View Full Version : Only male correctional officers should see male inmates naked


rupert81
12-27-2009, 08:44 AM
I decided to start this new thread after reading about the prevalence of female correctional officers in male prisons in another post. What really surprised me is to find out that it is not uncommon for female officers to supervise male inmates while they shower and thus see them completely naked. Not only is this totally degrading to male prisoners, but it is a situation that will almost certainly lead to behavioural/disciplinary problems. I imagine that some of the males that feel degraded in this manner will then strike back through various forms of lewd behaviour or sexual misconduct directed at the female officers.

In a prison environment, there is unfortunately no way for an inmate to avoid instances of forced public nudity, whether in the communal shower or during strip searches. But the least a prison can do to preserve a minimal level of dignity for inmates is to ensure that only male correctional officers see them when they are naked. I wonder if anyone has ever lobbied or petitioned for this.

akaptrosa
12-27-2009, 09:33 AM
You know, I would agree for the most part, but after my last two visits male co's made sexual comments toward my man, so I don't know if gender even makes a difference. I'm sure there are gay male CO's too. I try not to think about that stuff.

thatwiz
12-27-2009, 09:53 AM
It doesn't make much difference. Why would you think that just because a women sees your man naked that she would want him in anyway??????Guys will get naked extremely fast, so if she wanted someone I think its slim that she'd pick a prisoner. I would say its harder for a male to get another male naked if he wasn't into that, so I agree with the above poster-I'd be more worried about the male CO's looking.

rupert81
12-27-2009, 10:07 AM
It doesn't make much difference. Why would you think that just because a women sees your man naked that she would want him in anyway??????Guys will get naked extremely fast, so if she wanted someone I think its slim that she'd pick a prisoner. I would say its harder for a male to get another male naked if he wasn't into that, so I agree with the above poster-I'd be more worried about the male CO's looking.

It's more of an issue of propriety and custom for me. I'm actually a guy and I don't have a partner/spouse in prison...and in all certainty will never have one. :) But if we as a society have separate male and female washrooms in public areas, single-gender locker rooms and if it is not seen as appropriate for males or females to watch as members of the opposite gender wash themselves in a communal shower, then shouldn't this same sense of propriety also be extended to prisons?

Of course, there are societies where co-ed public nudity is the norm. In Finnish saunas, for example, there are both men and women sitting side-by-side entirely naked. But in our North American, Anglo-Saxon culture, this is not standard fare. I agree that men do tease/mock each other sexually as well, but of course it is inappropriate for COs to be engaging in this conduct. Yet out of a sense of dignity and propriety, male prisoners should not be seen naked by any female COs. They are not pre-pubescent little children in their mother's care, but grown men who should not be humiliated in this manner.

Onedaycloser13
12-27-2009, 10:20 AM
My question is in female prisoners under the same scrutiny as the males. Are there male guards watching them while they shower? I don't think males should be allowed with the females while they are otherwise fully dressed, and I think it should be the same for men!

Wooly Rhino
12-27-2009, 10:43 AM
It was my experience that the only time you were actually watch while showering was during your initial entry into prison. As this is the time where someone is most likely to bring something into the prison I can understand this. There was one female about those viewing and I am sure she did not have any sexual thought going on. I know that because she did not ask me to give her children right there. I have that effect on women.

If you are being watched showering constantly there is something else going on. There was one incident where the Female CO called out into the shower and asked the guy why he was taking so long. He said he was jacking off thinking about her. He got locked up for 30 days. When he got out he told her he had spent those 30 days jacking off thinking about her. She just laughed it off the second time.

Prison is about doing time and doing it a quickly as possible. Dont sweat the small stuff.

shannameek
12-27-2009, 11:03 AM
I totally agree with this because before they are anything they are women and if they see something they like they let those guys know. Alot of them are sexually deprived so when they see something long and strong you know they are definately checking it out. Yall feel me?

Shush
12-27-2009, 11:07 AM
my opinion: a good female officer is doing a good job, like a good female nurse does a good job with male patients.
and a lousy male officer is just that: a lousy male officer!

personal I prefer the correct female officer, even she is allowed to see the one I love naked and i am not..... but a correct officer is a good thing in prison, no matter if male or female.....

but if somebody finds a way to make those not so good ones leave, I would really agree, chuckle! (but both, females and males!)

Cutty's_Girl
12-27-2009, 12:18 PM
I agree with some of you in the sense that CO's (MALE OR FEMALE) shouldn't be in any area where inmates of the opposite sex are required to be naked. I think this leads to certain situations sometimes and if something goes down, who are they more prone to believe: the CO or the inmate. I just think to keep down some confusion, it shouldn't even be an issue: Male inmate/male CO Female inmate/female Co in the shower room.
Cutty tells me all the time about certain female CO's who like to check out the inmate's twigs and berries around the shower. Besides that, they might be locked up but they are still human beings and deserve some form of dignity.

neccomamma
12-27-2009, 12:45 PM
Unfortunately the corrections system is about taking away rights and dignity that those who are not incarcerated consider "basic". My personal opinion is that only CO's of the same sex should ever be in an area where inmates will be naked, but that opinion has nothing to do with the "rights" of the inmate and everything to do with safety issues.

I work in the medical field and when working with members of the opposite sex there should always be an "escort" that accompanies you when you will be preforming a procedure or exam that requires a patient to be in any stage of undress. This is done in order to protect both the personnel doing the procedure and the patient SHOULD any accusations of wrong doing be made.

As in everything there are exceptions to every rule and sometimes you have to make rules and regulations based on the lowest common denominator or "weakest link" because there are bad apples in every barrel.

Ravenslove
12-27-2009, 01:11 PM
There are enough things to worry about with our loved ones in prison this should be the least of our problems. Good female officers are just doing there job. The only time they are looking in the showers is to glance in and make sure there is no fighting or no one is being harmed. New people to this site always start this type of threads. Search for them they are a dime a dozen.

Daywalker
12-27-2009, 03:14 PM
This has been discussed many times, and my counter to this is that I suppose you are in favor of male only nurses too. I worked in the medical field, and if you are truly a professional, then there is nothing sexually charged or exciting about seeing a naked body. One is pretty much like the next.

Having fought for women to have equal rights, I do not agree with any sort of segregation in the job market. It's hard enough STILL having to take as much as 10% LESS pay than a male to do the same damned job, even when I can do it better, most of the time.

If a female can't be professional (or a male, in a females correction facility), then she should be dismissed, and that, should be that.

BlueEyedEllie
12-27-2009, 03:32 PM
This has been discussed many times, and my counter to this is that I suppose you are in favor of male only nurses too. I worked in the medical field, and if you are truly a professional, then there is nothing sexually charged or exciting about seeing a naked body. One is pretty much like the next.

Having fought for women to have equal rights, I do not agree with any sort of segregation in the job market. It's hard enough STILL having to take as much as 10% LESS pay than a male to do the same damned job, even when I can do it better, most of the time.

If a female can't be professional (or a male, in a females correction facility), then she should be dismissed, and that, should be that.
I was going to say the same thing. what about females working with naked males in hospitals and nursing homes??? I work in a nursing home and trust me i've seen it all. and if you think old men don't get rammy you are sadly mistaken!!! corrections is the same as anywhere. you have excellent,professional staff and some bad apples that should have been fired long ago!!!! this has never ever been a concern of mine in the least!!!

rupert81
12-27-2009, 03:47 PM
This has been discussed many times, and my counter to this is that I suppose you are in favor of male only nurses too. I worked in the medical field, and if you are truly a professional, then there is nothing sexually charged or exciting about seeing a naked body. One is pretty much like the next.

