorce, he called and wanted sex. I was like,.... I DON'T THINK SO!! Then a few days later, he came over and tried to "force" the issue. He has always had this fantasy of raping a woman but was afraid because he didn't want to go to jail, so this day he wanted me to "fullfill" his fantasy. Well, I won and told him to get out.

So, he started showing up at my daughters work, wanting to talk to her and was freaking her out. Then he called one night and tried to get me to admit that I was the one that got him back into selling drugs (this was before I called the police when he tried to become violent with me and my girls) It got into a heated conversation and I told him that if he came near me or my girls, I would get a restraining order.

Well, I didn't hear from him for a while until last Thursday. He called, which I don't know how he got my number because I moved. He wanted me to know that he knew where I lived because he has a friend that lives in the same apartment. He also wanted me to know that he sees my car everymoring when he goes to work.

Now, I get a call this morning, he first disguised his voice because he knew the girls didn't want to talk to him so he didn't want one of them to answer the phone and know it was him. He asked me if I noticed my car this morning, I said no, why? He said he scratched my window. I was like "WHAT??" He said he wrote some words on the dew that was on my window. I asked him why he did that and he said he wanted me to know he was close. Then said he would talk to me later and hung up.

So, .... what is going on? Is he just doing this to make me nervous? He knows that if he gets arrested INS will pick him up and he will not get out until Castro dies and he can go back or he dies. INS said he won't get another chance. So, is he just harrassing me? Do I need to worry? I really don't know what to do... very nervous and depressed. My girls are very uneasy about all this. They are home alone at night when I'm at work. (They are 15 and 17).

Anyway, I jsut thought I'd write out what's going on... don't know what to do or what to say about all this.

Thanks for listening
Joy

JOY!!!

For God's Sakes, girl.

This is called STALKING, and it will escalate!

Call a lawyer. Call 911. Call SOMEONE to help!

Call NOW!

Then print this off, exactly as you wrote it out here, and see if any authority agrees with me!

Menolly

Joy

WOW im not to sure what to say all I know is I would be scared out of my mind for you and your girls. Have you talked to anyone about it.

Joy,
This is not sounding good but you don't need me to tell you that. It does look as if it is escalating and could get dangerous. He also seems to use the Lords name when it benefits him, and go against it when it when he feels the need.
I won't say anything else, but I am looking for some input from Jdswifey, Sherri13 and a few others...
Keep and eye open, and don't hesitate to call for help if it comes to that.. He obviously knows what the repercussions could be, but is choosing to play it close to the edge.. That doesn't sound too sane to me.

Joy....
I know that it is heartbreaking to see someone you care about being in prison or dealing with the legal system....
HOWEVER..... whether you care about someone and love someone or not, there ARE standards of behavior that we all must abide by.... moral, ethical and LEGAL limitations about what kind of behavior is acceptable and what is NOT!! And Juan's current behavior is crossing the line in ALL ways!!!!
Joy.... no one needs to tell you that this kind of behavior escalates.... and I know that you say that Juan has found religion... but I am sorry.... you don't have the spirit of God in your heart when you talk about raping your wife!! I don't want to sound too harsh, or sound judgemental.... but I DO want you to take this REALLY SERIOUSLY!! You know that behavior like this escalates and can get dangerous QUICKLY! Get a restraining order. Let Juan know you are NOT playing! If you clearly draw a line and HE CHOOSES to cross it, then that is on HIM! He KNOWS the consequences.... He KNOWS what he is putting at risk... and yet he STILL chooses to engage in this kind of crap?!? Whether it is because he is sick or because he just doesn't care about the rights, feelings, etc of others, even those he claims to love is irrelevant. You need to protect yourself and those girls!!!

Joy, you have recieved some VERY WISE words here!! His mode of operation is not healthy at ALL!

I don't care what religion one belongs too, but the God I know, doesn't tell a person to divorce, but guides to recovery and the people desides on what will be done. It sounds to me like, the religious con game to gain favors.

Getting help in dealing with this is very important. Among others, I would take the situation to the women's help groups that operate in your area. Most likely, they have seen things like this, more then any other group.

