Hi all- I am the new Moderator for this forum. :)
If you are reading this thread, it is probably more then just plain old curiosity. Meaning, you could have a loved one who is in trouble because of drugs, or you might be that person who is in trouble because of drugs. Either way, drugs hurt everyone involved.
There are many different opinions regarding how drug users, pushers, addicts, etc should be handled. As it has been in the past years, the war on drugs has been our most expensive war. And what has come out of this war? Some say the "bad guys" are where they belong-in prison. Others see prisons maxed to overflowing, tax payers spending much more then they should to keep these people locked up, and scariest of all, they see men and women getting out of prison for drug crimes, just to go right back to using again because of lack of treatment.
So, what do you think about this war?
This is a forum to talk about your feelings on that subject.
My boyfriend is a heroin addict. He has been clean for over a year now, but he will fight this addiction every day of his life for the rest of his life. He is in prison now because of that addiction. Should he be a "prisoner of war" so to speak because of that? Many feel that he should. Many do not.
So, feel free to discuss, share, and give opinions. We are here to make sense of this war, and to understand what it is that not only the addicts, but what their families go through.
It's a hurtful subject, but one that we can learn a great deal from. So, have at it!
There is one thing that those of us who love an addict have in common- fear of the unknown. Let's face the unknown together!
Enjoy!

hi I also have a brother in a michigan prison because of drugs ,now dont get me wrong i know drugs are wrong but i believe giving these drug sellers more time than they give murders or rapists is ridiculous i also have my husband in a Texas prison and he also got lots of time for a non-agravated crime.my brother was just sentenced 9-40 on a drug charge .i really believe our system should consider our laws and change them and give our drug users help and send our murders and rapist to prison

My husband is in jail in Minnesota. This state has gang members that were in prison for rape & murder tripping over each other on their way out of prison on probation. But if you have a drug charge with no priors then you are looking at 8 to 10 years. This is the most retarded system in the world. I used to think that countries like pakistan etc have harsh sentences...life in prison or execution for a drug charge, but the good old usa is just a step away. We put the mentally retarded on death row, we lock up 1st time offenders for 10 years so they can never get a job or apartment when they get out, then we complain how people go back to crime! I am so sorry your boyfriend is adicted to Heroin. I dont know much about it except that it is the worst addiction? I hope he is able to get through it.

frankly, cigarettes are the most addictive. it's ALL a drug, food, exersise, you name it. whatever you are passionate about. how about too much time at PTO? life is so short, i hate it when they whine at the end!

a Hospice nurse

My husband is incarcerated because of his addiction to painkillers. Theyshould not be perscribed to just anyone. It is a multi-million dollar business/game and has utterly devasted our family, short term or not, and has interrupted our lives in more ways than I ever imagined. I agree with msmack, this system is retarded!!!! It is so stupid to incarcerate instead of rehabilitating addicts!!:argh

Mine is in because of his addiction to cocaine and his need to rob to support his habit. Done alot of time for that love of his.
He should have had intense treatment rather than incarceration and more supervision when he was released.
He is paying for his crime, and I believe he should, but no one really commits robberies because they are greedy and want a better lifestyle or 50 inch color tv. They do it out of desperation and soul sickness and the need for their first love...the dope.
I hope I don't sound cranky here...just wanted to respond is all :)

I wonder if the whole war is being fought backwards or something. All that money spent on prisoners who use drugs that get put away, like that is going to cure the addiction, I dont think so. If all that money was spent on healing the addicts then there wont be as many clients for the pushers. They would also free up a very large amount of beds in prison which would mean they can stop worrying about where to get the money for new prisons. The money would have to come from somewhere but if they start it, its a beginning. I think that is the best shot at even making a dent on the ever growing drug world, cause we sure arent winning it, and we never have.
I like Jeni have a loved one in the system who is an addict. The mess he is in right now wouldnt be happening if they had actually did a home check properly before sending him home from prison. Knowing that he is a crack addict and sending him to a crack house is pretty friggin sick if ask me. He tried but he didnt have a hope in hell and was back with crack before anyone could do anything about it. He did try though, he tried so very hard and lasted two weeks. It all makes me sick. regardless of the crimes, or the legalities involved with drugs, we will never win till we fix the people effected, it will all only get worse, just wait till the next new drug comes along.
There is no compassion anywhere in the system for these people who have a disease of addiction. For them to complain about running out of space, well what do they expect, they have all the money in the wrong place.
And one other thing, for some reason, the system doesnt realize that the addicts are victims too, so are their loved ones.
Fix the actual problem and the whole drug business will start to collapse I figure.
The whole thing makes me angry.
Glad you got this here Jeni,

I agree with you all. We give drug users, etc more time than we do murders and raptist. What is wrong with this picture. We tear apart familes. And we are not helping those with the problem. My fiance was sentenced to 9 years. He had a coke problem and was dealing drugs to support it. We have three small children that miss their daddy so much. He is a wonderful father and they are growing up without him because of a stupid mistake. Why not help treat him instead of locking him away. It irriates, hurt, angers me so much. Thanks for the board.

My man was reintroduced to drugs from a family member. He had been clean for 13 months after serving his first term. A lot of things happened, and it seemed like the world was crashing in. I am not making excuses for him, but he chose to return to the life of drugs. It tore our family apart. He became a monster. He has been clean since the day he was locked up...that was like Dec. 12th. He has even stopped smoking cigarrettes. But instead of getting treatment in prison for his addiction, he has had to deal with it on his own.

You can't rehabilitate a drug addict unless they want it real bad, so mandating drug addicts into treatment is a big waste of money. What you end up with is an educated addict who goes right back out.

I agree, though, that putting people with drug problems in prison isn't totally effective, either, and putting the small time drug dealer in prison isn't doing anything to stem the flow of drugs.

The war on drugs hasn't affected me much, but drugs sure have. I'm a widow now thanks to drugs. But I don't blame the small time dealer who sold him the heroin, I blame the government for spending so much money putting small time dealers in prison that they don't devote all their resources going after the big guys and really reducing the amount of drugs that come into the country.

This is such a hard subject for me. My boyfriend is an addict. (as u all probably know) He committed his crime before I knew him, which landed him in prison for 2 years. (Because of drugs) He is back in because he used while on parole.
God, I wish their was a solution to this problem. You can't make addicts enter treatment. Well, sure you can, but if they don't want to be clean, then they won't be. But, you shouldn't lock up a person who WANTS to be clean. Someone who is struggling to stay clean.
How do you decide?
I wish they could give lie detectors to people locked up for drug charges, just to see if they really wanted to be clean.
Stupid, I know.
I hate the fact that my boyfriend has done 13 months, with another 4 months to go, because he used. He didn't committ another crime against anyone else, just himself.
UgH!
How do you decide? Who wants to be clean and who doesn't?

But addiction is only a sympton of a deeper problem. I think we need more reasearch to find why people use the first time. I wanted to add that they are taking small time boy and making them out to be the big boys. The more class one convictions they get, the more $$ they get from Congress. And then they say see we are winning our "war." That is what happened to a friend of mine. They said he was running a million dollar ring and did not even own a car!!!! It was the most ridulous thing I have ever heard. There are alot ofpeople saying the war on drugs is not working, but they have no other solution. I think it will take more home supervision. I think that is what they are trying to do with the drug courts. Has anyone had experience with those?

I have not experienced drug courts, but I think they are a good idea.
I totally agree that addiction is only a symptom of a deeper problem. Thats why it is so frustrating to see people get locked up for using. These people are reaching out for help, and they are not getting any.
You can't force an addict to get help, but locking up EVERY addict is wrong.
Thanks for what you said Fabulous. Very true.

I cant agree with you all more that locking up a drug addict is a bigger problem. My father is a very big crack addict. Although he has not been in jail for his addiction (which I find hard to believe) he has caused so much pain to my whole family. He has been in countless drug rehabilitation hospitals and ALWAYS turns back to drugs once he is released. I do not think that sending drug addicts to prison helps any either. My fiance is in prison for doing a crime that was drug related and I still dont think he is learning much. He went out and robbed someone while being on ecstacy. I dont know what it will take for people to change. In my fathers case hospitals dont help and in my fiances case prison hasnt helped much. I have turned my back on my father and I hate to say it but I may be doing the same thing to my fiance soon. I know that people who are struggling with an addiction need as much love and support as they can get, but its too much stress to worry what they are doing all the time. Good Luck with all of you who are battling the same thing.

It was the use of illegal drugs that totally devastated my family. Because he used, he lost all sense of knowing appropriate boundries which got him into major trouble. Because I used, I didn't recognize the signs that something was terribly wrong with the way that we lived. Or was I in denial? Because we both used, the children were deprived of a decent lifestyle as well as the opportunity to live as a part of a healthy family.

Well, now he's about ready to go forth into society after spending some years behind bars. Hopefully he will avail himself of the drug rehab programs that he must undergo as a part of his parole. And after finally getting my act together by making the decision to NOT USE (with God's Help and Love) and to get my priorities in order I pray with all my being that I NEVER go back to the way it was before he went in. And when we get back together again as a family???

GOD HELP US...

This subject is extremely difficult for me to discuss......I get very angry sometimes when I try to get a point across. i am an addict, who comes from a long line of addicts. I was in rehab by the time I was 16. IT SAVED MY LIFE!! Did I stop using from then on out? NO!! But what rehab did for me, was educate me. It gave me tools to help me to recognize the signs of when I was in too deep. It gave a path in life to GET HELP!! It also helped me to understand how addiction truly works. Treating an addict is NOT an easy job to do. Gees how do I say this.......the only way i can say it clearly is to use myself as an example. When I walked into rehab, I did NOT go there to get clean. I went there to get away from my mom and everybody else. I had NO idea what I was in for. If somebdy would have locked me up in jail or prison, I would NOT be here today. Prison does nothing for an addict!!!! THere is absolutely NO help in prison on how to understand why one is addicted to begin with. Ask someone why they use drugs. 9 out of 10 times the answer will be "because they make me feel good" The reality is, being high feels a WHOLE lot better then facing the deomons that haunt us addicts on a day-to-day basis. Getting high "NUMBS" the pain. The pain is the underlying factor of why someone uses drugs. Rehab, deals with that pain. Rehab isn't just about taking the person off the streets and them getting clean. That's just the beginning. Treatment means, THERAPY, COUNSELING!! I'm sorry if I offend anyone by saying this! I disagree with people who say "putting an addict in treatment doesn't work, if the addict doesn't want it!!" We can give 5, 10, 20 years of prison time to a drug offender, and spend a TON of WASTED money on that. But we can't spend LESS money on giving them 2 or 3 years of INTENSIVE rehabilitation? Educating them, helping them to understand their addiction, giving them the tools to live a healthy clean life, AND counseling them on their demons is NOT wasted money!! I guarntee if the states would start putting the drug offenders in a LONG term treatment program, less would reoffend, then the ones who are put in prison for LONG terms without help, or education!! I was saved with treatment. My husband, on the other hand, is sitting in prison with a 5-20 year sentence with NO help available to him. Here's a man who grew up in a home where drugs were prevelant. Hell his mother used them for breakfast. At age 16 HE was her goffer. go for this drug, Go for that drug. By the time he was 21 he was addicted to meth. He ended up skipping state and coming to Michigan where 6 years later he was addicited again. By then I had met him, and we had a baby on the way. I watched this drug rip our family to pieces and then steal him away from us. ANd now he sits in prison with no education to help him understand the dynamics of his drug use. TO me THAT'S A WASTE OF MONEY!!