Having fought for women to have equal rights, I do not agree with any sort of segregation in the job market. It's hard enough STILL having to take as much as 10% LESS pay than a male to do the same damned job, even when I can do it better, most of the time.

If a female can't be professional (or a male, in a females correction facility), then she should be dismissed, and that, should be that.

It's not about a female CO's level of professionalism. If the female CO is perfectly professional, but the male prisoner still feels totally degraded for having to display himself naked in front of someone of the opposite gender, then there is a problem. If solving that problem involves gender segregation in some areas of the work place, then so be it, as this ultimately benefits people of either sex.

Yes, I would be in favour of male nurses tending to male patients if the necessary medical procedure involves nudity and if there are male nurses on duty at the time. I am also in favour of ensuring that male airport security staff only conduct pat down searches of travelers of their own gender. Moreover, I feel that Muslim women who are required to remove their veil for identification purposes while voting in elections be served by female elections staff, if they so request.

This isn't about taking away women's rights--I certainly support equal pay, regardless of gender. But what this is about is creating a compassionate and just society, where we do our best to ensure that our citizens live as dignified lives as possible, wherever they may have been and whatever they may have done.

Daywalker
12-27-2009, 04:32 PM
It's not about a female CO's level of professionalism. If the female CO is perfectly professional, but the male prisoner still feels totally degraded for having to display himself naked in front of someone of the opposite gender, then there is a problem. If solving that problem involves gender segregation in some areas of the work place, then so be it, as this ultimately benefits people of either sex.

Yes, I would be in favour of male nurses tending to male patients if the necessary medical procedure involves nudity and if there are male nurses on duty at the time. I am also in favour of ensuring that male airport security staff only conduct pat down searches of travelers of their own gender. Moreover, I feel that Muslim women who are required to remove their veil for identification purposes while voting in elections be served by female elections staff, if they so request.

This isn't about taking away women's rights--I certainly support equal pay, regardless of gender. But what this is about is creating a compassionate and just society, where we do our best to ensure that our citizens live as dignified lives as possible, wherever they may have been and whatever they may have done.

Personally, having had a spouse in prison, I would rather see more important things, like proper health care for inmates than worry about whether he felt "degraded" or "humiliated" because some female CO saw him naked. It was never a concern of mine, and I think too many people worry too much about some women seeing their man or vice versa.

sarahh7778
12-27-2009, 06:31 PM
Well, when you find a way to staff prisons with enough male officers so that female officers don't have to perform these kinds of jobs you should let the states know. Staffing is an issue and even during a recession institutions are still hiring because they are under staffed and there is always a need for male officers. My answer to the issue at hand of the subject matter being degrading is that maybe the man should have gone into corrections as a career so there would be more male officers to do these jobs instead of entering corrections as a resident.

t'slovingwife
12-27-2009, 06:45 PM
In my opinion, there are good cos both men and women. The issue can be that the female cos get involved with male inmates and male cos get involved with female inmates. Think of how many women here met their men while working in the facility where they are. Maybe they didn't see them naked--who knows? I know personally that any male doctor I have seen who needs to see any part of me naked always makes sure to be accompanied by a female nurse. It's just a precaution. I would like to think the same should be true of basic human dignity. I would not like being shook down by a male officer when I go to visit T. I feel like this about any situation. In my opinion, there are men who like that attention and women COs who do as well. For the rest of the group--majority--a little dignity would be nice. There are some people who will never agree with this because of their personal situations, but this is just my opinion.

NoOne1994
12-27-2009, 06:56 PM
I'm not concerned with male or female CO's seeing my love naked.

Oddly, I don't think male CO's should see female inmates showering though. I'm a hypocrite on this issue.

thugwife
12-27-2009, 07:10 PM
This subject is like beating a dead horse, over and over again. Its been asked thousands of times and hundreds of ways.

Aint nothin' ever gonna change its going to be that way FOREVER, so lets just get over it....:shrug:

The way I see it, the ladies (and some gentlemen) are MORE WORRIED about it than the people INSIDE, and if they was that damn worried they shouldnt got their ass locked up in the first place.

Perhaps, we should say "Edward, please dont break the law, I cant bare for a female CO to see you in the shower" (notice I used Edward, because I am a Twilighter :D )

DianeDavis
12-27-2009, 08:05 PM
What really surprised me is to find out that it is not uncommon for female officers to supervise male inmates while they shower and thus see them completely naked.

I agree that this is not right. Only male officers should supervise showers for male inmates.

Daywalker
12-27-2009, 08:13 PM
This subject is like beating a dead horse, over and over again. Its been asked thousands of times and hundreds of ways.

Aint nothin' ever gonna change its going to be that way FOREVER, so lets just get over it....:shrug:

The way I see it, the ladies (and some gentlemen) are MORE WORRIED about it than the people INSIDE, and if they was that damn worried they shouldnt got their ass locked up in the first place.

Perhaps, we should say "Edward, please dont break the law, I cant bare for a female CO to see you in the shower" (notice I used Edward, because I am a Twilighter :D )

As usual Thuggy, you hit the nail on the head. I see more people out here complaining about it than I hear it from anyone I write to, or heard it from my husband. And I find that the more hub-bub there is about someone seeing him naked, generally, the more jealous and insecure the relationship is anyway. I really couldn't have given a fig who saw mine naked while he was in there, he wasn't going anywhere, and didn't have any interest in anyone in there, so I had nothing to worry about. And for those doing a long haul, you're going to have plenty to worry about, and believe me, this, is nothing in the long run.

kanae21406
12-27-2009, 08:21 PM
i was a CO at a prison before and trust me on this most of us women are not "looking" at these men when they take showers or whatever. we have to deal with them jacking and thats bad enough. My baby was at my facility before and in the same building i worked in and never once did i try to look at him in that fashion. i respected him and myself more than that. this issue will never go away because of understaffing and a majority of the correctional officers in most facilities are women now days. we need good people to step up and work in these places. but also they tend to keep a lot of the bad apples and get rid of the good workers. i was always firm fair and consistant like they taught us in training and i respected the inmates like humans rather than animals like some did out there and they respected me because i respected them but i got reprimanded for being pro inmate or bcause i was a favorite i got accused of being "dirty" on a regular basis. but the shower thing i dont think many on either side really worry too much about it because they get used to it

sarahh7778
12-27-2009, 10:41 PM
I read this thread to my hunny tonight and he laughed and said "The question should really be what kind of dude rather have another dude watch him shower...that would really be more degrading for me."
So for anyone new to this, don't worry yourself about things like this...prison showers are not anything like a bodywash commerical with a high class shower head and sexy loofah sponge! :)

MiyraruAku
12-27-2009, 11:04 PM
I understand this is like beating a dead horse but hey, it lets people vent their concerns.

Personally I see all sides of the argument so I just shrug my shoulders. If there was no men at my checkpoint, I would have to pat down a male. Which means I would have to touch his "personal area". Would it bother me? No, it is like rubbing down old people in the shower. I have to contain myself not to get gross out XD

J&D7
12-28-2009, 12:38 AM
I honestly dont really care. I mean, where do you draw the line? Not all female COs are unprofessional. If they do their job right, then good for them I say.

Are you going to stop a female doctor from examining your man?

The way I see it, he's going to be around women ALL HIS LIFE. So I dont see the difference in prison.

Johanna Denise
12-28-2009, 01:24 AM
I decided to start this new thread after reading about the prevalence of female correctional officers in male prisons in another post. What really surprised me is to find out that it is not uncommon for female officers to supervise male inmates while they shower and thus see them completely naked. Not only is this totally degrading to male prisoners, but it is a situation that will almost certainly lead to behavioural/disciplinary problems. I imagine that some of the males that feel degraded in this manner will then strike back through various forms of lewd behaviour or sexual misconduct directed at the female officers.

In a prison environment, there is unfortunately no way for an inmate to avoid instances of forced public nudity, whether in the communal shower or during strip searches. But the least a prison can do to preserve a minimal level of dignity for inmates is to ensure that only male correctional officers see them when they are naked. I wonder if anyone has ever lobbied or petitioned for this.
I dont think it makes a difference whether it's a female or male CO. They have a job to do. I worry about other things going on in there and female CO's staring at my dude when he's takin a shower is not on the top of my list. I can see why as a women some would worry about this but honestly it has never crossed my mind.

orchidia_168
12-28-2009, 02:18 AM
my ex husband was taking his shower with his boxers on. he always told me it was about courtesy and that only old timers were taking their showers butt naked.
i assume that in many other facilities inmates are wearing their boxers too while taking their showers.

soon2Bsentenced
12-28-2009, 02:36 AM
I agree.

TyronesWife
12-28-2009, 08:55 AM
I haven't read this whole thread so forgive me if I repeat anything but from a former female in a male prison point of view: If I never had to see an inmate in the shower it would not have bothered me one bit. The last thing I wanted to do was see a bunch of strangers in all of their glory. However there are two points that have to be understood, 1) as someone else said it's about staffing. There are just not enough male officers to go around; and 2) I do believe that inmates should have common courtesy and dignity but if the worst thing that happens to them is that some female has seen them showering then honestly they got off pretty light. When I consider the numerous degrading and cruel things that DOC staff has been known too do in the past I would count my blessings if Tyrone didn't have any horror stories except that chick that saw him soaping up.

Mayone
12-28-2009, 09:25 AM
I think it should only be men that see them naked unless it is medical.

PhilB
12-29-2009, 04:01 AM
There is no problem as long as the mixed sex in showers applies everyone. Female COs in male showers and male COs in womans showers. Would you want a male CO watching your wife or daughter taking a shower? I would think NOT. This would be discrimination to have two different standards.
I've been in prison and have to wonder why at shower time certain female COs would make a point of filling in at the control booth in view of the mens showers. If a male CO filled in at the female showers they would call it perverted.

Miss Esme
12-29-2009, 05:46 AM
To be honest my baby is not really bothered. There are so many other things to contend with rather then worrying if the lady co saw his johnson.

Daywalker
12-29-2009, 05:48 AM
There is no problem as long as the mixed sex in showers applies everyone. Female COs in male showers and male COs in womans showers. Would you want a male CO watching your wife or daughter taking a shower? I would think NOT. This would be discrimination to have two different standards.
I've been in prison and have to wonder why at shower time certain female COs would make a point of filling in at the control booth in view of the mens showers. If a male CO filled in at the female showers they would call it perverted.

With all the important things to worry about with a loved one in prison, I can honestly say that the idea that a female might have seen him in the shower, didn't cross my mind until I started reading all of the paranoid posts on here. I can also honestly say that I wouldn't have a problem if a male CO was overseeing a shower that my daughter happened to be in. Prison isn't supposed to be "nice", and I trust that the CO's will be professional, no matter their equipment. I just know that when my husband was in, whether some female guard saw his parts, or even whether said female guard was making comments or passes at him, were the absolute LEAST of things I needed to worry about.

Honestly, if you just have to have something to worry about, how about worrying about the quality and quantities of food vs nutrition, or how about worrying if they have decent and sane medical care? All this hub-bub over showers, really???

BlueEyedEllie
12-29-2009, 05:54 AM
my ex husband was taking his shower with his boxers on. he always told me it was about courtesy and that only old timers were taking their showers butt naked.
i assume that in many other facilities inmates are wearing their boxers too while taking their showers.

ha,i thought that marc was the only one that did this!!! and it is NOT because of female c/o's!!!!!

only1love
12-29-2009, 03:52 PM
With all the important things to worry about with a loved one in prison, I can honestly say that the idea that a female might have seen him in the shower, didn't cross my mind until I started reading all of the paranoid posts on here. I can also honestly say that I wouldn't have a problem if a male CO was overseeing a shower that my daughter happened to be in. Prison isn't supposed to be "nice", and I trust that the CO's will be professional, no matter their equipment. I just know that when my husband was in, whether some female guard saw his parts, or even whether said female guard was making comments or passes at him, were the absolute LEAST of things I needed to worry about.

Honestly, if you just have to have something to worry about, how about worrying about the quality and quantities of food vs nutrition, or how about worrying if they have decent and sane medical care? All this hub-bub over showers, really???

I actually agree with both sides! Reason? Well, I have yet to run into a professional guard of either sex, and that is as the visitor! I shudder to think of what the ones behind the doors are like. It would seem to me that you would want to put your best folks out there with the visitors.
If I ever run into one that has an ounce of manners or decorum, I would be the first to let you know.

Instead what I saw was people with an "agenda", twisted thoughts toward the families and to me that spells "NO GOOD" when the visits are over.

I also agree that medical care and lack of it should take priority. Horrible food that lacks any resemblence to the basic four food groups is also a huge priority. Degrading inmates, punishing them even pre-trial is a huge issue that is constantly dumped to the bottom of the barrel.

There is no doubt in my mind that the female officers do their jobs knowing that they can get away with stuff. In fact, 3 federal female officers assured me that any and all complaints are disregarded and just part of the job. Pathetic!

As a nurse who is very professional, I resent any reference to any guard being remotely similar. There is simply no comparison. Nurses are TRAINED in how to undress and examine male patients ( females too for that matter ). They are given extensive training in what to do and what not to do if a physical reaction occurs. It is the result of involuntary response and NOT something the inmate did at the site of the guard. One should not flatter themselves in that way!

If I ever see a training manual to prove me wrong, I will post a huge apology, but until then it is like comparing an exotic dancer to a ballerina!

No inmate male or female should be mocked, looked upon, commented upon by anyone, ever and it is huge and it is wrong.

And just for the record, to my knowledge Robert has not experienced this female-gauking episode. His stuff was far worse.

Daywalker
12-29-2009, 04:07 PM
Not all female guards are working there with an 'agenda'. My best female friend, was an FBOP guard as well as a US Marshall flying Con-Air. She said she got way more out of line comments from the male inmates than anything she saw the other way around.

At the time, she was fresh out of the Army, she is 4 ft nothing, and probably weighed 120. Just for reference, I'm 5'8" , better than 200, and even in my best physical condition, I wouldn't mess with her, because she would put me flat on my ass.

Every institution, every profession, including nursing, is going to have good and bad people in it. I can't tell you how many nurses I have known trying to be Mrs. Doctor somebody, having sex in the broom closets, in empty exam rooms, where ever they think they won't get caught.

As to prisons, all of my experiences were extremely positive. The only time I ever saw someone get out of line, it was a visitor, and I have to give the lady guard credit, because I would have bounced her and her nasty mouth right out the door.

LM's Tinkerbell
12-29-2009, 04:07 PM
My Boo has been in long enough to not even trip on stuff like this. What ever they put him through it is what it is. The only time he gets mad is when they disrespect me or his family. I had a CO (female) tell me my Boo had a cute ass, she always messes with me, and tries to provoke some reaction. The last time I just agreed and said it is adorable isn't it. There are good and bad CO's everywhere. Some are good people just doing their job, and others well we all know about them. Prison is horrible, not at all productive or rehabilitative, but here we all are trying to make the best out of a horrible situation.

Kemo'sWife
12-30-2009, 01:01 AM
I don't even wanna think bout this cuz I will flip out.

WifenMotherof4
12-30-2009, 10:47 PM
I agree! I am not insecure in the least, but let me find out a CO is making comments to my hubby or gawking at him in the shower! She will be reported in a heartbeat!

DiscreetWoman
01-02-2010, 09:58 PM
I have a hard time believing female CO's would be seeing male inmates shower and get naked.. do you see male CO's watching female inmates showering? There is no way anyone would go for that, especially with the boorish and offensive behavior alot of the male CO's exhibit towards their female counterparts- I wouldnt think that females seeing the male inmates shower would continue if the inmates all objected to it and the media was notified. The Director of DOC should not be authorizing this.

Mrs.Garcia04
01-02-2010, 11:41 PM
My question is in female prisoners under the same scrutiny as the males. Are there male guards watching them while they shower? I don't think males should be allowed with the females while they are otherwise fully dressed, and I think it should be the same for men!

I agree! I get so mad reading about all these inside relationships!

sweetgirlb
01-03-2010, 12:59 AM
because she IS a pervert/ I find this horribly unacceptable.


There is no problem as long as the mixed sex in showers applies everyone. Female COs in male showers and male COs in womans showers. Would you want a male CO watching your wife or daughter taking a shower? I would think NOT. This would be discrimination to have two different standards.
I've been in prison and have to wonder why at shower time certain female COs would make a point of filling in at the control booth in view of the mens showers. If a male CO filled in at the female showers they would call it perverted.

Alexius
01-06-2010, 07:55 AM
I think that this must be an American thing. Most people outside the US are appalled that this is allowed - it is certainly not allowed in the UK or anywhere that I know of in Europe. It`s simply a matter of human dignity. The fact that men `get used to it` is not an answer. A man can get used to being beaten - I have read how women tortured in South America `got used` to being raped - it doesn`t make it right.

All prison systems are short-staffed - yet nearly everyone else in the world manages to work round it and allow male prisoners the dignity and privacy that is rightly enjoyed by females. As a great admirer of the United States and all that it represents in the world, I remain shocked at this violation of fundamental human rights.

Scott
01-06-2010, 05:29 PM
I have a hard time believing female CO's would be seeing male inmates shower and get naked.. do you see male CO's watching female inmates showering? There is no way anyone would go for that, especially with the boorish and offensive behavior alot of the male CO's exhibit towards their female counterparts- I wouldnt think that females seeing the male inmates shower would continue if the inmates all objected to it and the media was notified. The Director of DOC should not be authorizing this.

Honestly, in our state with the budget crisis being what it is, and a number of looming issues effecting prisons like food, maintenance costs, crumbling buildings, etc., seeing people of the opposite gender in the showers is WAY, way, WAY down the list of priorities anyone cares about.

AS a former inmate, if a female officer was in the shower area (rarely happened anyway) when I was showering, whatEVER...as a grown up I really don't care one bit.

And (related to other posts) I always thought showering in undershorts was stupid and usually done by people who don't have much to be proud of. Anyone who thinks that it's somehow a "courtesy" to other people have never belonged to a gym, or been in the military. No one cares - but it's true that a lot of guys have issues about their equipment.

Scott
01-06-2010, 05:38 PM
I think that this must be an American thing. Most people outside the US are appalled that this is allowed - it is certainly not allowed in the UK or anywhere that I know of in Europe...I remain shocked at this violation of fundamental human rights.

I'm a little surprised - having traveled quite a bit in Europe - the attitudes about nudity are very relaxed, much more so than here in the US. I remember being in a large group shower in a Turkish Bath House, where there were woman attendants and female massage staff. No one paid anyone else the slightest attention.

I have found that Europeans don't sexualize nudity the same way Americans do - it's just a body, and we all have one. A quick visit to almost any beach, with the topless women and tiny speedo shorted men would confirm that modesty is not a universal European trait.

I*Heart*Harry
01-06-2010, 05:56 PM
my bf showers with his boxers on and says most guys do, and if they dont then theres something wrong with them. Forget the CO's the other inmates seem to be more of an issue as far as he is concerned.

spoiled210
01-06-2010, 07:05 PM
And (related to other posts) I always thought showering in undershorts was stupid and usually done by people who don't have much to be proud of. Anyone who thinks that it's somehow a "courtesy" to other people have never belonged to a gym, or been in the military. No one cares - but it's true that a lot of guys have issues about their equipment

I know my husband showers with his boxers and he has absolutley no reason to have issues about his equipment. He isnt there to show off his equipment. This is just his preference. Honestly from what he has told me most of the guys where he is at shower with boxers on.

IrishFire
01-06-2010, 07:14 PM
I admit, I didn't read every post, but here's my two cents.

Men aren't nearly as modest as women are. As a mother to three sons, and the wife of a husband who "taught them well," I still don't understand the pride in passing gas or belching so loud the window rattle. But, they do! How many times have you been out with your girls and y'all just shared your intestional issues?

Also, most men think they look a whole lot better than they do, so I suspect at least some of them, think they look so good the females can't help but check them out - reality is usually a bit different. Being a size 34 waist doesn't count if you wear it below the gut.

Now let me say, I can appreciate the male body as much as the next gal, but for me personally, the naked body of a male doesn't rev my motor. Put him in a pair of jeans, his shirt thrown over his shoulder and those six-pack abs do the trick.

Of course some men are modest and they probably are showering in their boxers or whatever makes them feel comfortable.

Remember, men are more visual oriented than women. In that respect, I can see where having a male CO in a women's shower area may cause feelings of being uncomfortable. Heck, when I was in the boot camp (USAF) the hardest thing for me was having to shower with other women!
Men and women are just wired differently. Maybe not PC, but it is the truth.

I'm not going to concern myself with that unless I'm told I have reason to.

PhilB
01-06-2010, 11:43 PM
IrishFire is right, men and women are wired differently. Just read "Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus".
However in regards to guys not wanting to totally strip for a shower I knew one guy who had a bad VD infection which would show so he wore his shorts. I saw another guy go into a private one man shower stall that had a partial door to block the view of any privates wearing his shirt and pants. He took the shower fully dressed and then walked back to his cell dripping all over the floor. Now that is what I call MODEST. After they told him he couldn't shower in his clothes he quit taking showers. Eventually he started taking real showers but it was really hard for him.

Alexius
01-07-2010, 04:37 AM
I'm a little surprised - having traveled quite a bit in Europe - the attitudes about nudity are very relaxed, much more so than here in the US. I remember being in a large group shower in a Turkish Bath House, where there were woman attendants and female massage staff. No one paid anyone else the slightest attention.

I have found that Europeans don't sexualize nudity the same way Americans do - it's just a body, and we all have one. A quick visit to almost any beach, with the topless women and tiny speedo shorted men would confirm that modesty is not a universal European trait.



Your point is well made. What I would say is that this is not universally the case in Europe - I have travvelled widely there too, and would say that the majority of Europeans have very similar attitudes to Americans about nudity before the opposite sex. Besides in the cases you cite the nudity is voluntary.

sarahh7778
01-07-2010, 10:20 PM
my bf showers with his boxers on and says most guys do, and if they dont then theres something wrong with them.

Why do you think a guy showering without boxers on would define them as having something wrong with them?

There are many prisons with curtains in showers, and even if there wasn't, I don't assume something is wrong with inmates who choose to shower without boxers. After taking a crap for years in front of a celly or being stripped search on a regular, I doubt most guys care if their booty is buck in the shower. In the shower their stuff is facing the wall anyhow, with the exception of the few how go out of their way to give a squirrel show.

I*Heart*Harry
01-07-2010, 11:42 PM
Why do you think a guy showering without boxers on would define them as having something wrong with them?

There are many prisons with curtains in showers, and even if there wasn't, I don't assume something is wrong with inmates who choose to shower without boxers. After taking a crap for years in front of a celly or being stripped search on a regular, I doubt most guys care if their booty is buck in the shower. In the shower their stuff is facing the wall anyhow, with the exception of the few how go out of their way to give a squirrel show.


I didnt say that, he did. And what you assume or what I would assume really wouldnt matter because we arent there living it day to day. There are certain "rules" and "codes" that we dont have a concept of out here. I would guess where he is at that they do not have enclosed showers and if I had to guess it would mean that if you dont wear your boxers then you can be assumed to be looking for action to some degree. Most straight guys find no humor in that. In the urinals a guy is not supposed to come up next to another guy, he is supposed to go one over. My BF got in a fight with a guy for coming up next to him to pee when there were plenty of other places to go and they were the only two in there. Not hard to figure out why... and there is a huge difference between being strip searched, put out naked in the yard with the other guys and showers/urinals...

sarahh7778
01-08-2010, 12:19 AM
You stated that:
my bf showers with his boxers on and says most guys do, and if they dont then theres something wrong with them.

With your comma use it didn't read as you bf said anything more than most guys do shower with boxers.

If it really didn't matter what PTO members assumed, thought, speculated, or questioned about prison issues then there would be no need for this site. I just questioned why you would make a statement about something being wrong with guys that don't shower in boxers. I worked for DOC for years and have a very good concept of prison rules and codes. Why
are strip searches so different? Over time, after being stripped searched in front of others, using the toilet in front of others, squatting and coughing while some other guy checks your hole out, and every other humiliating act inmates have to endure; being naked in the shower is a norm rather than an issue.

They can choose to wear boxers or not to wear them, I was merely questioning why your post said something would be wrong with guys that choose not too.

I didnt say that, he did. And what you assume or what I would assume really wouldnt matter because we arent there living it day to day. There are certain "rules" and "codes" that we dont have a concept of out here. I would guess where he is at that they do not have enclosed showers and if I had to guess it would mean that if you dont wear your boxers then you can be assumed to be looking for action to some degree. Most straight guys find no humor in that. In the urinals a guy is not supposed to come up next to another guy, he is supposed to go one over. My BF got in a fight with a guy for coming up next to him to pee when there were plenty of other places to go and they were the only two in there. Not hard to figure out why... and there is a huge difference between being strip searched, put out naked in the yard with the other guys and showers/urinals...

Scott
01-08-2010, 01:10 AM
Why do you think a guy showering without boxers on would define them as having something wrong with them?

There are many prisons with curtains in showers, and even if there wasn't, I don't assume something is wrong with inmates who choose to shower without boxers. After taking a crap for years in front of a celly or being stripped search on a regular, I doubt most guys care if their booty is buck in the shower. In the shower their stuff is facing the wall anyhow, with the exception of the few how go out of their way to give a squirrel show.

Yep - been there, done that. My sentiments exactly. The whole shower while partially dressed thing has its roots in deeper psych stuff, not just "modesty". I'm not saying that's a bad thing or a good thing...it's just an awareness that it's a peculiar behavior. When I first went to prison in 1975, you never, ever saw anyone in the showers with their shorts on - with the only exception of Orthadox Jews (And there's not many of those inside), and the very occasional devout Muslim. They have specific religious reasons.

Most prisons now are moving towards enclosed, "obstructed" showers, so for many places the issue is moot. Not that it matters anyway, people are free to shower as they please.

BlueEyedEllie
01-08-2010, 06:14 AM
Yep - been there, done that. My sentiments exactly. The whole shower while partially dressed thing has its roots in deeper psych stuff, not just "modesty". I'm not saying that's a bad thing or a good thing...it's just an awareness that it's a peculiar behavior. When I first went to prison in 1975, you never, ever saw anyone in the showers with their shorts on - with the only exception of Orthadox Jews (And there's not many of those inside), and the very occasional devout Muslim. They have specific religious reasons.

Most prisons now are moving towards enclosed, "obstructed" showers, so for many places the issue is moot. Not that it matters anyway, people are free to shower as they please.
What deeper psych stuff???? :hmm:

Scott
01-08-2010, 11:18 AM
What deeper psych stuff???? :hmm:

Well, you asked...

Men have as many body image problems as women do. Much of this stems from a variety of root causes including, but not limited to;

Fear of being compared to an established norm and coming up lacking.
Residual Trama from Circumcision.
Homophobia - or inverse-homophobia (where you are afraid that if you get an errection while showering, a normal thing for men, that others will think you're queer).
Any number of personal feelings of inadequacy or insecurities (Many men never think they have enough of anything.) One women in this thread wrote, "My BF has nothing to be ashamed of..." and while she may think that is true, and it may well be, what he thinks about himself is what defines his behavior.
An established sense of shame that may have been established in early childhood by emotionally immature parents, about their bodies being "dirty" or "naughty..."

Interesting article here about the whole circumcision thing...
http://www.cirp.org/library/psych/boyle6/

In Gemmell and Boyle's (2001) survey, involuntary circumcision impacted negatively on various psychological measures. They found that as compared with genitally intact men, circumcised men were often unhappy about being circumcised, experienced significant anger, sadness, feeling incomplete, cheated, hurt, concerned, frustrated, abnormal, and violated (cf. Hammond, 1999). They also found that circumcised men reported lower self-esteem than did genitally intact respondents.

Rhinehart (1999) stated that psychological problems were almost universally noted by his self-selected circumcised respondents. These included reports of a sense of personal powerlessness, fears of being overpowered and victimised, lack of trust, a sense of vulnerability to violent attack, guardedness in relationships, reluctance to have relationships with women, defensiveness, diminished sense of masculinity, feeling damaged, sense of reduced penile size or amputation, low self-esteem, shame about not "measuring up," anger and violence towards women, irrational rage reactions, addictions and dependencies, difficulties in establishing intimate relationships, emotional numbing, a need for greater intensity in sexual experiences, decreased intimacy, decreased ability to communicate, as well as feelings of not being understood.

Hammond's (1997) sample of circumcised men reported emotional harm (83%), physical harm (82%), general psychological harm (75%), and low self-esteem (74%). The circumcised men frequently reported feeling mutilated (62%), unwhole (61%), resentful (60%), abnormal/unnatural (60%), that one's human rights had been infringed (60%), angry (54%), frustrated (53%), violated (50%), inferior to genitally intact males (47%), impeded sexually (43%), and betrayed by one's parents (34%). Similar findings emerged from a larger sample of 546 circumcised men studied by Hammond (1999).

Also, there's the comparison issue; men are always comparing themselves to other men to see how they measure up (no pun intended). Dr. David Bernhardt, a specialist in pediatrics and sports medicine at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, speculated that the boys, bombarded by images of highly buffed male bodies, were feeling comparatively inadequate and thus more reluctant to let their own bodies be seen. Studies show, he added, that up to 11 percent of high school boys used anabolic steroids. "The No. 1 reason cited by the boys," Bernhardt told the NY Times, "is body image."

This also relates to the "workout" ethic of men in prison. There's even a term "prison body", which refers to a huge upper body and skinny legs. The upper body is what people see, and can thus compare to. The legs, not so much. Men are trying to compare themselves with some kind of unrealistic ideal (sound familiar gals?). The men in Calvin Klein ads are Adonises and many of us would like to look like that, but just genetics dictate it isn't going to happen.

Men in prison (IMHO) are a very sensitive lot...you may have noticed in your own interaction with your SO, BF, Husband, Spouse, or whatever, that they will sometimes over-react to something you say, or do (Oh boy, is that an understatement!) There's a lot of feeling in prison, although it is hardly ever articulated, that inmates are somehow "failures" or "inadequate" in some way. Guys I know see other men (and, in fact, the majority of other men) with regular lives, jobs and families, with houses and mortgages, having accomplished something. They know, at some level, that those kinds of ideals are, at least at present, unavailable to them. So, from that (and this is an extreme simplification) any sense of inadequacy they may have at a sub or pre-conscious level, is reinforced. This too translates into body image issues and the need to limit any more feelings of inadequacy or anxiety about their inadequacy.

I gave some thought to how much time I wanted to spend on this thread, but I think it's important in the prison context because it represents the map that many men have created about themselves - and how it focuses on who they're not, rather than whatever potential they have, or "who they could be".

BlueEyedEllie
01-08-2010, 11:25 AM
Well, you asked...

Men have as many body image problems as women do. Much of this stems from a variety of root causes including, but not limited to;

Fear of being compared to an established norm and coming up lacking.
Residual Trama from Circumcision.
Homophobia - or inverse-homophobia (where you are afraid that if you get an errection while showering, a normal thing for men, that others will think you're queer).
Any number of personal feelings of inadequacy or insecurities (Many men never think they have enough of anything.) One women in this thread wrote, "My BF has nothing to be ashamed of..." and while she may think that is true, and it may well be, what he thinks about himself is what defines his behavior.
An established sense of shame that may have been established in early childhood by emotionally immature parents, about their bodies being "dirty" or "naughty..."

Interesting article here about the whole circumcision thing...
http://www.cirp.org/library/psych/boyle6/



Also, there's the comparison issue; men are always comparing themselves to other men to see how they measure up (no pun intended). Dr. David Bernhardt, a specialist in pediatrics and sports medicine at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, speculated that the boys, bombarded by images of highly buffed male bodies, were feeling comparatively inadequate and thus more reluctant to let their own bodies be seen. Studies show, he added, that up to 11 percent of high school boys used anabolic steroids. "The No. 1 reason cited by the boys," Bernhardt told the NY Times, "is body image."

This also relates to the "workout" ethic of men in prison. There's even a term "prison body", which refers to a huge upper body and skinny legs. The upper body is what people see, and can thus compare to. The legs, not so much. Men are trying to compare themselves with some kind of unrealistic ideal (sound familiar gals?). The men in Calvin Klein ads are Adonises and many of us would like to look like that, but just genetics dictate it isn't going to happen.

Men in prison (IMHO) are a very sensitive lot...you may have noticed in your own interaction with your SO, BF, Husband, Spouse, or whatever, that they will sometimes over-react to something you say, or do (Oh boy, is that an understatement!) There's a lot of feeling in prison, although it is hardly ever articulated, that inmates are somehow "failures" or "inadequate" in some way. Guys I know see other men (and, in fact, the majority of other men) with regular lives, jobs and families, with houses and mortgages, having accomplished something. They know, at some level, that those kinds of ideals are, at least at present, unavailable to them. So, from that (and this is an extreme simplification) any sense of inadequacy they may have at a sub or pre-conscious level, is reinforced. This too translates into body image issues and the need to limit any more feelings of inadequacy or anxiety about their inadequacy.

I gave some thought to how much time I wanted to spend on this thread, but I think it's important in the prison context because it represents the map that many men have created about themselves - and how it focuses on who they're not, rather than whatever potential they have, or "who they could be".
my,my,my :rolleyes: the ONLY reason my man started wearing boxers in the shower was because another inmate complimented the size of his you know what. he punched him and thankfully he wasn't caught.but to avoid future trouble he just started wearing boxers.heck,i'd probably do the same thing!!he's not insecure about his size or anything else.his reason is pretty much cut and dry.thanks though for your opinion!!

I*Heart*Harry
01-08-2010, 01:33 PM
I agree with marcsbeth, and think this whole modesty or size issue is absurd. It seems more about being perceived as "gay" or not and when you are put out naked in the yard with other guys there is no perceived come ons as opposed to someone looking at you in the shower.. its pretty easy to see that difference. To the person who said she worked for the DOC for years.. great, but you still dont get it and by commenting on my comma use its pretty easy to see why. Stay on your side of the fence. Enough said.

ghostgirl7389
01-08-2010, 02:55 PM
I think a persons opinion on this matter stems from several factors, insecurities, or even how you view the DOC in general. I don't have a problem with the whole issue because I see it as a group of people doing their job, nothing more, nothing less. My husband broke the law, and was sent to a place that at times is going to put him in uncomfortable situations he wouldn't otherwise be in. If I worried about women, then I'd have to worry about homosexuals. If they got rid of both, I guess there would be something else to worry about.

Like daywalker has said, there are far more pressing issues concerning our prison system. When you focus on inconsequential ones, you miss the bigger picture.

HisAngel2
01-08-2010, 03:29 PM
[quote=Shush;5131416]my opinion: a good female officer is doing a good job, like a good female nurse does a good job with male patients.
and a lousy male officer is just that: a lousy male officer!quote]

Great point! My nephew works in the ER and he sees boobies and cootchies all day long but that doesn't mean he wants to mount his patients! He is doing his job plain and simple. Many COs conduct themselves in the same professional manner.

kspag
01-08-2010, 03:55 PM
My baby said that when a female Co is on duty, they are not allowed to use the first two stalls in the showers where she could see them pretty much nude. So they use the other stalls which have walls from the chest down. I dont know if he showers in his boxers but he said he does wash his boxers in the shower so he always has a clean pair.

heaven_lee_2008
01-08-2010, 04:11 PM
I decided to start this new thread after reading about the prevalence of female correctional officers in male prisons in another post. What really surprised me is to find out that it is not uncommon for female officers to supervise male inmates while they shower and thus see them completely naked. Not only is this totally degrading to male prisoners, but it is a situation that will almost certainly lead to behavioural/disciplinary problems. I imagine that some of the males that feel degraded in this manner will then strike back through various forms of lewd behaviour or sexual misconduct directed at the female officers.

In a prison environment, there is unfortunately no way for an inmate to avoid instances of forced public nudity, whether in the communal shower or during strip searches. But the least a prison can do to preserve a minimal level of dignity for inmates is to ensure that only male correctional officers see them when they are naked. I wonder if anyone has ever lobbied or petitioned for this.

I totally agree...if a male officer were to see female prisoners naked then there would be a big stink!!! But, there is a double standard where female CO's and the male inmates are concerned. There should not be that double standard.

sarahh7778
01-09-2010, 12:08 PM
I agree with marcsbeth, and think this whole modesty or size issue is absurd. It seems more about being perceived as "gay" or not and when you are put out naked in the yard with other guys there is no perceived come ons as opposed to someone looking at you in the shower.. its pretty easy to see that difference. To the person who said she worked for the DOC for years.. great, but you still dont get it and by commenting on my comma use its pretty easy to see why. Stay on your side of the fence. Enough said.

You make no sense and still haven't explained the whole statement that started this. Try not to take things so personal, and thanks for the fence reminder, I tell my child the same thing everyday.

Sabra123
01-09-2010, 12:21 PM
To me there is a big difference between the health care professional industry and this one. Confidentiality, privacy and maintaining dignity are systematic standards even with orderlies. You can get fired for minor breeches. Also patients have a choice to refuse if they feel uncomfortable. That is not the case here. An inmate cannot refuse.

If I went for a visit to a prison and had to be patted down to get in, I would expect someone from the same sex to do that (that is how it is done at airports). And they would probably accommodate me. I would only be okay with opposite sex COs in these circumstances if the inmate had the right of refusal like the rest of us do.

TyronesWife
01-09-2010, 04:36 PM
To me there is a big difference between the health care professional industry and this one. Confidentiality, privacy and maintaining dignity are systematic standards even with orderlies. You can get fired for minor breeches.

You can in corrections too.

Also patients have a choice to refuse if they feel uncomfortable. That is not the case here.

Sure they do, inmates had the choice to stay out of prison but they decided to do whatever it was that got them locked up.

Sabra123
01-10-2010, 01:40 PM
Sure they do, inmates had the choice to stay out of prison but they decided to do whatever it was that got them locked up.

Actually that can and unfortunately typically is the "rationale" for almost every human right violation...it's okay because they did something to deserve it (e.g. stuff done in Gitmo). I would respectfully assert that the prison industry has very little accountability than most other industries. In fact, that is usually the number one complaint for groups involved in any sort of prison reform work.

I think at a minimum, our domestic prisons should be expected to adhere at least to the standards of something like the Geneva Convention. While it isn't as egregious as other abuses, "forced nudity" has been officially classified as a violation under the category of degradation and humiliation. There are security-based exceptions but even then it can't be humilating (and having an opposite sex see you can be defined that way).

Probably as people here have said, most inmates probably don't care, but those that do care (I'm thinking of Muslims for example or the increasing number of nonviolent peace activists--most of these folks are nuns and priests-- who end up doing "Hard Time"' because of civil disobedience), should have the choice to have a bit of dignity in this regard.

I will concede your point though that they are transgressors. I'm just arguing that it is not relevant because as a society we have already recognized there are basic rights and dignity that even apply to the guilty. We should expect the prison system to simply adhere to them.

TyronesWife
01-11-2010, 08:24 AM
Sure they do, inmates had the choice to stay out of prison but they decided to do whatever it was that got them locked up.

Actually that can and unfortunately typically is the "rationale" for almost every human right violation...it's okay because they did something to deserve it (e.g. stuff done in Gitmo). I would respectfully assert that the prison industry has very little accountability than most other industries. In fact, that is usually the number one complaint for groups involved in any sort of prison reform work.

I think at a minimum, our domestic prisons should be expected to adhere at least to the standards of something like the Geneva Convention. While it isn't as egregious as other abuses, "forced nudity" has been officially classified as a violation under the category of degradation and humiliation. There are security-based exceptions but even then it can't be humilating (and having an opposite sex see you can be defined that way).

Probably as people here have said, most inmates probably don't care, but those that do care (I'm thinking of Muslims for example or the increasing number of nonviolent peace activists--most of these folks are nuns and priests-- who end up doing "Hard Time"' because of civil disobedience), should have the choice to have a bit of dignity in this regard.

I will concede your point though that they are transgressors. I'm just arguing that it is not relevant because as a society we have already recognized there are basic rights and dignity that even apply to the guilty. We should expect the prison system to simply adhere to them.

Please don't misunderstand, I don't in anyway believe that just because they committed a crime they should be stripped of their basic rights as human beings. But I do believe the line needs to be drawn somewhere. They should be treated as human beings but deciding who gets to guard them is a luxery that should not be provided. They knew that officers of the opposite gender work in prison yet decided to take the chance of going in. Now if they were not allowed to cover up then I would be all in about not allowing females in a male shower area but that is not the case here. I don't personally know of a rule in any institution that says an inmate cannot shower in his boxers or put a towel up over their lower half as a makeshift shower curtain. My thing is they have options and to take females out of the loop will cause serious understaffing which in turn puts staff and inmates at risk. I'd rather Tyrone be safe then worry about some woman who may or may not have seen him soaping up.

ghostgirl7389
01-15-2010, 02:53 AM
Sure they do, inmates had the choice to stay out of prison but they decided to do whatever it was that got them locked up.

I just high fived you.

thehappypen
01-15-2010, 09:49 PM
I dont care if it is a male or female CO seeing him naked. Im sure neither one of them is getting anything out of it. Its their job and they see enough of them that it doesnt even phase them. Its not like my guy is flaunting it to them anyway haha.

ant's wife
01-15-2010, 10:39 PM
i guess i should fire my gyno then cause he's a man and he sees alot more than the woman co's he even gets to feel.

MCCX123
06-14-2010, 05:00 AM
I'm a CO. I/M's have the option of covering up with boxers, undies, and in some cases placing a towel around their private organs in the process. That's how it is in the facilites I've worked in, and am sure it's the norm abroad. So, simply put: It's not like we MAKE them go completely nude for their entire slotted shower time, they have options. The simple fix would be to just cover up. And even if that wasn't the case, I'd still support the Female CO's being able to see male I/M's naked, mainly for the fact that it is Prison Rules and Policy. Oh, and hey, I'm pretty sure Inmate "Chris Criminal" didn't take their rape, murder, or robbery victims rights into mind when they crossed the line, which put them there in the first place. Jus' sayin.

Mitch67
06-14-2010, 06:29 AM
There are so many of these women shouldn't be allowed to . . . . . threads and in honesty they make my blood boil! Why shouldn't a woman be allowed to carry out her professional responsibility to the best of her ability whatever her role is? What makes it worse is it is always a woman who starts the thread like women don't have eough prejudice and hassle fighting for equal rights withouts a sister starting the argument!

My advice don't think about it . . . . . works for me!

retired - 666
06-14-2010, 05:34 PM
I completly agree with you...and also feel that females shouldnt be watched by males either. The people in here saying it shouldnt bother a person....well you go in there as a female and have a bunch of men watching you and then...I bet you will feel differently. To those of you who are women saying it is no big deal...then go into your local food mart naked and squat and cough infront of the men in there. Its no different.

sandybear
09-28-2010, 10:17 PM
While I support the idea that COs of both genders can work with prisoners of the opposite one, prisons are LARGE complexes and there really doesn't need to be a reason to have female COs observing male inmates while naked.

In any case, the assumption that an inmate would feel any less undignified being naked in front of someone their own gender is not exactly true. I used to work in a High Security Unit at a women's psychiatric prison, where for security reasons most of the women there were denied clothing altogether. Although no males were allowed in the unit, for the women, having to live in their cells and interact with COs and support staff while entirely in the nude made them feel absolutely worthless and depressed. It made no difference that I am female. Try standing naked in front of several people who are fully clothed, and you'll see what I mean. It seems like gender might not be the biggest problem here.

OnlyTheLonely
09-28-2010, 11:00 PM
My Convicts prison doesnt have gang showers and I think that would be a good thing in all prisons.
I know He isnt concerned with who see's Him naked and if I were a dude with His looks and assets I doubt Id be concerned either.

But seriously though I personally think only male co's should see male inmates naked and only female co's should see female inmates naked. I know if I were a co in a male prison, I wouldnt want to have to watch a bunch of dudes scrub their junk on a daily basis.

lovingmagic
09-28-2010, 11:18 PM
personally i would rather the CO bunnies not be checking out my man naked...there is something not quite right about women supervising the men showering...

having a nurse examine him is completely different

june5
09-28-2010, 11:22 PM
Personally this doesn't concern me at all and hasn't been a concern for my husband. I think there are much bigger issues as far as prison. Most men don't care as much about nudity as women, I could be wrong, but I doubt male convicts as a whole have a genuine concern with it. Hell, I'm a modest woman and I guess it's easy to say but if I were in prison a male CO watching me shower wouldn't be my #1 concern at that point.

sweetdaisydream
09-28-2010, 11:57 PM
I guess that's one question I never asked my guy. LOL. It fits right in there with where they crap ... just bodily functions I guess I really didn't wanna know about LOL. I guess that may be something I will ask. HAHA

Tlina
09-29-2010, 06:16 AM
Most female guards are just doing their job, indeed. But there are those that take advantage of the situation. My man has been approached on numerous occasions by female guards making inappropriate comments. Yes inmates have bigger things to worry about, but it's still not right when it happens.

crazy2010
09-29-2010, 06:40 AM
Well mine doesn't ever talk about it but I know the female co's don't do strip searches they have private showers. They get written up for not being in uniform.So I'm really not worried about it. Just cause I think he hot doesn't mean anyone else does.

Scott
09-29-2010, 11:04 AM
Personally this doesn't concern me at all and hasn't been a concern for my husband. I think there are much bigger issues as far as prison. Most men don't care as much about nudity as women, I could be wrong, but I doubt male convicts as a whole have a genuine concern with it. Hell, I'm a modest woman and I guess it's easy to say but if I were in prison a male CO watching me shower wouldn't be my #1 concern at that point.

This is really true - most guys, unless they have other sexual hangups or issues, don't give it a second thought and have MUCH bigger issues to concern themselves with.

As far as Tina wrote below, "My man has been approached on numerous occasions by female guards making inappropriate comments."

Only in his imagination my dear...no female officer would risk her job by making comments. Just doesn't happen on any kind of a "numerous basis" situation.

Although no males were allowed in the unit, for the women, having to live in their cells and interact with COs and support staff while entirely in the nude made them feel absolutely worthless and depressed. It made no difference that I am female. Try standing naked in front of several people who are fully clothed, and you'll see what I mean. It seems like gender might not be the biggest problem here.

This is a psychological technique used in all kinds of prison situations, including prisoner-of-war situations - to establish a "imbalance of power and control." Making someone feel worthless is the intent. There are some benefits in the technique (in terms of creating cracks in the personality structure with the idea of re-structuring it along the lines of something more pro-social), but on the whole "professionals" consider it very unhelpful and, depending on the mental state of the inmate, potentially damaging.

BlueEyedEllie
09-29-2010, 11:17 AM
Personally this doesn't concern me at all and hasn't been a concern for my husband. I think there are much bigger issues as far as prison. Most men don't care as much about nudity as women, I could be wrong, but I doubt male convicts as a whole have a genuine concern with it. Hell, I'm a modest woman and I guess it's easy to say but if I were in prison a male CO watching me shower wouldn't be my #1 concern at that point.

I second what she says.and honestly,in the grand scheme of things,who cares??!!:shrug:I mean if you have total trust in your man,why would it even be an issue??I was with mine for 4 and a half years when he was in and never one time was this a worry or concern of mine.:no:

tinymom
09-29-2010, 11:25 AM
I am sure that some of these men aren't particularly happy at having female COS watching them and the same for female inmates. I for one do not like having anyone (other then my husband) see me without my clothes on but when in the hospital just had to deal with it. If the females and/or male COS are acting like professionals, as do male and female nurses, then I do not see a problem.

Allama
09-29-2010, 02:42 PM
Only in his imagination my dear...no female officer would risk her job by making comments. Just doesn't happen on any kind of a "numerous basis" situation.
That's just not true though. There have been plenty of examples of women CO's risking their job to have sex with, or be inappropriate with inmates.
There were actually two from a local prison here not too long ago. So it does happen. Whether it's prevalent or not, I don't know.
It's not something I worry about. Who care's who is seeing him naked? If he doesn't, I don't!

Scott
09-30-2010, 12:17 AM
Only in his imagination my dear...no female officer would risk her job by making comments. Just doesn't happen on any kind of a "numerous basis" situation.
That's just not true though. There have been plenty of examples of women CO's risking their job to have sex with, or be inappropriate with inmates.
There were actually two from a local prison here not too long ago. So it does happen. Whether it's prevalent or not, I don't know.
It's not something I worry about. Who care's who is seeing him naked? If he doesn't, I don't!

There might be rare examples - but in 15+ years in prison, I never saw it. Most women CO's are just there to do a job, I know quite a number who are lesbians, and it doesn't take them long to develop the attitude that inmates are the "scum of the earth."

Also, some of the women are trying so hard to be seen as peers of the male CO's, they know that word of any hanky-panky would spread like wild-fire (inmates are a notoriously gossipy bunch) and it wouldn't take long to get back to the male staff, who take a very dim view of that sort of thing. It just isn't worth it. I do know it has happened though... I have known several male staff to be involved with inmates...I frankly think that's more common.

When I was in prison in Washington State, the head of the work release was having sex with one of the inmates, who in return he helped get some special consideration for getting moved to work release (early) - whereupon the inmate, who was a rapist, took off from the work release, killed his victim, her next-door neighbor and her eight year old daughter. He was arrested almost the same day (didn't take long to solve THAT one), sentenced to death and executed in Washington Washington state. I wrote to him up until the time he died. The work release supervisor, shortly after all this came to light, killed himself. The whole thing was very tragic all around. A lot of lessons about relationships with inmates were learned in all of that sordid experience.

I just had to laugh because I used to hear from a my more narcissistic buddies that "officer so and so" really thinks I'm hot - and the reality was that "officer so and so" didn't know him from Adam....but, it was a fun fantasy for them to have.

But, you're right about - who really cares? In the long run, nobody...

Mrs E-Hutch
11-29-2010, 12:39 AM
my ex husband was taking his shower with his boxers on. he always told me it was about courtesy and that only old timers were taking their showers butt naked.
i assume that in many other facilities inmates are wearing their boxers too while taking their showers.


I agree that this is an issue not worth stressing there are much more important concerns. My man has also stated that at the facility hes in they wear boxers while showering but im not concerned who sees him naked & i feel the same as some have mentioned inprevious posts if hes humiliated,embarrassed or offended he shouldve thought about that before!

bunniRidge
11-29-2010, 03:46 PM
I didn't think too much about this when the thread first appeared. I kind of agree that if they are embarrassed they should have thought of it before hand, and I kind of figure majority of them females CO's are desensitized to it anyway. But then J told me he got strip searched by a female CO, and when I told him "I don't need to know that," he said he's just keeping it real. What the crap is that supposed to mean? I can deal with the females CO's doing their jobs, but don't rub it in my face.

Peaceismine
11-29-2010, 06:38 PM
The women CO's are there to do a job. The few that make comments or act unappropriatly should not be there, they just give the honest women CO's a bad rep. I would think the prisoners would be too busy watchin' their backs for other reasons, the CO's would be the least of their worries.

concerned citzn
02-03-2011, 05:03 PM
I think it is totally inappropriate for a female corrections officer to see a male inmate showering and the same with a male C.O. seeing a female inmate showering. Just because you are in jail doesn't mean you must be humiliated! Were is basic human dignity in all this? BTW, not every prisoner is guilty! This goes on with people in jail awaiting trial as well. Those people aren't in there "to be punished", they may merely not be able to afford bail. They still have rights!!