Again, you need to get "others" involved, in helping you and the girls!!!

My poor Joy!! PLease dont let this continue! I agree with Jds that you should draw the line and if and when he crosses it it is his choice....It is his way of having a hold on you--with fear! I really feel like just kicking the shit out of him for you! (although violence is NOT the answer!!) Please tell the friends and family you have around you..We love you and are hear for you and call me if you need anything...BIG HUG!!

Don't mean to be disrespectful but he SOUNDS like the direct opposite of a 'devout christian' to me! I would be very defensive now! and take action before it escalates...especailly with your family to worry about. I wouldn't entertain his little mind games for a second. It may be easier dsaid then done to be this way for you....but IMO regardless of whatever history I have w/a person...when they even hint at threatening me or my family-they'd have issues w/the authorities VERY VERY quickly. Please take care of yourself and your girls!

I AGREE 100% WITH WHAT EVERYONE IS SAYING. THIS IS A BAD SITUATION. THIS MAN IS PLAYING HEAD GAMES AND MINIPULATING YOU BECAUSE HE PROBABLY KNOWS YOU WOULD NOT WANT TO TURN HIM IN. I KNOW YOU WOULD NOT WANT TO SEE HIM PUT AWAY BUT YOU HAVE TO PROTECT YOURSELF AND YOUR GIRLS FROM DANGER. WHAT BOTHERS ME THE MOST IS HIM USING "GOD" IN ALL THIS IT'S VERY IRONIC ESPECIALLY BECAUSE HE IS NOT CONDUCTING HIMSELF IN A GODLY LIKE WAY. DOES HE STILL KEEP IN CONTACT WITH THE MINISTER WHO'S HOUSE HE WAS RELEASED TOO? IF SO MAYBE YOU CAN TALK TO HIM AND TELL HIM WHAT YOUR HUSBAND HAS BEEN UP TO. HAVE HIM ADVISE HIM THAT IF THIS CONTINUES YOU WILL PUT HIM AWAY FOR A LONG TIME SO HIS BEST BET IS TO STAY CLEAR OF YOU AND THE GIRLS. GOOD LUCK!

The thing is, nobody else sees what he is doing, it's my word against his.

Sweet Joy, Why do I get the feeling that you think nobody will believe you or listen to your concerns? You wrote down your feelings and the issues very clearly. I think that you are 'reading' Juan correctly and, in turn, 'reading' your daughters fear and uneasiness very clearly. Please do whatever YOU HAVE to, to make sure you and your family are protected. You have supported and done everything that you could for Juan, do NOT let him take contral of this situation!

I think the advice to contact the pastor he was living with and find out how his behavior has been there is very sound and a starting point. Having the support of the pastor and his advice, may help you in getting the protection you need!

My thoughts and prayers are with you! If you need to just talk, pm me and we'll get in touch!

Pam

Dear Joy-

sorry for saying this the way I'm about to- this man is sick! I don't know him, but what you wrote made it 100% clear to me that he could get very dangerous! Call the police, have a report filed. GET HELP A.S.A.P- PLEASE!!!!
Right now it might just give him a kick to intimidate you- but I'm afraid that he will soon want more than 'just' torment you like this.


Tanya

Joy - great advice from everyone above. i did some volunteer work with Women Against Violence in Omaha NE as well as Battered/Abused/Gays/Lesbians back in the 80s. one thing that was ALWAYS stressed was to DOCUMENT! and the best way to document is to call for help! even if he is not around, try calling the local police stattion, explaining the situation and making sure that they log the call. police are notorious about not doing anything on the first call, so if you have set the events in motion, when it does come down to having something done, there is 'backup' to show that you have started the notifications and documentations. also, make sure that YOU keep record of each and every contact he makes, day, date, time of day, what exactly was said, done, etc.! the more you can produce the more ground you have to stand on!

Best of luck!

Jerry

I want to thank everyone for their support and advise. Everything has been heard and taken seriously. I have contacted someone to help and right now Juan is being very quiet. He is afraid of INS more than anything because if he gets into ANY trouble, he's up for life.

This is a great group and thanks for listening. I'll keep you posted on how things go.

Joy

Please do keep us posted Joy...you're in my thoughts.

Hey people, just needing to talk again. I don't have ANYONE to talk this out with. Basically, let's just say I'm scared now. Juan called me Christmas Eve around 11 p.m. Just wanting to talk, sad, depressed, lonely, etc..etc.... feels like he's going to die soon..etc...etc... wants us to be friends because I am the only one who really knows him and understands him..etc...etcc.... Ok, it was Christmas eve so I listened and talked to him for an hour. Well, more listened than talked. He called again at 4 in the morning, but I had my phone turned off so didn't hear it. I keep my phone turned off in the bedroom so that I can sleep during the day. With two teenage daughters the phone constantly rings!.

Anyway, he called again about 2 in the afternoon Christmas day. My girls told him I was sleeping. He called at 6, I told them to tell him I would call later. I didn't so he called back about 1 in the morning. He wants to know that if we lived in seperate apartments could we stay married. Why am I doing him this way...etc...etc.... He called again today. however, his other side is showing up. He's angry again. If I talk to him, it seems to keep him calm. It's when I WON'T talk that he gets obssessive. He hasn't done anything to threaten me so I can't go to the police and get a restraining order. actually, that wouldn't help if I did, restraining orders are a bunch of crock. He tells me where he is always seeing me, almost like he's following me.

Part of me just wants to pack my stuff and quietly leave town and disappear. However, my kids are in high school. My oldest will be a Senior next year and my youngest a Junior. I just can't pick them up and leave. They are angry at Juan and say they arn't afraid of him.... well they need to be afraid. So, I'm not leaving them here, but I'm afraid of what will happen if I do stay..........

I am SO tired right now... so, so tired. There really isn't anything anyone can do. I will just have to deal with things as they come up. I have told the girls that if he shows up at the house during the day, to tell him to wait and wake me up. If he shows up at the door at night when I'm at work and he knows I'm at work, to not even open the door, just go straight to the phone and call 911.

It's 11:00 in the morning and it's time for me to go to bed. Gotta work tonight. Maybe I'll feel better after I get some sleep.

Thanks for listening
Joy

Joy, Thats a terrible thing to go through.You told your girls the right thing.Isn't there anyone you can report this to?Can you talk to who ever he's staying with? I feel so bad about your situation. Please keep us posted. Praying for you... Ps. What if you told him you had a restrining order? would that make it worse?

Joy...I'm worried for you and the girls...there has to be some way to get him out of your life. The obsessiveness and his way that he tries to worm into your life w/a cross between scare tactics and then calmness is SO not cool.
You have to reach out to somone who can help you with this...either the priest he was staying with?(wasn't he staying w/a priest) or too bad if it boils down to him getting in 'trouble' (sorry JMO but your family's security is so much more important) his parole officer about the harassment! You can't keep in touch just to keep him calm, and you shouldn't have to run away to feel safe in your home. I'm so sorry to hear you're going throuhg this, and sorry if anything I said sounds bossy-this just seems very serious to me. Please keep in touch w/us so we know how you are.

Joy, Jerry gave some very good advise in his post 11-20-02.

I hope you are doing this in some form or another. Posting here also make a record, so keep that in mind too.

Going through a divorce or even talking about it, can cause things to swing in different direction very quickly. This is one reason a lawer can come in handy, because everything can go throught them, without any contact with the other person during the prossess. The lawer can stop any unwanted contact, throught letters/phone calls or legal action.

I know how nerve racking and draining, all this can be! I'm sorry you have to go throught this!

Joy, I am sure I don't have to remind you, but...document,document, document. Even when you think things have cooled down. I know it takes effort but it is oh so important. Make a log of each call. Make sure to keep all correspondence. You need to make sure he understands that you still intend on divorcing him, never waver. He is using his temper as a means of controlling you. If you don't allow his calls, he gets mad, so to keep him from getting mad, you accept his calls. Don't give in to him. Each time you set a line and he crosses it and you relent, it sends a signal to him that you can be manipulated. I am so very worried for you, your family will be in my prayers.

Joy, you need to call your phone company and ask thm to send you detailed listings of yourincoming/ outgoing calls. Try to record him
If you have 3-way calling, let someone you trust listen in. Go talk to a woman's advocate - your local police station can give you the number. You're not as alone as you think you might be.

Please keep us informed about anything as I will think of annd look for other things you can do.

Tanya

Very good ideas Tanya!

Joy, I was thinking about you. How are you?

i was thinking of you too Joy...how are ya?

Joy be very careful and stay safe, whatever it takes.

hi joy, since ur girls will be alone.. maybe ask ur next door to keep eyes on them to make sure, maybe u can explain ur situation, that person might understand and willing if somethings weird or see him around so she/he can call cop. whoever u are close to around ur niegors. records all calls!!! proof proof!!! stalking is against the law in california i believe. so does he have probation officer? maybe you can explain to him what happened, etc etc. please be careful. maybe try go women's shelter some helps. advices.. hope u and girls are okay...

Things arn't going well. I'm working on trying to find out if I can get a restraining order just to let him know I mean business. I think he is more afraid of getting arrested because if he does, INS will immediately take him and will not let him out until relations with Cuba is better and they start taking bak their people... which, doesn't seem to likely happen for a while. I am hoping that right now he's just flexing muscles, but he's out for revenge and I don't know how far he is willing to go. Part of me feels that his bark is worse than his bite. I know I need to be careful, I'm just really getting tired. My kids are terrified, they are always looking behidn their backs to see if he's following them or something.

Thank you all for caring and for listening.

Joy

Well, Joy- don't wait to find out! Take all the precautions you can...if you handle it correctly, this ordeal will be over with soon.

Good luck- and if you feel scared and need to talk, feel free to pm me. If you want to talk, we can exchange numbers- feel free to contact me anytime... sometimes it helps just to not be alone!

Tanya

I agree with Tanya, and what if he isn't just flexing his muscles? Be safe!

Joy,
I was so sad when I read this, you are in my prayers, and I hope you take everyones advice. I lived through this with my dad, and I know how your daughters feel.
*hugs*
Cindy

Joy,
I just read your thread. How are things with you? My ex husband is in prison and he was abusive to me. I got a protective order which is better than a restraining order. With a restraining order, you have to go through the whole court thing. With a protective order, you carry the order with you at all times, if he comes near you, call the police and show them the order and he goes to jail immediately. I'll keep you in my prayers. Good Luck.

Joy I don't know about the State you are in, but here in Washington we have laws againist stalking. Everytime he calls you harrashing you, writes on your car, bothers your girls, call the police, that way you will have every thing documented.

It will get worse sweetie I promise you that, you need to protect yourself and your kids. I hid for many years from my ex husband, becaue back then there were no stalking laws. Many years later my son was killed and I thought for sure my ex had gone on with his life since it had been so many years. So I called his sister to tell him his son had died. Two weeks later I was laying in the hospital being shot twice and stabbed over a 100 times.
Believe me sweetie it just gets worse. Every thing every one has told you is wonderful advice. Maybe you can buy an answering machine that also records and when he calls record the conversation for more proof.

Please Please stay safe you and your daughters are the most important ones here.

softie

Joy
You need to secure your children and yourselfs safty. I've been there done that with abuse and calling in the law. I will tell you first hand things never get better they only esculate unless your sig. other gets help. This guy knows what will happen if the law gets involved which makes things more dangerous. Talk to someone about your options don't just overlook things. Stay safe.

Joy,
YES you CAN just pick up and move your kids out of harms way. From what I've read so far, DO IT!! Hon, don't be a victim all your life. Girl, first time his fault, next time yours!

Take care I hope things get better!!!

Joy ....
This guy needs a shrink and is totally unstable.Get a restraining order if you have to....make it legal and this guy may back off.Document everything and have it notorized to protect yourself.Don`t open the door for petes sake!!Call the cops!!

no!!! never allow him in your house for any reason..Call 911 the instant he shows up at your door.Joy Please get help!!!

Add locks to your front door
Keep mace in your hand while going to your car
change your phone number, trace calls with phone co.
keep a weapon by your door
teach your children to do the same

good luck to you