Thanks for letting me share.

Stacy

If we (citizens of the US) as a group, dont get together and get a hold on this manufacturing and using of Crystal Meth, it is going to be the ruination of us all.

I have two sons who have been on this mess. The oldest finally figured out what it was doing to him but NOT before it almost killed him. Causing weakening in the aorta just outside his heart.

The other son, is still using and it seems it has such a hold over him that his only child is not even important anymore. She is just 3 months old and he was believed to be sterile sinc he was 27 before she became pregnant. I thought that this baby would make a big change in his life. Boy was I wrong.

Pray for me and my children. Gosh knows we all need it.

Today I got a letter from my brother who is in a texas prison, he want to see his niece and nephew, my two children, but i am still hurt over the hell he put my me, my moms, brother and sister through, he use to deal drugs out of our house and he put all of our lives in danger. I still cant forgive him for that. I just dont know if i want him around my children. The only time i remember him most was when he was high on crack. I think if he got out today he would be tryin to get more crack. I dont think prison is doing anything for him.

My boyfriend got 10 years for a drug related crime. No violence was involved and i think it is horrible that there are people who are robbing others with guns only getting 5 years. I don't know how we are going to do this. I just keep praying for a miracle.

Thank God for this forum. My fiance is a recovering Heroin addict that was in a bad accident 3 years ago. She wasn't able to work so had no insurance. Of course the state doctors(Arizona, the worst most backwards state in the country) perscribed her all sorts of painkillers. You can guess what happened next, she got hooked on wonderful miracle drugs such as Oxecotton. According to her, the kick from that was worse than Heroin. She got a extreme DUI after she pulled over in a private hotel parking lot. She didn't have the keys in the ignition and she was trying to do the right thing by not driving. Didn't mean a thing to the heartless Arizona judge. She wouldn't even let me speak. Susan had done prior 5 years for $40 of Herion 10 years before. The procescutor offered 4 and half years in a plea deal which if she hadn't taken it she could have been facing 15. The thing is she has never stolen to support her habit and she hasn't used since her accident. She was offered just this week in her prison, thank God she turned them done. The bottom line is the non-violent addicts need treatment, not prison time. A Bishop in Phoenix runs down and kills a man and he gets away with probation. The war on drugs is a total waste of money, time, lives, and most of all families!

Following an accident I was prescribed those Oxycodins that your gf got. I have never been the type to have an addictive personality, but i am telling you...she was not lying to you when she told you they are strong. I don't know WHY a Dr would prescribe an addict those pain meds when there are many without the "Oxy-kick" that would do something to relieve her pain without addicting her further.
My man is in jail due to his addiction and other than him being clean since he went in, I don't see what being jailed has done for him but give him the opportunity to reach out thru NA and AA to others in need.
Just my 2cents.

My husband is serving a 30-month sentence for having a drug dealer set him up. My husband never sold any before, but we had a baby and were broke and had no money. He just wanted to put a roof over our head and formula in our baby's mouth. I just found out the drug dealer got his PROBATION terminated b/c he did very well on it. :pissed:

In California there are several levels of drug charges, not counting crimes related too. There is drug use, drug possession, drug dealing, and drug trafficking none of which will give you more time than a murderer or rapist. Of all the drug crimes trafficking is the worst traffickers deal in such quantities that those drugs are used by maybe tens of thousands of people. That is why its the most severely punished. People have no right to treatment or sympathy who partake in that action. The facts are illegal drugs are destructive to people, to society! This is why drugs are illegal. I agree there should be more treatment than plain incarceration. The problem is addiction is partially genetic. How do we treat people who are genetically susceptible to drug addictions? I think the best way is to kill drug flow. That would entail stepping up the "drug war" and invading countries that supply opium, heroin, cocaine, and extacy.

It seems to me that the "drug war" is a war on addicts and their families. We aren't getting the "big wig dealers" most of the time. We are getting the "regular guy" who just needs help.
I would love to see us end the drug flow from other countries-but I don't see it happening. And I would love to see people with drug addictions get the help that they need to live a clean life. I don't see that happening in the very near future either, even though we seem to be trying to go in that direction. There are definitely people out there who manufacture drugs and sell drugs, in gigantic quantities. I don't have any sympathy for these people because they are the problem. However, I do feel for the people who made some bad mistakes in the past and used drugs that they should not have, and are still paying a huge price for it, years later. My boyfriend committed a crime because of drugs, and he did his time for that crime. He didn't get any drug treatment, he just got punished for the crime. (Which, he should have been punished)
However, he is back in now, and has been for 15 months with another 3 months to go, because he couldn't get off heroin on his own. His po knew he had the problem because he told her. He basically begged for help, and he didn't get it. He got prison. THat is what I don't agree with.
So, yea, this is a tricky subject. I know there are definitely people who don't want to be clean, and I feel really sorry for them. But there are those who DO want to get clean, and because of their life threatening addiction to whatever drug, they are viewed as horrible criminals who deserve to be in prison. I can't speak for everyone, ( I am sure I could with this statement, but I won't) but I know my boyfriend isn't a horrible person. He is a good guy with a bad problem, and he is in prison because of it.
That's not right.
Nice to have you here Regular Guy- Glad you decided to see what were about!

Originally posted by Jeni
It seems to me that the "drug war" is a war on addicts and their families. We aren't getting the "big wig dealers" most of the time. This is a problem that society needs to address. We are getting the "regular guy" who just needs help.Most people do not do drugs. Though it is true that certain segments of society live only around drug pushers and addicts.
I would love to see us end the drug flow from other countries-but I don't see it happening. And I would love to see people with drug addictions get the help that they need to live a clean life. I don't see that happening in the very near future either, even though we seem to be trying to go in that direction. There are definitely people out there who manufacture drugs and sell drugs, in gigantic quantities. I don't have any sympathy for these people because they are the problem. However, I do feel for the people who made some bad mistakes in the past and used drugs that they should not have, and are still paying a huge price for it, years later. Its hard to get an unbiased view when someone you care about has a drug problem. I think If he wants to lead a new life he needs to make that decision. I believe it is harder for some people than others, but NO treatment will work no matter how much he goes through until he wants to change. BTW drug treatment centers have a very low success rate. There is no perfect answer. Our government is not designed to control our society it was designed to defend our borders. Our society is what we make of it. Change starts in the head of an individual. My boyfriend committed a crime because of drugs, I hope he blames himself and not drugs. Until he wakes up from "HIS" addiction he will never be able to live a "regular guy" life. Drugs are a symptom. Ask him if he wants help from addiction, and how he intends to get it. I wouldn't let him back home until he makes up a plan of action. and he did his time for that crime. He didn't get any drug treatment, he just got punished for the crime. (Which, he should have been punished)
However, he is back in now, and has been for 15 months with another 3 months to go, because he couldn't get off heroin on his own.Heroin is one of the most addicting drugs out there. Now that he is clean he needs to stay that way if he is ever around it, it will be very hard for him not to get high. There is no good treatment for heroin. The best would be NA meetings with a good peer group. Be careful some of the people in NA groups members don't want to stay sober and will be a bad influence. His po knew he had the problem because he told her. He basically begged for help, and he didn't get it. He got prison. THat is what I don't agree with.
So, yea, this is a tricky subject. I know there are definitely people who don't want to be clean, and I feel really sorry for them. But there are those who DO want to get clean, and because of their life threatening addiction to whatever drug, they are viewed as horrible criminals who deserve to be in prison. I can't speak for everyone, ( I am sure I could with this statement, but I won't) but I know my boyfriend isn't a horrible person. He is a good guy with a bad problem, and he is in prison because of it.
That's not right. Most people are good people they just make bad decision
Nice to have you here Regular Guy- Glad you decided to see what were about! Thank you!

Regular guy- I hear ya!

Most people do not do drugs. Though it is true that certain segments of society live only around drug pushers and addicts.
That is true- but I gotta tell ya I am amazed at how many people DO drugs. When I first started telling Robert's story to people that I know, I was shocked that people that in a million years I wouldn't think would do drugs-have, or do.

Its hard to get an unbiased view when someone you care about has a drug problem. I think If he wants to lead a new life he needs to make that decision. I believe it is harder for some people than others, but NO treatment will work no matter how much he goes through until he wants to change. BTW drug treatment centers have a very low success rate. There is no perfect answer. Our government is not designed to control our society it was designed to defend our borders. Our society is what we make of it. Change starts in the head of an individual
I understand what your saying here too. As much as I hate the fact that my boyfriend is in prison, I would rather him be there instead of out here killing himself. My point is that he is not a "threat" to society. We are so gung-ho on punishing people that we are not paying attention! How much better off would we be if people like my boyfriend, who WANT to be clean, can get into a treatment center and really work on the "why's" of their addiction-instead of sitting in a cell so many hours a day, getting angry, getting non-tolerant, and basically becoming hateful? I understand the whole protecting the borders thing, but what are we protecting ourselves from when we lock up drug addicts. The truth that this country is in serious trouble? God forbid we look into our own backyards-

I hope he blames himself and not drugs. Until he wakes up from "HIS" addiction he will never be able to live a "regular guy" life. Drugs are a symptom. Ask him if he wants help from addiction, and how he intends to get it. I wouldn't let him back home until he makes up a plan of action.
He does realize that drugs have been the problem all his life, however, he does know that he ultimately made the decision to do the crime. He says he won't ever touch drugs again. I know that deep in his heart he believes that right now- it's different out here though, and he knows that.
We have NA and AA books with meetings in the area. I have tons of info about outpatient rehab for when he gets out. The sad thing is, he isn't being paroled until he finishes an offender class. Not a drug class, but an offender class. The DOC either has no idea that all his problems stem from drugs, or they just don't care and are going through the motions.
I believe in him, so he will be coming home.

Heroin is one of the most addicting drugs out there. Now that he is clean he needs to stay that way if he is ever around it, it will be very hard for him not to get high. There is no good treatment for heroin. The best would be NA meetings with a good peer group. Be careful some of the people in NA groups members don't want to stay sober and will be a bad influence.
I agree. Heroin is the worst of the worst in my opinion. He needs to stay away from old "friends" and old "haunts".
Most people are good people they just make bad decision
Absolutely-
Thank you!
Your welcome! :)

Well, the worst thing that the war on drugs has done to me is I get a lot of prejudice. When I tell people my husband was drug dealer, they automatically give me attitude. Seems drug abusers want to blame drug dealers. Drug dealers want to blame the demand. Everyone is pointing fingers.

I was playing on Yahoo games the other night. My profile has my visiting pic with Amir. They couple from England I was chatting and playing with were being all nice and asking me questions. The minute I told them he was in for selling drugs, they launched into this whole attitude driven speach on how "I" was scum and their poor nephew who was an addict. I didnt bother arguing with them, just finished my game said thanks and left. But, it really does get to me. I have even gotten attitude here sometimes. If you try and just talk about his life prior to being incarcerated, people take it as if you are bragging and impressed. Man, you got the wrong woman. The ONLY thing that impresses me is hard work. I have worked my entire life. Easy money has never impressed me.


And, a few years back I allowed my sister to live in my home in Tulsa. I was living there and she moved in. She drove me crazy so I transfered to DFW. I left her in my home with everything I owned. She was a drug addict and an alcoholic. She ran all my utilities up till they were shut off then moved out taking EVERYTHING I owned. Even my mechanics tools I use to earn a living. Noone here can imagine the pain of walking into your home and finding it empty. She even took light fixtures and door knobs. I was nothing but good to her. It almost killed me, literally.

Aiiiiiiii.
My brother at one point got so bad he almost took me down.
I invited him for dinner one night cus i hadn't seen him in forever and he never left!! LOL
He was addicted to morphine and heroin at the time ( unknown to me).
I noticed after a few days he was always nodding out and spent alot of time in the room i let him sleep in.
Long story short, I get a call from him one night telling me to report my car stolen immediately to the cops. Seems he had done the dirty and used my car to get away. He gave me instructions on where to look in the bedroom for his "things".
I will never forget the sickness I felt inside finding his filthy rigs and spoons and blood and burn holes all over the carpet and comforter in my son's room he had been staying in.
I never let him back into my house again. I feel for him and love him still but cannot allow my children to be witness to his lifestyle.
His loss.
I totally understand what you went thru fly:confused:

shan, I am glad I am not the only one who went thru that with a loved one. It has split my family. I do not even talk to any of my family except my mother because I reported it to the police. It hurts, but I am not the bad guy in this situation. She needs help and if it takes her being put in prison for it to happen, then it needs to happen.

The problem being a big one as it is (unprisonment for drug use), there are so many people in prison for other crimes, but the crimes were done to get money for drugs. I would love to see some true stats on this cause I really believe it would blow the average tax payer away. Especially since prison really doesnt do anything to stop the problem. The average addict sits in prison and really doesnt want to do drugs again, but so many of them get released into what they left, its all still there and no one really helped the addict. Especially if their crime for inprisonment was other than drugs, they just slip threw the already wet kleenex like net that is suppose to reform drug users. Im just so sick of it all and if something isnt done major really soon there will be no one left that isnt affected personally and it will be to late. I really believe that there is still time to make major changes, but it will have to be major at this point.
Jeni I love this thread you started, I feel very passionate about it as you know. I will be having more time to read it now as you know.

I'm just so fed up with the drug thing. My sons have lost so much of their life due to drug use and abuse. The same old thing over and over,they get out, tell me they are through with drugs, I believe them, fail drug test, back to prison and so on and so on.They are the addicts but it might as well be me.Because I am the mom,it's killing me. I know I'm not the only mom,girlfriend, wife, friend etc. with the same story. When will the system learn that prison doesn't work? Maybe it does for some but not for my boys.Can't believe they are so dumb, but I guess they are.I want so much to save them, but how? I don't even know how to keep my heart from being broken. Yes, I would say my life has been altered due to drugs.I can't tell you how very happy I am for anyone that is strong enough to quit.

Oh geez you made me cry Valerie. My heart goes out to you. I know some of what you feel and I cant begin to explain what the heartbreak has done to me, but I think if it was my son rather than my other half, it would be so much more painful. You watch them grow up, so innocent and then suddenly they are playing with something that has taken over their life and often the lives of those that love them. I truly feel for you. If you want, PM me, I have a prayer list on my web site and I could put their names on their if you want. Hang in there, I dont know how you can help them, really they can only make that choice. And when they tell you they want to make things right, they probably mean it when they say it. Addiction is very powerful with some drugs. Hang in there.

Witchlin- I would love to see the actual stats on how many people are locked up due to drug use. And I mean all crimes that were committed because of drug use. (not just drug charges) Robert's original crime was considered a violent one, and he never would have done it if he hadn't been addicted to drugs. Not looking for sympathy here, that's just the plain truth. I wonder how many people committed crimes strictly because of drugs. I bet the stats on that would be staggering.
It's nice to have you back Witchlin. Not under these circumstances of course, but still nice to have ya.

Thanks Jeni, glad to be back though not for the reasons I am. I was never exactly gone really anyway, still checked in from time to time.
You know, someone who had lots of time could probably start something that could gather data like that.

My husband's in on a 1st degree drug charge, Manufacturing Meth...although the only thing they had to charge him with was the word of another meth cook who got his charges dropped...gotta love those snitches. He's got a treatment mandate on his sentence that cannot be met in the facility he's in (no treatment there at all)...but will they move him? heck no. *sigh*
He's been convicted before on 4th and 5th degree charges, he's an addict, as am I. I've been clean almost 2 1/2 years, from Crystal Meth. It's not easy.

I'm not stupid, I'm not irresponsible (anymore), I'm a college student maintaining a 3.8 gpa and raising 3 kids by myself. To give you an idea of how an addict can relapse, let me give you an example.

There aren't enough hours in a day, for someone like me. Between maintaining a school schedule, work schedule, studying, keeping up the house, doctor appointments, dental appointments, school functions and conferences for the kids, a teenager who by herself is enough to drive anyone insane with her attitude and now truancy, and trying to juggle all this without a driver's license or extra money for cabs, relying on bus schedules and bus routes to get around....it's difficult to say the least. I am a walking zombie by friday, but there's still laundry to do, test to study for, homework to oversee, meals to cook, and a job to get to. Sleep is beginning to look like a waste of valuable time to me, even though I get 6 hours a night MAX, including weekends. I think you know where I'm going with this. It would be SOOOO easy....SO damn easy, to give in to the craving....because I used to accomplish in a weekend what I can't do in 2 weeks' time or more. I had energy to spare....I got everything done that needed to be done and more, because I didn't sleep for a week!!! or MORE, depending on how long the drug held out.

But that memory, if I let it, is very selective. I can forget about the horrible inevitable crashes, the suffocating depression when the dope and money ran out. I could even forget that's why my family has been torn apart for the past 2 years. But I REFUSE to forget it. I struggle with this battle daily, hourly, by the damn MINUTE, but I see where my husband is, and how easily it could have been me, or both of us doing that time, and I thank God I was given the chance to clean up and stay free while doing so.

Eddy needs treatment, badly. I did it without treatment, at least thus far, I quit on my own, voluntarily. Is it better to do it that way rather than treatment? I don't know. I DO however know that locking me up wouldn't have done any more good than I did for myself. And locking Eddy up for 8 to 13, has not done us any good. Having said that, I'm on the other hand glad something was done. He was so far gone I knew he had 2 choices facing him; death, or prison. Thank God it was the latter, NOW, if they'd only stop warehousing him and others like him and actually work on this issue, the world would be a much better place.

You hang in there ok, I've been a Heroin addict, a Meth addict and Crack addict in my day and Ive been clean for a whole long time, years. I've had those thoughts you have and still do when I least expect it. The more that is on my plate the more often it will pop in my mind. But you said it, it will destroy all that you have managed to hang on too and have succeeded in accomplishing, well you know that too. So hang in there and if you ever want anyone to talk to, pm me.
Well as far as your other half being where he can't fulfill part of his sentences' requirements, is a perfect example of how the system fails yet again with drug offenders.
You dont sound like you have the time, but I think you need to write a letter and copy it to a major newspaper, some politicians that are in your area and send it directly to the top, the Governors office. Your husband isnt the only one in that situation, I've heard this before. Maybe if you dont have the time someone here can help you out. Maybe your husband should write the letter since he probably has a whole lot of time on his hands.
Hang in there, and see if that teen of yours will help you out a bit, well tell her too. You need a hand with things it sounds like.

Good Luck MsAloha1018 and more power to you for being able to kick your drug habbit. Hopefully you will remember the lessons you learned and with God's help you and your man will stay clean.

I have been on both sides of this issue. My first husband and father of my child is in prison for crimes related to his addiction. We divorced for other reasons.

My current husband is in for a sales charge. The charge was nearly a year old when he was sentenced. He had stopped selling months before. Guess it's too late to change after an indictment in the eyes of the law.

I also have several friends and family member who are in or have been in on drug related charges.

It's made me realize there are lots of hypocrites out there. Who talk out of both sides of their mouth.
One minute they want to get help and out of prison (have it be legalized).
The next minute they don't want help, but prefer to stay in prison (have it stay illegal).
These people are only hurting themselves and nor do I feel sorry for them, for hypocrites, who cannot, and do not want to make tough decisions in life, but only want to have the impossible, to have their cake and eat it too. To whine and complain and cry and act like babies in apathy, self-pity and helplessness and instead of forcing themselves to be accountable and responsible for their own happiness and success and future in life for once.
To have treatment and not legalized at the exact same time. THAT will NEVER HAPPEN. You cannot have both! That's impossible! You have to either pick ONLY ONE or the other!!

What is wrong that some of these people can't see that????
What's wrong with them?
What do they want? Prison or not? Illegal or not? How is it possible for something so easy like this be so difficult for some people to decide???

It's like dang, what's with all the APATHY PEOPLE? What the heck? Where'd all this dang APATHY come from anyway?

What is this I ran into anyway, seriously?
Learned helplessness?? What the h*ll good is that ever going to do any of you?? GET OUT OF IT people!! GET OUT OF IT.

I don't understand the ones stuck in complete helplessness and APATHY. I just don't get it. I just DON'T UNDERSTAND.

You cannot have OTHER people "save" you. You have to SAVE YOURSELF. That's jsut the way life is. You cannot have others do it "for" you. You have to SAVE YOURSELF.

Vote Republican. STOP the APATHY. Get out, get a job, get an education. Apply for a loan. Earn a living. Eat healthy. Exercise. Respect your familes. Be responsible for your own future. Pay your taxes. Make small goals for yourself in life. Reward yourself when you meet them. Stop the APATHY. SAVE YOURSELF. Take the initiative. Be responsible. Save your money. Invest in good retirement funds (but if it takes decades, don't worry about it, I am 34 and still not there either, but just becuase I'm not doesn't mean I give up hope!) Build your communities. Teach children how to read books. Become a good example in life. Find some role models and strive to become one yourself for others in life. Take accountability. Take responsibility. Be rpoud of your accomplishments, even if they are samll, so what? Small is better than nothing! take care of yourself! Be happy. Love yourself, others and life. And vote Republican.

I am a recovering food addict. I may not have the same addictions as some of you, but believe me, ANY addiction stinks. I used to be homeless and lived in homeless shelters. I used to carry all of my belongings around in a shopping cart from one shelter to the next because I had no bus money. I was in poverty, all alone, without job potential, depressed, sad, down and out as you can possibly get. But I didn't want to continue living my life that way. All I wanted was to get out of it and the only way I could was to pull myself out of my own apathy up by my own bootstraps and and set samll forward-looking goals, take it forward one step at a time. Slowly never giving up, but just keep looking forward to meeting your goals one day at a time, till one year, I looked back and saw how much progress I really made. Now, sure I could use a whole lot more progress in addition to now, but I'm not going to get down on it because that won't do me any good. The only answer is to keep moving forward, accomplish small goals every day. One day you will see the difference! You will, but only if you DON'T GIVE UP!

Listen, I didn't mean to yell at any of you people here. I was just frustrated at seeing all the apathy. I know it's hard to get out of especially if you are surrounded by it. But the only way to get out of it is to stop surrounding yourself with it. Find other people in your life, community, churches, volunteer groups, whatever to get yourself out of it. Apathy is an energy drain. It does nothing but suck life out of you.
Do what you can to get out of it. Find people who are hard-working and believe in taking responsibility and in charge of their own life. Surround yourself with who you admire and want to be like. Let their behaviours and attitudes influence and rub off on yours. That's what I did. And that's what helped me. It was hard living with other people with so much apathy in the environment, especially in the shelters. It was hard. But I stuck to my goals and got out of it and did the best I could do.

I seriously just don't know if I can come back and post here again either, becaues there is way too much apathy for me here and it just drains me and frustrates me, and I feel as though it's holding me back.

I feel more comfortable talking to others who are forward-looking and positive in life. Some of the most positive people in life are disabled, crippled, and confined in wheelchairs, etc, some of these people you wonder how did they get so positive and full of hope? You stick around them and learn from them, and soon enough it rubs off on you.

But it took me a long time to get away from all the apathy, so the last thing I need is to be surrounded by it all over again. It's too much, too draining. I don't want to go through this again. I'm going to have to just let you people go and go back to others who are positive, because the ones in apathy are too draining and negative for me. Apathy is contagious. Very communicable. If not the greatest. Free yourself from it while you still can. Get out of it. Do what you can. You can do it. You can do it.

The war on drugs is hypocrisy at best because the same people who are throwing drug offenders in prison are the same ones who have a private stash at home. Also the justice system has confidential informants who are nothing more than repeat drug offenders who work off new sentences or snitch so that they can stay out to keep doing what they do while usually sending innocent people to prison. It is the cops job not C.I. 's it is entrapment and I believe a violation of rights. People who use drugs are not all bad sometimes they make stupid mistakes but when you put a first time drug offender in prison for 10-30 to life depending on what state and you give murderers and rapists and child molesters little more tht probation to 7 years I believe the entire justice system is in need of much overhauling . Also for those of yu who know how the system works the only way to get a light sentence is accept a plea agreement which is designed to make the offender fail and go back . Because if you exercise your right to trial especially on a drug charge you are convicted before you even start. And the prosecutors have all these legal potholes which if you fight they will hit you with 5 or 6 felony charges which add up to the commission of onw crime which means you are facing multiple felonies for one crime and that means you are screwed!!!!So the war on Drugs needs to end.

AMEN tawnyas28 AMEN. Let's end it. Let's get the innocent out. The sooner the better. AMEN.

Your answer to the Drug War is "Vote Republican?"
My man is an addict. He is locked up because of his love for cocaine. Since being incarcerated, he has been totally clean. He attends AA, NA, Grief Counselling and any other program he can to better himself and to try to understand how NOT to make the same mistakes twice or three times or ten times.
Apathy is the last thing he or I have towards his addiction.
It is a struggle daily for him. It is a struggle daily for me being here without him because of some stupid drug his body craves. Addicts don't belong in jail, they belong in treatment centres.
And as far as finding people draining....this is the LAST place on earth I feel personally drained. This place renews my spirit in ways you would not even understand.
Seeing these devoted women sticking with their relationships through thick and thin and poverty , and addiction and lonliness and not giving up EVER....well that is positively uplifting.
Oh and by the way....politics have nothing at all to do with addictions, Margaret, so it really doesn't matter who they vote for.

* THIS IS A WONDERFUL THREAD. I WOULD HATE TO SEE IT CLOSED FOR ANY REASON. HOWEVER, IF WE ARE GOING TO GET ARGUMENTAL AND ABUSIVE TOWARDS EACH OTHER, IT WILL BE CLOSED*

My brother is serving 31.3 years on a drug trafficking/gun charge despite the fact he had no criminal record and his case is currently before a panel of judges at the 6th Circuit Court of Appeals.

But I agree with the member who said, nicotine is the drug of choice for many addicts---the difference; however, is that it has become socially acceptable. Addictions are varied and some are not even to an ingested chemical. I just read Dr. Tom Coburn's book "Breach of Trust--how Washington turns outsiders into insiders" and he addresses perhaps one of our greatest problems in America---federal and state legislators who are "addicted to power." His book seems to answer many questions for me as to why money is spent on some things and not on things that would be more beneficial to the country as a whole---careerism. When our representatives are willing to turn a blind eye to the needs of their constituents just for that next "fix of power" is it really any different than the husband/wife turning a blind eye to the needs of their family for their next "fix of chemical?" In my opinion, this is where we need to focus to initiate a change--voting and voting for new people who are willing to limit their terms for the good of the country.

As to how money could be better spent, I think good health care for the young; better education for the young which would include controversal topics like addiction even to substances which are currently socially acceptable, but most importantly teaching them to think for themselves; job development so that young people can make a decent living for themselves and their families; and proper treatment for the addicted who are willing to accept treatment.

Prisons should be the last resort not the first option. I am of the opinion that there are some individuals who cannot live in an organized society independently but they are not the majority of people who are currently incarcerated. Yet, I am also of the opinion that people should be held accountable for their actions. If someone commits a crime that society as a whole thinks requires confinement to remediate--then whether or not the person is an addict should not be a factor for consideration just as whether or not the person can see, hear, talk, walk, etc. should make a difference. Likewise, I do not think people with addictions should be sent to prison because of their addiction any more so than people who cannot see, hear, talk, walk, etc. should be sent to prison because of those particular characteristis.

"Justice" is what we have lost in the War on Drugs and it is costing each and every one of us but I am convinced that we can and will do something about it.

Wow, Leon's Sister;
That was very interesting reading and makes quite a lot of sense. I would like to read that book for sure. I will check out the library and hopefully they have it. I hope you get good news on the appeal.

Happy Holidays,

Witchlinblue, I was successful in checking it out of our local library; however, our county only has one copy and I had to put my name on the waiting list. It took a couple weeks but was well worth the wait.

Thanks for the heads up on that, I guess I will see how available it will be here in Canada, I might have to wait till I go to Michigan. I will let you know what I think when Ive read it.

Let me start by saying that I am not a drug addict, nor do I have any loved ones in prison. For that, I am very grateful. I'm just an ordinary taxpayer who is paying to incarcerate hundreds of thousands of people who do not belong in prison. It seems that we always need a boogie man, and drug addicts are an excellent target.

Addictions are a complicated problem, and I've never seen anything that suggests that locking people up does anything to solve it. About all the war on drugs seems to have done, is thrown away a lot of people who could probably be saved if we Americans thought that it was important to save them. If you want to talk about apathy, I cannot think of a more apathetic approach than simply branding people as being unworthy of being with the rest of us and locking them away in a place where they receive minimal treatment.

Even worse, upon their release we make it very hard for them to hold a decent job and stay clean. Those who do manage to stay straight are to be commended. Unfortunately, I think that they are the exception to the rule. Even with the best treatment, the vast majority of drug addicts relapse a few times. I don't think that drug use by itself should be a crime.

IMHO, prisons should be for people who commit violent acts that hurt people or to a lesser extent those who commit property crimes. It is estimated that 5.6 million Americans have served time in prison. That's roughly 1.8% of our population, or one in every 50 people. It is also far too many.

It costs about $20,000 to lock someone up for a year. I cannot help but wonder if that same amount of money spent treating addictions would do far more to help people and ultimately reduce property and violent crimes. Either way we are going to pay.

This problem is a sad but to true situations. Everybody has their opinion on what should be done to drug offenders, but the truth a lot of people don't understand that it is an addiction and one that can kill someone!! I am a recovering addict with 1year and 4 days clean and I was on my way to prison if I kept my stuff up, but instead something worse happend, I came home one day from being on a run and my 3 children where gone- CPS had taken them from me. I was made to go through an out patient program for mothers and I learned something that has kept me clean for all this time- that is I have a disease called addiction and it is something that will never go away, I didn't ask for this but that is something I must learn to live with. I tried for so long to stay clean off speed and no matter what I did nothing worked. I dameged all my family ties, lost my children, lost my home,my car, but the worst thing I lost was me. But I found something out there that works for me and millions out there, and that is the NA/AA programs. I know they have these programs in the prisons but it is so much diffrent when you get back out there to everyday life and have to deal with all the things going on out there. I've learned that the reason I was doing drugs was to medicate myself so I wouldn't have to feel such as many drug offenders do. I don't belive that locking people up for theses reasons works because it doesn't teach them to learn to be drug free when they get out,they have no tools to use when confronted with drugs which are everywhere. I believe rehabs, drug court and out-patient treatment centers are what they need. They need to be educated and learn how to live with this disease, addiction is like cancer, it will never go away but if you learn to control it and go into remission and can live a long successful life. As for myself like i said i'm 1yr 4days clean,I live a life full of confidence ,self-esteem , love for myself and the belief that i can stay clean for the rest of my life if I just take it One Day Ay A Time. P.s. I will be getting my kids back in 3 weeks and they are coming home to a mom who will finally be there for them,and I can't wait to do it clean and sober. So thanks to all the people in NA and AA because that program works if your willing to surrender and face thet you need help!!!!!!

Mariagreeman,
Congratulations on your one year, you must be feeling really proud. I really hope we hear about the reunion of mum and kids because Im sure that will be a shining beacon in your life. I hope they are proud too, though I'm sure you know as well as me, its not their responsibility to feel any of that, but I do hope they know how hard their mum worked to get things right. Congratulations and keep on taking those one day at a times, addicts arent the only ones that need to learn that humbling lesson. Good luck and dont let go of your support system or the pride I can see between the lines, but by the sounds of things, you already know that. :)

Happy Holidays

Seems like it has been a while since anyone posted here. I have a son who is a prisoner of war . That is what he has called it since day one. He has served 4 yrs . on a 10 yr. sentence for manufacturing. He is addicted to meth. he has been clean for 4 yrs. When he went to prison I saw him take charge of his life and he got into a drug recovery community in the prison. He will be paroled in Feb. 05. He is in another drug treatment program that lasts 10 weeks and is 3 hours a day. He has also taken anger management classes a few times. I just hope and pray every day he can stay clean and away from the drugs. He said he could make a lot of money manufacturing the drugs and he has five kids. The youngest does not remember seeing dad anywhere but in prison. The oldest is 14. When it is your child in prison you often wonder what you did wrong to put that child on this road. I had to figure out it was not what I did but it was his wrong choice. this is his third time in prison so I do not want to see him go again.

Like all the rest I think there is a better way to handle all of this than prison. I also know the offender has to want to change until that time nothing on Gods green earth is going to stop them from getting the drugs they want.

I also have a daughter who is addicted to prescription drugs. It is not a pretty site. It is hard when they start losing things . She is in the middle of a nasty divorce. Her husband does not want to give her anything . He did not want her to see her son. My daughter has went through drug rehabe a couple of times . But she has to realize you are always addicted to drugs. Well I wrote a book . Sorry about that .
dannysmom

My husband is serving 75 months for conspiracy to distribute meth. He also was addicted. He has been in almost 2 years. We have a daughter that also misses her dad so much. I think the sentences they are giving these dealers are also too harsh. Dont get me wrong I think they should be punished but being in prison and away from family for so long I dont think is the answer.
missingloren

My dad died of a heroin addiction - 6 years after he got out of spending 7 1/2 years in an Arizona prison for drugs. My husband is currently serving a 4 1/2 year sentence for trying to avoid being caught while he was out on a drug (crystal meth) binge. Both suffer/ed from chemical imbalances & both have not/did not receive help with their addiction. The purpose of them being in prison is not/was not to help them, but to simply keep them out of "normal society". Therefore, when my husband gets out and tries to put his life and our family back together - what hope does he have? Will he end up like my father? Should I just give up on him, get a divorce, and let my family heal? What hope do we have? I don't want my children living the same life that I did! If anyone wants to PM me with some advise - please do.

ebontortuga- I hear you completely.
I understand when people say that rehab will not help unless the addict turly wants to get clean. I totally understand that.
But I also know that when my boyfriend was sent to prison because of drugs, he was/is not learning how to cope with his addiction. The only thing he has learned in prison is how to be a "tough" guy so to speak. He has a hard edge to him now that he never had before. An addict needs to know that he CAN open up, that he CAN dig deep down to figure out exactly what it was that made him turn to drugs to begin with, without him feeling like a "wussie" (for lack of a better word). How easy is it for a guy to stand up in front of a bunch of other "inmates" and say that he started using cuz his dad didn't love him enough? Or that he never felt good about himself?
In my opinion, the first step in recovery is finding out what it is that made you use to begin with. I dont' know how guys can do that while locked up with a bunch of other guys with something to prove.
Just my opinion.

I have read and truly understand everyones feeling on this subject - my fiance is in prison for drugs also. I have known him for 11 years now and has always had a problem with drugs - he is an addict (herion) - but at the same time he was dealing to make the kind of money you need to keep up such a habit - he is a great person but when he is sober - the drugs totally changed who he was - he has not been locked up for 3 years and has another 3 to go and he has been in about 4 different prisons since he was first arrested - he is now at Walton and he was doing really well there as a teachers aide in the education dept - he felt like he had a purpose, that he was good at something besides being a dealer and he was helping others - well that was until they cut education and now he is picking up cigarette butts in the yard - alot of good that is going to do - I know he needs to be punised for what he has done - he physically hurt anyone by pulling a gun or stabbing anyone - but he did by making money off of them for his own pleasures - but I still feel like just throwing in a prison is not the answer - I know someone has to want to be helped to be helped - but how about all of those that truly want to kick the addiction and become human again - what happens to them do they just go on the wayside and everyone forget they exist. I do what I can - I search everyday for answers to try to better him and help him through this - he has alot of love and support from me and our son but we can't do it all when they have him behind those walls.

Corrections on my last post - "he has now been locked up? and "he physically did not hurt anyone by pulling a gun or stabbing anyone".

This is my 1st time in this forum, but drugs is what got Tito where he is now. He started on lower end end drugs and throught out the years went on to harder drugs. tito is lucky to be alive today. He is on his way home in a couple of months and i hope and pray that he does not relapse.

Good Luck to both of you and keep us all posted on his success.

My fiance is in jail..going to prison, because of the crimes he commited..to get a 'fix'..because he's an addict of Heroin,Cocaine,Crystal Meth,ANY prescription drug,Weed,any other drug you could think of and alcohol... He hardly remembers anything from the past 12 yrs..since he started useing..he regrets it every single day he sits behind bars.. I miss him so much..i wish i could have done more for him while he was a 'free man', but a power greater than I is the only thing that can help him.

~*Angel*~

Thanks for your post Angel. You will find more support then you ever imagined here.
Even though our loved ones are incarcerated because of their addictions, we go through their addiction right with them. It hurts, and its scary as hell.
Again, glad you are here! Stay strong and don't forget to take care of yourself!

I am new to PTO but I would like to tell my story. The man I share my life with was a Drug Dealer. He is now doing time for (weed) and a gun charge. He was robbed at gun point in front of his parents house and (plain and simple) it scared him to death. So despite all the warning and advice his parents and I gave him he carried this gun with him. He got caught. I am glad. I love this man and I pressed him about getting a 9-5. I even helped him look. He did but never stayed. And always sold on the side. Now he can not do anything. He has no cellphone, no calls all time of night, no friends. He was given time to think about everything. He could not even understand why I would not marry him(he asked twice). That gun was a very dangerous and stupid thing. I miss him very much and await his return. I guess I feel guilty because I used to threaten him with prison and that was where he was headed. Now he is there with a five year sentence. I was just wanting him to realize what life could be like. We could be happy without the fast money. He says one reason was he wanted to be able to provide me with anything I wanted. That makes me feel worse.

i think everyone in my life has been harmed by drugs. my brother at an early age was arrested and convicted for possession. he was in and out of jail for years. he now at the age of 48 has liver problems high blood pressure he is very sick.
my ex husband was also an addict he did about every drug possiable and passed away this year he was 54 years old.
my first husband shop lifted to support his habits and spent time in kentucky prison. he is now taking methadone and will for the rest of his life.
my oldest son has smoked pot since he was about 12 years old he has use crack coke and all kinds of pills.
my middle son chris is now in va prison for possession of cocain with intent. he also has smoked pot since an early age. he was also takeing pain pills. i didnt realize how many until he was locked up and had to come off them.
i cant leave myself out i smoked pot drank took pills used cocain and meth. i havent used anything in years now but i still blame myself for the choices my sons have made i should have been a better role model for them.
and the worst is that i recently found out that all 5 of my grandchildren are smokeing pot. they range in age from 15 to 18 years old my heart breaks for them.
i guess you could say that drugs have affected my family .

in reading these posts, it seems like we have the solution that fits what affects us personally. I for one, don't believe that my man should be in for selling the drugs, so I think that the small time dealers should not be put in prison either. He was also hooked on cocaine and pain pills. and thats why he sold it. so I guess I don't think the addicts should be put in either. I guess I sound like I think nonoe should go to prison for drugs at all. NO, thats not it. I just really don't have an answer to it. But I do know that I think that this war should begin in the law enforcement all these detectives who sell most of what they seize, and the sheriffs who have all their little flunkies, and the politicians who live by the buddy system. I live in a small town, and since my man was arrested, there was another man arrested, well, he rolled over on the sheriff, the newspaper contacted him and asked what he knew on the sheriff, he said, quote "enough to keep my ass out of jail" he wont be around much longer I bet. There was supposed to be a big federal investigation, nothing came of it. There was a detective supposidly endicted and nothing came of it, The county attorney had weed growing on his property, NOT HIS. Imagine that. and now one public official is under investigation for vote buying. He will buy his way out of that to. This is just a big crock of s**t. and the more you stir it the worse it stinks. It is all a money raquett. And as long as the big dogs can get thier flunkies to do their dirty work, then it will always be this way. It is all in who you know. and what you can do for them. I don't even vote, I never heard of an honest politician. Doubt there has ever been one, and Bush is so stupid, He don't know his ass from a hole in the ground. There I spoke my mind.

Don't Feel Bad. I Live In A Small City Also And The Haves Get Away With Just About Everything. Yet, The Have Not Men And Women Are Incarcerated For Years. Our Chief D.a. Allegedly Conspired To Kill His Wife With His Lover, Took Bribes And Got 18 Months. No Federal Charges Either. The Drug Captain Was Arrested For Rape, And Other Things. He Was Terminated Oh Excuse Me He And His Lt. Resigned. The Lt. Was Not Charged. Captain Got No Time. Another Cop Was Arrested For Abusing His Wife. She Recorded The Phone Call. No Time. I See Cases, Like In Faye. North Carolina Where The Officers Are Charged Federally Was Bad Conduct. I Also See Where Cities Are Charged With Selective Prosecution And Prosecutorial Misconduct.

Well the entire reason why Chris is in jail is because he was stupid enough to go too far with drugs. He started selling and one night he was high and on coke and a deal turned sour and a bunch of stuff happened. Chris has been in jail for almost a month now and could be in there for over a year if his case goes to federal court. So I've smoked before but now that everything has been put into perspective for us i've decided to stop and he's preaching to me all the time on the phone about me quitting and hes not going to mess with drugs once he gets out, thank God. If anyone wants to know more just let me know and ill tell the story, its not one i like too much.

-Sonia

Hi, my son-in-law has been in jail for 1 month (serving 3 years.) He got caught dealing two and a half years ago, since then he married my daughter they have a beautiful home, a beautiful daughter, and he had a full time great job THEN they put him in jail. I am a licenced substance abuse counselor and putting someone in jail after they have turned their life around makes no sense. And those that don't get "scared straight" should be mandated to treatment not prison. Thanks for listening!

Hi everyone, I just wanted to comment because my husband is doing a 3 year mandatory sentence for selling cocaine. I think this law is outragoues! My husband is doing more time for possesion of 12 grams then people who have committed manslaughter or armed robbery,All because of the mandatory laws in MA. It just gets me so angry I had to get it off my cheast...

I completely agree. My fiance is doing 3 yrs. for possession of 13 grams of coke. I think it is insane that he is in the same classification as a killer or a rapist. It makes me so angry. Nick couldnt hurt a fly yet he is being treated like he murdered someone. He has learned his lesson and should be able to move on with his life.

:pissed: My fiance just got a mandatory 3 years for coke. Its crap!

In a nut shell the "WAR" has cost my Son 4 years of his life and a free college education when he gets out!
THERE SHOULD be rehabilitation for those who want it but like Jeni said, who do you know really wants help and who doesn't ... there's a head knocker for ya!
In my Son's case he is in on a revocation because HE TOLD his probation officer that he had used two weeks before and wanted to go back to the halfway house for more counseling and to get away from where he was "stuck"[which had a no questions asked back door policy for just that reason] He was arrested on the spot! When he got to court two months later it was revealed that the UA was negative and the damn Judge would hear none of the fact it was my Son who turned himself it! Talk about the WAR SUX!!! He was supposed to get out in February but they have "too many" to release so he will have to wait another 2 or more months! WTF - as you may guess I'm the least bit happy with this whole war on drugs crap!

I still can't find that "edit" button :(

the last line above should read;
WTF ... as you may guess, I'm not the least bit happy with this whole War On Drugs crap!

China, I agree with you,it's a bunch of crap.Sounds like your son was trying to get some help and thats very good. He also sounds like he's about to change for the best.I just pray for the day that my son will see the light.I hope your son gets out soon,he shouldn't even be in.

Hi Everyone. My thoughts and prayers go out to all of you. I have been a substance abuse counselor for the last 14 years currently working in a lock up facility used to mandate 30 days of drug treatment to addicts and alcoholics. Jail is NOT the answer, if anything it adds to the problem. No one gets "all better" locked up. Treatment, rehabilitation and education is the answer. I am sick about my son-in-law being in jail for 3 years. It fixes nothing. It causes more government spending, reeks havoc in families, undue worry and stress, financial hardship etc etc.
My heart goes out to all of you. Thanks for listening and sharing!

I to work in a detox/substance abuse facility. my ex husband is currently serving a two year sentence. No jail is not the answer. Whi sowa prison actually hurt-the family! he is clean while he is in but I am gonna suggest AA/NA and counseling when he is out. Jeff is a binger. He can go long periods of time with nothing and then WHAM!!!

My boyfriend has an addiction to pain pills but he is not looked up for drug charges. He did somethings while he was messed up. Pain pills is one of the hardest they say to come off of. He was clean for 3 months while in a county jail before he was senetced to prison. he got in a fight while in the county jail and the guy busted Mikes eyelid so he had to get bailed out and go get surgery done to fix his eye and of course the doctor doped him up to put him under and then sent him home with more pain pills and kept giving him the pills eventhough Mikes mom told the doctor he has a addiction. So he was right back on pills again. He was trying to get help going to metadone treatments before he went to court and was doing great. Then he went to court they senected him to 5 years in state. He had to dry out now from everything including the methadone they wont give it to him so he was sick for several weeks while in prison. He says God is helping him and satain is the drug so I hope he will do better next time he is out.

My son-in-law is not an active user however he did get caught with 40 grams of cocaine, looking to make some extra money, stupid idea! Needless to say. So now he's doing three years, went in on his daughters first Birthday.

:) I could not agree more with you. I live in Mass. Not too far from Boston, my son had been in some very minor trouble before, nothing major, and he was stopped in his grilfriend's car, with her driving, (she had just picked him up) and she was dropping him off at our home, which is in a school zone. The police pulled her over, and illegally searched the car, he got arrested for a very MINOR amount of drugs, but, because it was a school zone, he got a MANDATORY 6 YEARS. She got NOTHING.Because she was having a baby. Even though, my son had been clean and in a clinic for 15 months and they would vouch for him. She went on to have the baby and continue with her drug problem.. :pissed: All of these people need rehab.. drugs are some times easier to get in jail than on the streets in Mass. How scarey is that? I don't know about other systems but NO ONE OVERSEES OUR JAILS...the guards answers to NO ONE, that I am aware of, other than other guards.. and most of them are scared to say any thing.
Hi, my son-in-law has been in jail for 1 month (serving 3 years.) He got caught dealing two and a half years ago, since then he married my daughter they have a beautiful home, a beautiful daughter, and he had a full time great job THEN they put him in jail. I am a licenced substance abuse counselor and putting someone in jail after they have turned their life around makes no sense. And those that don't get "scared straight" should be mandated to treatment not prison. Thanks for listening!

Very nice to read. It feels nice to know that someone like yourself is out there. That no every person thinks any person who ever touched a drug in their life ,should be locked up and never see day light again. Thanks for being positive. Let me start by saying that I am not a drug addict, nor do I have any loved ones in prison. For that, I am very grateful. I'm just an ordinary taxpayer who is paying to incarcerate hundreds of thousands of people who do not belong in prison. It seems that we always need a boogie man, and drug addicts are an excellent target.

Addictions are a complicated problem, and I've never seen anything that suggests that locking people up does anything to solve it. About all the war on drugs seems to have done, is thrown away a lot of people who could probably be saved if we Americans thought that it was important to save them. If you want to talk about apathy, I cannot think of a more apathetic approach than simply branding people as being unworthy of being with the rest of us and locking them away in a place where they receive minimal treatment.

Even worse, upon their release we make it very hard for them to hold a decent job and stay clean. Those who do manage to stay straight are to be commended. Unfortunately, I think that they are the exception to the rule. Even with the best treatment, the vast majority of drug addicts relapse a few times. I don't think that drug use by itself should be a crime.

IMHO, prisons should be for people who commit violent acts that hurt people or to a lesser extent those who commit property crimes. It is estimated that 5.6 million Americans have served time in prison. That's roughly 1.8% of our population, or one in every 50 people. It is also far too many.

It costs about $20,000 to lock someone up for a year. I cannot help but wonder if that same amount of money spent treating addictions would do far more to help people and ultimately reduce property and violent crimes. Either way we are going to pay.

I've had my go-roundies with drugs and I have been in jail for drugs. Jail didn't make
me want to stop, and twelve-step programs didn't make me want to stop. What made
me want to stop was me.

The "War On Drugs" has its roots in racism (will quote reference if you want it), and from there mutated to a power trip and moralism. That drugs are destructive is true, but if properly managed (treated, possibly with a maintenance dose) they are not
necessarily harmful. What is truly harmful is the illegality of the drugs, not the drugs
themselves.

It is a matter of record that approximately 2 percent of the population was involved
(i.e., addicted) to drugs before the turn of the last century, and approximately 2
percent of the population was involved (i.e., addicted) to drugs at the turn of this
century. Hence, prima facie the drug on wars (sic) is a failure. Not only does
ramping up the effort serve no social purpose, but it burns resource that we would
be far better off putting into other aspects of the society, and it erodes the very
fabric of a free society.

Given all this, you must ask yourself from one quarter comes the driving force behind
the war on drugs? For the answer, determine who is making money and/or deriving
power from this prohibition. Hint: it isn't the citizenry at large.

AH

goanna,
I agree with you 100%. My brother has been in prison nearly 3 years now and the drug problem in the little eastern Kentucky town did not improve by taking 31.3 years of his life unjustly. Not too long ago I posted a tread about having to tell my brother of the death of one of his neighbors--this morning he called to tell me another sibling had told him of the death of two more people from that small town. The drug war is a political farce which the federal government has allowed to continue for profit.

This is my opinion on the drug war, I was shot by two drug dealers fighting over whose block it was and who was allowed to deal drugs on that block. When I thought the blocked belonged to the city. Well any way I got caught in the cross fire while trying to get my 5 year old neice and other children out of the way. At that time I was 5 months pregnant with a baby. I was shot with a 25 those little bullets like to travel, I was hit in the hip the bullet then traveled into my stomach and lodged 1 inch from my spine. My child survived. With a minor deformity to his head. At that time I was dealing with my man in jail. He is in jail for drug dealing and murder as a result of his drug dealing. After my shooting I stopped writing him and going to see him, I was very very upset at him. And he did nothing to me but his crime I no longer could except. I almost lost my life to a drug dealer and I was fighting with every thing in me to get these men sentenced to 45 to life, because of the three strikes law. My man use to write me and ask did I really want to sentence a man to do a bid like that. And I would say to myself did they think about all those children on the street that day playing enjoying live and freedom, did they think about me and my unborn child. No they didn't. Me and my children were threated. My children could no longer walk to school by themselves, they didn't want to play outside, and they were afraid to sleep. I still went to court each and everytime. Because I wanted to see these mens life reuined as they had reuined mine and my children. I was even willing to take the stand and lie, but it never made it that far. I never saw a gun and I couldn't say who shot me, I was to busy trying to save some lives. My children howerever saw the whole thing unfold they saw who was shooting they saw when the bullet hit me and I stumbled, at that point I had to make a decesion to let my children take the stand and tell what they saw or loose my case, well I lost my case my children relived that day enough. I just want them to get back to normal and be children. When one of the gentlemen was released from jail which wasn't more than a few days after the case was dropped, he came to my home and thanked me for sparing his life, and I thanked him for reuining mine. After about 7 months after my shooting I started writting my man again and explained everything I felt and was feeling, and to my surprise he understood where I was coming from. But to this day I wish they would have all be sentenced to do that 45, because of my 25 that I walk around with lodged in my back everyday. That's what the drug war has done to me.

My wife is serving a 5 yr sentence for a crack pipe and 2 grams of crack which I think is totally overkill. I pray that this experience will enable her to beat her addiction,time will tell. As for what this has done to our family it has been a nightmare. I am now raising a beautiful 5 yr old girl alone with the closest family members 4 hours away. That is very hard with work,I am a salesman and have flexible hours so that helps but is also a problem sometimes. I believe that such harsh sentences are insane for nonviolent offenders and it is all part of a money grabbing scheme. The prison industrial complex is alive and kicking and the lawmakers and police are part of the whole scheme. To pull a parent away for their family for extended periods of time and offer no help to that person while they are locked up makes no sense whatsoever.

this so called war on drugs has ruined as many lives as drugs ever have. i Do believe there is a war to be fought on drugs.i do NOT believe it is one the government is qualified to handle.they are too concerned with "separation of church and state" to ever be close to conquering this problem. addiction is a battle within ones self , a spiritual battle.the government is not qualified to handle that. it would be nice if every one did only what thay were supposed to do, but life isn't that way. i 've seen people in all walks of life become addicted to drugs, and to rid the country of drugs, is unrealistic. if there's a demand there will always be a supply. if you take all the above menioned drugs out, people will find something else-they may huff paint, fuel, ect. but the addictive nature always finds something. i don't claim to have the answers because i don't. but i do know the government doesn't. when something takes over the person you love and changes them into some wierd stranger; to me that can only be demonic. so, as long as the government is so set on keeping God out of things, it's only going to get worse.

Simple:
It is not the drugs, it is the people.
The drug war would be better fought on grounds of humanistic terms.
Is Crack Cocaine ileagle, who cares, giving it to a 14 year old run away, do some time.
It is not the drugs it is the people.

Well I agree that durgs affect our society in one form or another. My fiance is a known drug dealer that's all he's ever be arrested for. He was exposed to drugs by his mother whom was a crack addict for many years (she's since been deceased) so instead of using drugs he sold them. People who are affected by drugs are just as vulnerable as the user. It's up to the individual if he or she wants to change. You can lead a horse to the water but you can't make him drink it. I think drug abusers should be sentenced to treatment verses going to prison, as well as drug dealers, because they should be given a reality check on what they are doing to people. http://www.prisontalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon6.gif

I too have had my bouts with drugs and run ins with authorities. 12 step programs made me want to go and use and it's just as easy to get drugs in jail as it is to get in the streets it's basically up to the individual. Change is available for anyone who wants to take make it; and not jail, program, or prison will alter that. we are creatures created with free will.

gramof7 that is very good that you have never used a drug and that you don't see an addict as a third rate citizen, because that is just what law enforcement views anyone who is or has been affiliated with drugs and the treatment is always mal-treatment to a druggy or drug dealer.

Shortayraw,we all have done things good and bad, but thank God you and the children are here. God will fight you and your children's battle if you keep still that was a cosiderate thing; a motherly thing to do, not to let your children be be witnesses at a criminal trial. the bullet is there for you to remember that God was with you even while you were doing wrong (feel me) great story!!!!!!!!!

[I have my son in prison on drug charges. He di not sale just fot self us.Yes this people need help not prison,where it is so tough life that make them more angry. Iam from Europe and there are not such hard sentences. A rapist going for 1 and a half year. And a lot of people turn their life around. I am so angry that what is huppend in fact? A lot of lifes are destroid . Like you said...no hope whaen you come hope. And then guess what?.... comback to drugs. Instead this people need help. There are so many thing to say......so unjustice.....What we can do...?

[Wichinblue....your thread said every thing I wanted to say....word by word.....I am so angry too. I am from Europe....you would not believe a rapist there take 1 year.....and here a drug offender lost all his life....I am so angry ....

[Wichinblue....your thread said every thing I wanted to say....word by word.....I am so angry too. I am from Europe....you would not believe a rapist there take 1 year.....and here a drug offender lost all his life....I am so angry ....

Caressa1, I understand you very much. However, we cannot give up. What you have done is a big step--look for a support group, found PrisonTalk, and spoke up. That is a beginning and bless you for having done that.

I recently made a speech at a conference regarding my brother's 31.3 year sentence and in the audience was a gentleman from England. During the Q&A session, he raised his hand and said something like this: "I'm from England. The point here is not whether your brother is guilty or innocent, it is the absurdity of the sentence. In England someone would only get 10 to 12 years for murdering someone!" The fact is that here in the United States, people who murder, rape, rob etc. get less time also. But we cannot give up. We must continue to do everything we can to convince peopel the war on drugs has taken the justice from our criminal justice system rendering it a criminal system.

After reading all the threads I think that StacysWar030 is the most factual and regularguy seems to lack all understanding of drug addiction and how the drug laws are applied. Maybe California is different from the other states in how they apply their drug laws. Something most missed the point on is that the drug laws aren't about rehabilitating. They are about money and the government being able to steal citizens property through drug forfitures. There are many studies done on how the forfiture laws have changed the way drug crimes are investigated and processed. These laws were originally intended for the drug dealers making millions of dollars in drugs but they are actually being applied to the small time dealers because the police and prosecuters know these people can't afford lawyers to stop them in their abuse of power. I live in an area that is considered the meth capitol of the USA. Most of what I see is an abuse of gov power. In my County every cop from city to state except one officer is on the take. People have tried making complaints to state and federal officials. Is anything ever done? NO! NO! and NO!

I agree that everyone must hit their own "bottom" before rehab works but we know that prison does NOT work. Myself I would rather see drug offenders in a long term (2-3 years) treatment program than prison for any length of time. At least they have a chance of doing something betterwith their life than they do by being in prison. And look at the cost of treatment VS prison. Treatment stats are usually based on short term treatment (a few months). This isn't long enough for a person with a serious long term addiction. People with no understanding of addtictions don't seem to understand that when a person has an addiction it's not just a sipmle choice of saying OK I'm not going to do this any more. Besides giving up the drug they must change EVERYTHING about their life. Friends, activites, etc. And when they are trying to make new friends that haven't ever used drugs what is it that they have in common, to strike up conversation about? People with no experience in drug abuse are often very cold towards those trying to turn their life around. Yet want to complain about why don't they do something different with their lives.

Prison is degrading and teaches people to become hardened to life. This does NOTHING to help a person with an addiction. People with addictions are usually hiding from tramatic situations that have previously happened to them in life. Also how many families are torn apart, children left without a father (stats show this puts a child at a higher risk for crime, drug abuse, etc)? The work force is void of people that could be in it?

Prison is Not the answer to drug addiction!

My husband is going to prison for manufacturing meth. The first time he got busted, he got probation. Now, a felon, on probation, he is looking at prison time. Im divorsing him after 20 yrs of marriage and 2 boys. Meth is a terrible thing. He is addicted to making it as much as smoking it . He has gave up his family this time. I dont understand it.......

WoW! Reading all these posts about the drug war I see it from several different sides. I've battled the evil of meth off and on for about 10 years. By off and on I mean I've gone through times where I haven't touched it for years then suddenly for one excuse or another I start up again. Right now I'm sober, I haven't touched that posion since New Years and of course like most addicts I don't plan on ever using again but as an addict I know that it's something I'll battle for the rest of my life. During my last run which started August of 2003 I ended up losing my mom ( October 2003) but it still took several months for the impact of that loss to sink in...I realize now that I missed the last few months of her life because of my addiction. I'm also a mom to 5 beautiful children and now that I'm sober can see that when I'm "high" I'm missing out on their life and that's something I can't ever get back either. I pray everyday, sometimes several times a day to continue to have the strength and support to stay clean. My boyfriend is also a meth addict who has spent the last 7 years in and out of prison for different crimes but most of them trace back to some type of substance abuse. His convictions were all prior to us being together and he currently will be released Oct of 04. We both realize that we have a long road ahead of us but with the love and support of family and friends we feel we can make it. Locking up people who are drug offenders isn't the answer but at the same time you can't force someone to give up the life of substance abuse. In a manner of speaking it's a double edge sword with no quick and easy answer. Rehab might be helpfully but only to someone who really wants the help. What about the person who's crime isn't just for substance abuse what do we do then? Offer them rehab for the one crime and jail time for the other? So long as there is access to drugs there will continue to be this ongoing debate. If I've offended anyone my apologies.

Danny's mom,
Did you know that your son could possibly get a sentence modification on that manufacturing charge?? Has he filed a motion to correct illegal sentence??

The war on drugs?:confused:
Does that mean we are fighting are own citizens to stop doing drugs?
By putting them in prison. That's like putting a kid in a candy stores. Telling the kid do not take any candy from anyone... Ya sure and what do you think that kid is going to do? I don't watch to much TV on this one cause I had a special friend who went to prison in Nevada for selling. They wanted to give him twenty-five years. His parole officers called me to find out why he was in california and skip out? Smell the coffee Mr. it's burning. TWENTY_FIVE years. give me a break. His parole officer said didn't you know he made kids buy from him. First of all he woke me up and I'm not very nice when someone wakes me up for bull...He never sold or made kids buy the dope.. He sold because he had a habit. I didn't tell him that. But that's why he sold. Anyway to make a long story short he got two years. I thought I was going to die. I was in las Veags every two weeks to see him until he got the chain to Wells, Neveda. He was in a level one prison. It was a fire camp. They had a fence around the place, I knew all the officers. They had a lake, a dog and herion. They probably had other drugs but he liked H. So now they put this man who is a user in a place where he can get anything. When he was in county in Los angeles, he told me to give this lady next to me 20.00 bucks. I said are you nuts? No It's for dope. Great, just what I wanted to know. So what are we doing for these men who go to prison because they user drugs? nothing but feeding their habit. There is more drugs in prison than on the streets and it's right in front of their faces. That's if they meet the right people and if there in prison long enough they find out who's using. So all we are doing is take nice Joe and turn them in to a bad Jose. But no matter what anyone tells you they go to jail or prison cause it's a money making thing. The real scarey thing is they shared needles, oh he said they washed the needle out with beach. I sure hope they did... So if this is what the war on drug is all about why not just sell it in the corner store and taxes it....You know America is a king pin in the drug game..Because if america wanted to stop drugs they would. Look what happen to booze in the 20's....That's my story...It's a rude awaking to prison life...huggs...minnie:cool:

My husband has been in a federal prison for 13 years ... since he was 18. He received a LIFE sentence w/o parole for "conspiracy to possess with intent to distribute." He didn't have a possession charge. It's the most obsene thing I have ever heard of. He has only one chance at freedom, clemency from the President of the U.S. Can you guess what the chances of that are? SLIM to NONE. This has been a nightmare for our family. Our son has NEVER seen him in the free world. When he was born my husband had been in prison for 3 months. Life for conspiracy ... it still blows me away.

I have been hit by the war on drugs. Ive been an addict since my teens and finished up a term in the feds(lompoc) for aiding abbetting a conspiracy. Yes drugs are destructive im here to tell you but prison is as destructive to families. Did going to prison change me yes and no. I no longer sell to support my habit but i do on occasion use and ive been in 3 different rehabs including the rdap in the feds. I dont have any answers to the tough questions but it is obvious that prison even with rehabs doesnt get the job done. maybe we all are doomed by the mistakes we made along time before we went away. after 5 years sober to be kept awake thinking about drugs and getting high and the drug nightmares that accompany these times the only relief i seem to find is in drugs. i know its a cop out but to me it seemed right at the time anyway until us addicts quit pulling the stuff we pull to get high we will keep going back thats is a fact.

I have a brother not by blood but we grew up together parents were best friends. He is addicted to crack, herion, coke weed and whatever else he can get his hands on. He is been released today. He spends more time in jail then on the outside. On the inside he function very well works does all the right things including not doing drugs. I can tell he will be out no longer then six months and get busted again for being high on something. he has spent half of his thirty years in jail started when he was like 12. No one addresses the problem with drugs they find for his crime which is stealing they would rather him be locked up. Everytime he gets arrested for stealing its to feed his drug problem and the police know this but no one wants to face the issuse locking him up is not the answer he finds more ways in there how to feed his drugs problem. I also have friend he just got busted there looking at giving him forty years for non violent possention of pot, what is wrong wiht the picture when people with violent back grounds get alot less time.

goanna,
I just dont understand the amont of time your brother is receiving. My husband friend just got busted in washinton non violence no weapons and is looking at forty years for pot. In canada our sentences would not be that long. They lock up but most people dont do over a year for drugs which i think they need to be in rehab more then they need to be in prison.


I agree with you 100%. My brother has been in prison nearly 3 years now and the drug problem in the little eastern Kentucky town did not improve by taking 31.3 years of his life unjustly. Not too long ago I posted a tread about having to tell my brother of the death of one of his neighbors--this morning he called to tell me another sibling had told him of the death of two more people from that small town. The drug war is a political farce which the federal government has allowed to continue for profit.

i think they are locking people up more for drugs then violent crimes against woman and children, what is wrong with that picture. I think they need to start changing the laws. California now says instead of locking them up going to put them through programs more states need to look at that. 31.3 years is a long time same with my husbands friend of forty years in federal.

well let me tell you guys something. i went friday night with my bro to see his month old baby inthe hospital. he was born month ago and is a addicted to crack and meth. it was the hardest thing i have ever seen. I have two babys of my own and thank god ive never used drugs in my life. they were giving the baby injections of morphin to help him wiht his withdrawels. to me that would be a wake up call to never do drugs again but like i said im not a drug user. I cried when i seen the baby have the shakes and withdrawls it was worse then a adult going through one. thanks for listening

Government research has many times over proven the cost of treatment for addicted offenders would many times over pay for itself. However, incarceration has became big business in this country.And it goes far beyond the two multi-million dollar companies that are raking the bucks for housing our loved ones.There are now outside industries setting up shop inside prisons and the inmates are forced to work for a few cents an hour, doing jobs that someone on the street would make good money for. I had rather see the jobs go over seas, at least they pay the children they exploit a little more than our inmates are recieving. Still, it does not stop here. Think of all those nice people our tax dollars are supporting, so they can devote thier time locking up hardened criminals, like the Daddy who comes home from work and smokes a joint.These folks, lawyers, judges, cops, clerks,prison gaurds, etc. all feed the U.S.economy in other ways, such as the purchase of office materials, the annual purchase of new patrol cars, equipment,thier personal expenditures, etc.The phone companies and the prisons are getting fat off our money everytime a loved one calls us. I understand the Blue Mist Motel in Arizona takes full advantage of being the only motel in a prison town, charging $65 per night knowing full well if someone is stuck with the rate, it is likely to be someone who is too poor to own a car to drive themselves.I know there are many more such places around the country. We spend money on gas to visit and rooms to stay overnight. We feed covience stores and fast food restraunts. Book stores and magazine companies adore us and whoever gets lucky enough to supply the commisaries always earn the best profit possible.The proof has been in for years that long term substance abuse treatment dramatically increases an offenders chances of making it upon release. But noone will ever get all the people in this country that ride this gravy train to step aside and allow enough treatment programs to be put into place to do any good. I spent months in a macro econmics class to figure out just why things seem so screwed up in the system. The answer when the fat cats are making money it does not matter whether something is just or even sensible. It is allowed to become an integral part of our economy.Thus, it has to be allowed to continue nomatter how ludicrous it may be. Consider that since the 70's we have went from 250,000 inmates in the U.S. to around 2 million with no less than 75% of them in for drug related crime. Then, take into account that probably close to that number of jobs for people here in the free world would be somehow immediately affected by a sudden dramatic change in the incarceration rate.This would create a sort of ripple effect across the country. Noone in government is going to allow that change and chance this event happening, nor chance the stock they own in all the businesses prison families are supporting dropping in value. It is sad, but true there will be little change in the system and if it comes it will come slowly. So what the drug war has been and is doing for this entire country is destroying lives and costing outrageous sums of money that could be better spent on treatment, but won't.

This subject is a very fitting one for me. I have had two brothers (out of 5) in prison in Oklahoma because of their use of and intent to distribute crank.(crystal, meth, ice...whatever you want to call it) I don't even know where to start. These two brothers were in trouble since they were teenagers. They would sneak away from home, steal stuff, drink, and do marijuana. They both went to reform school as teenagers. However, as the years went on, they continued to get in trouble. They had DUIs, marijuana charges, etc., etc., etc. The oldest of the two, Jimmy, started doing methamphetamine when he was in his twenties after he was diagnosed with a rare form of emphysema caused by an enzyme deficiency in the lungs. He kind of went off the deep end. He started shooting instead of just snorting or smoking. Well, he ended up going to jail on a possession charge and an illegal weapon charge. It turned out that they younger of the two, Ronnie, was willing to bail him out of jail if he went to rehab. At that time, Ronnie was working hard in the oilfield and making a name for himself that way. He still did marijuana and he even dabbled in selling it. Anyway, Jimmy, went to rehab for about 6 months. He came out clean and sober and stayed that way for a little while. Eventually, he got back into it. He also drank whiskey every day and stayed high on whatever else he could get his hands on. In the meantime, Ronnie had saved up a lot of money from working and all that and he ended up being able to start his own company with a couple of rigs and stuff. He wasn't selling mj anymore, but was still smoking it. He was always very strictly against meth. Jimmy spent the next 10 years doing crank off and on, being in and out of county jail on little charges. He was shot once by his wife's mother when he and his wife got into an argument. He was shot in the leg and had to be hospitalized and have surgery to repair the leg. Let's see, time went on. Ronnie got into crank. He started using heavily and started getting deeper and deeper into trouble. It ended up ruining his marriage of 21 years. Jimmy went to prison in December of 2002 for charges of possession and possession with intent to distribute CDS. I'm still unclear if he was distributing mj or crank, but know one of the possession charges was for crank. At the time when Jimmy went to jail, I didn't have much contact with him. His lifestyle was just not conducive to having me and my family around him. I didn't want to endanger my children or myself by going to his home which was usually full of drunks and druggies. Then, in December of 2003, my other brother, Ronnie went to prison for the exact same charges. I do know that his "intent" charge was based on crank, not mj. Anyway, they both got 5 years. When Ronnie was incarcerated, it really hit home for me. How could this person who was totally against crank be in jail for using and distributing it? I decided to contact Jimmy and to stay in touch with Ronnie. I knew that they both must be really needing family at that time. I am ashamed it took me so long to come around on Jimmy, but am so thankful that I made contact when I did. Jimmy was to be up for parole this past July. As it turned out, he found out he had cancer while incarcerated. In June, he found out it was terminal within 6 months. His parole hearing in July turned out to be changed to a medical commutation hearing. He was released on August 5, 2004 and he died at our parents' home on October 15, 2004. So, you see, the 10 months that Jimmy and I had to write letters to each other and see each other during prison visitations and then at our parents' home after he was released is all I have left now. I was so happy to know that Jimmy had gone through a very good rehab program in jail and truly wanted to change his life and show that he could use the things he learned in that program to stay clean on the outside. Even before he knew he had cancer, he would write about things he was going to do on the outside and about how he prayed for himself and our family. It just seems so unfair to me that Jimmy got what I feel was a life sentence for his involvement in drugs. He didn't die in prison only because I fought the system tooth and nail until they got him approved for medical commute. He might have died if he had been on the outside when all of this happened, but I have to believe that he would have gotten care a lot sooner and maybe he wouldn't have been at Stage IV lung cancer with metastases all over his body when they found out about it.. Maybe if he hadn't been in prison, he could have found out at Stage 1 and been able to have surgery or something. Of course, I will never know. The other scenario is that if he hadn't gone to prison, he might have died from the drugs or something else. Who knows. