Can someone please tell me the differances between Supervised release and probation? THanks in advance for your time.

CHoffer...I didn't have an answer for you. I am bringing this back on top in hopes someone may be able to help.

Diane

Supervised Release is what they call the continuing obligation to check in with a probation officer, etc., after they have actually served time in prison. Probation is the obligation to report to a probation officer if they did not receive prison time as part of their sentence. Hope this helps.

Let me make another question. What does "supervised release" mean for a person who is a foreign citizen and will be deported at the end of his sentence? How can this make sense? My son will be released on May 16 and immediately deported. But his sentence includes 4 years of supervised release.

Of course, there is no international treaty which could mean an obligation to check with probation officers in our country, Argentina. My son's defender told us that that obligation is automatically waived because of the deportation, BUT what if he returns to USA some day after the mandatory 5 or 10 years of prohibition? Will the BOP find that he has never checked with a probation officer and then incarcerate him again??

If there is an implicit waiver because of the deportation, then what is the purpose of sentencing him to 4 years supervised release, when in fact there will never be any supervision possible?

Un abrazo,
Andrés

Gosh, Escamillo. I wish I had an answer for you on that one, but I do not know anything about deportation issues. Do you have an attorney helping you? If so, I would work with him or her on this because it seems technical. I do not want to scare you and I am just talking off the top of my head, but I am worried that if your son is here without authorization (which is presumably why he is getting deported), and he comes back without authorization and he gets picked back up, he might get picked back up if it looks like he did not comply with the supervised release. However, this seems like something that your son would want to try to get resolved with the probation officer that is going to be assigned to the supervised release issue before the deportation occurs. I would call the main number for the United States Probation Office in your town and ask them this question. I am sure someone there can tell you what they do in situations like this. Again, I am sorry I cannot be of more help on this one. Good luck to you--and will you post the answer here if you find out? I would like to know.

Escamillo, I have a similar concern! My boyfriend is incarcerated in the US but is a Canadian citizen. His probation officer told me that there is a good chance that eh will get released on supervised release but might have to stay in the US during this period. I am so scared that they WON'T let him back into Canada for however long they grant the supervised release for. His lawyer isn't helpful at clarifying this...I WISH I HAD ANSWERS!

MTLGirl: I am sure you are doing everything you can to work "nicely" with the attorney, but it really is not acceptable for him or her not to be giving you answers on this. This is a BIG issue for you. Call the attorney and tell him or her that you need an answer from the Probation Department about how this is going to work. In my personal experience, it is the squeaky wheel that gets the grease. It should not be too hard for the attorney to make a phone call and find out what is going to happen. I hope this helps. I am confused--did this issue not come up prior to sentencing? Also, I just re-read your post, why can't the PO tell you what is going to happen? Did he or she say that it was up to Immigration? I am just guessing here--again, I know NOTHING about deportation issues.

I don't think that the supervised releases messes with crossing borders. From my knowledge, inmates are released to thier specified address, according to their release packets, and are let go with certain conditions, i.e., home detention, half way house etc. I believe that the stipulations state that while under supervised release, any crime commited falls under a violation of that release and the inmate has to go back to the sentencing judge whereever that may be.

Jackdaniels: What you are saying is correct. But, if I understand the issue: what happens if someone is here without the proper paperwork or loses permission to be here because a crime has been committed, and they are facing deportation and/or wanting to return home? Do they have to/get to (depending on the specific situation involved) finish their supervised release in the United States before returning to their home countries? If not, what happens to the Supervised Release obligation if they ever attempt to come back to the U.S.?

My ex-husband was released from federal prison after a 50 month sentence. He was sentenced to 3 years probation but he was deported Mexico after his release. What the United States Probation office told me is that he cannot apply to come back to the U.S. until the 3 years of supervised release are up. He will not have to report obvioulsy since he is in Mexico, but he cannot come back to the U.S. at least until the 3 years are up.

THANK YOU, CJJACK. This question was driving me nuts because I knew there was someone out there who had experienced this. Is your husband in Mexico now? Are you still here? If so, can you go visit? I am sorry that happened to you guys.

He is still there. He cannot come back because if they catch him in the U.S. without permission he will go to prison for a long time for being here ilegally. We are divorced. I can go to visit as long as I have permission from the US Probation office.
Chrisa

my boyfriend is in a federal prison (if it makes any kind of difference) and still has not yet been sentenced, I am assuming that the fact that I already had an interview with a probation officer about his release is a GOOD THING??? I certainly hope so, he is only 22 years old and is a first time offender

MTLGirl: The fact that probation is visiting where he is going to release to is a very good thing. It sounds like he is going to get probation and/or with his time served he might just get to come home right after the sentencing hearing. Of course, I am speculating because I know nothing about his case. However, they don't generally visit where they are going to be released to until close to the time of release. Good luck to you! It sounds like it is very positive.

MTL- Since he hasn't been sentenced yet could they be doing a pre-trial visit? They will usually do a visit to see if he has a place to go should he be released until sentencing and be supervised by a pre-trial officer.

no they didnt visit because I am in Montreal and he is incarcerated in NYC - his probation officer called me and we talked for like 45 mins about our relationship, our future etc. she was SO SWEET and nice to me which I wasn't expecting - things seem promising, it's just the whole supervised release thing that seems daunting, she asked me things like "If he was to get - lets a say- a couple of years superivsed release in the united states, would you move here to be with him?"
I don't know what to make of it. His lawyer is crap, he is legal aid, we can't afford a better attorney - I am only 21 and a full time university student and he is only 22 - we don't have those kinds of funds set up which is incredibly frustrating

ARGH @ there being no edit button

Hmmm . . . since he has not been sentenced yet, it sounds like she is asking you those questions to determine whether or not he is a flight risk if they let him out on Supervised Release. Although you should never lie, I would think seriously about telling her you would consider moving to be near him, if you would think about it. Keep us posted.

I told her I would, I would absolutely go any distance to be with him no matter what it takes. Thank you so much for you insight!!!

I have no idea since he is a Canadian citizen. I myself am on Supervised Release and my probation officer is extremely nice. I have had no problems. As long as you do what they ask, which isn't much really, then they pretty much leave you alone.

cjjack, good for you, that's great :) I hope things turn out just as good for us

CJJack: How intrusive are your conditions? (If you don't mind me asking). I am not asking for specifics at all. I am just wondering if you feel like they are reasonable--or is it hard to go about your regular life with all of the requirements that they place on you? I know it probably varies depending on the situation. I am just curious because my boyfriend is in on a violation--and is going to have more SR when he does finally get out. I met him after he went in, so I don't know how hard it is to comply.

I sure don't mind telling you. I am pretty open about what I did and what I am going through now! They are not intrusive at all. My probation officer came to my house once when I got out. SHe didn't look around really, she just had to verify that I live there. It is not difficult at all to go about my regular life. I went through the RDAP program so I am drug tested once a week. I am on a color code system, I have to call every day to find out if my color has come up. If so I go to her office for a drug test. This is only for 6 months and I am almost done with it. I have to fill out a monthly report and send it to her before the 5th of every month. If I want to go out of town I have to put in a request to her telling her where I am going etc. I have done this already and it was no big deal. Supervised release has been much easier than I had anticipated. I live with my fiance and I worried that this would disrupt his life, but my probation officer told me that I am the one on supervised release, not him. If you are living your life the right way, then it's not difficult at all, at least it hasn't been for me.

cjjack: Thank you so much for the information. I am anticipating that my boyfriend is going to have similar conditions--because he is in on a drug offense. He is not going to be in long enough to get to go through RDAP, though, which was disappointing to me because I think it is so important. ANYWAY--that's another topic. I sure do appreciate the information. Thanks for sharing.

Thanks for your concern. My son entered the US as a legal tourist, and his charges were contraband of illegal substances. At the end of his sentence he will be deported. So, there has never been an intention to stay in the US, and it sounds reasonable that, as Cjjack says, he cannot enter the territory again until after the 4 years probation have ellapsed. Reasonable, but where is it written down?

I know of the case of another Argentinean citizen who completed a short sentence many years ago, got supervised release and was deported, re-entered the US on vacation four years later, was admitted, visited Disneyworld with his family and left. After one year, he travelled again, and this time was arrested for illegal reentry. When he asked (and the Consulate asked) why he was allowed entry the first time, the BOP answered that it might have been a mistake! This person is now serving 57 months for illegal reentry.

We must be very careful. Nothing is guaranteed, including words from our attorneys, until we see it written down in an official document. I look for some document that clearly states that "a prisoner on supervised release does not have obligation to check with probation officers anywhere, if he has been deported and stayed out of the US during the supervision period". If I find out, I'll post it here.

Thanks again, un abrazo
Andrés

Escamillo: I have to give you my disclaimer that I do not practice immigration law, but I am feeling bad that you are having trouble finding answers. I found the following in 18 USC Section 3563 (I have just excerpted what I think are the relevant parts):

Sec. 3563. - Conditions of probation

(b) Discretionary Conditions. -

The court may provide, as further conditions of a sentence of probation, to the extent that such conditions are reasonably related to the factors set forth in section 3553(a)(1) and (a)(2) and to the extent that such conditions involve only such deprivations of liberty or property as are reasonably necessary for the purposes indicated in section 3553(a)(2), that the defendant -

(21) be ordered deported by a United States district court, or United States magistrate judge, pursuant to a stipulation entered into by the defendant and the United States under section 238(d)(5) of the Immigration and Nationality Act, except that, in the absence of a stipulation, the United States district court or a United States magistrate judge, may order deportation as a condition of probation, if, after notice and hearing pursuant to such section, the Attorney General demonstrates by clear and convincing evidence that the alien is deportable;

(d) Written Statement of Conditions. -

The court shall direct that the probation officer provide the defendant with a written statement that sets forth all the conditions to which the sentence is subject, and that is sufficiently clear and specific to serve as a guide for the defendant's conduct and for such supervision as is required.
*****

It appears that the process works like this: the court or the probation officer (presumably in coordination with INS) makes a determination about whether or not the defendant is deportable. In your case, since your son was here on a tourist visa, I presume that both you and the government would stipulate to deportability--so that you can get him home. When the Probation Officer writes the Presentence Investigation Report, it should include a statement that your son is deportable, and the conditions under which the judge is allowed to order deportation as a condition of supervised release. Your attorney will be given a copy of the Report, and you will have a certain number of days to object to anything contained in the report. After the Report is finalized, the Probation Officer will then make a sentencing recommendation to the judge, which your son and his attorney will not get to see. At the sentencing hearing, the Judge will then decide whether or not your son is to stay here and report and comply with other conditions of supervised release as the Court decides to require, or whether your son is to be deported as a condition of his release. If he is deported, the government will have to provide your son with paperwork that outlines all of his conditions of supervised release--in the case of deportation, I assume that the only condition is that he not return to the country during the supervised release term. SO--in response to your worry about needing something in writing, he will get paperwork that has the specific conditions of release clearly spelled out, so there should be no confusion about what is and is not required.

I hope this helps. I wish I had more direct experience with this. Let me know if you have additional questions, and I'll see what I can figure out--although there is no guarantee I can find you answers.

Yes, my ex-husband did get the paperwork that stated that. It also said that if he wanted to return to the U.S. after the term of his supervised release was up that he had to have express written consent of the Attorney General of the United States. My ex-husband spent his 50 months in prison for illegal re-entry.

Thanks, cjjack. That seems to confirm what I read. That is a stiff penalty for re-entry. I think our immigration laws in this country are ridiculous--but that is a topic for another thread I suppose.

NJ, thanks a lot for your help, and the clearness of your expression. I'll cut these posts and paste them into a letter for my son, and recommend him again to keep both eyes widely open. After his release we will have all the documentation on hand and will be able to post it here (PDF format, could be).

Un abrazo (a hug)
Andrés

I think the supervised release is just part of sentencing no matter what the circumstances. A guy that was sentenced the same day as my boyfriend was sentenced to life and they gave him so many years of supervised release and told him he was to report to a porbation officer within 48 hours of his release. How? If he has to serve life in prison how can he possibly report? I think no matter what they have to give a term of supervised release.

MTLGIRL It sounds to me that you were interviewed for the PSI (pre sentence investigation) The Probation Office conducts the interview for the judge to determine facts about the person before sentencing. It is a time to bring out any info. good or bad and give it to the judge. Actually it is quite the opposite of probation, it usually is twisted and contorted around to make the person seem even worse to the judge. This report is what is used to determine the sentence (high end or low end of the guideline)

crystal, yeah I think you're definitely right, although in his case it seemed to work in his favor. His PSI turned out great and he is even getting a GOOD letter from the federal prosecutor to the judge for his sentencing...how rare is that??

Escamillo: I hope this has helped your son in some way. Please do keep us posted on his status, and when he will get to come home. I am sure your family is all anxious for that.

Crystal: FYI--Supervised Release is only ordered if the particular offense charged carries a possible term of supervised release and the Judge decides to order it. So, it is possible to get sentenced to a prison term without it. For example, I have seen that when people are repeat offenders, sometimes the federal judges will eventually just sentence them to longer prison terms and not give them any supervised release time when they get out--on the theory that the supervised release program is not really helping them get their act together.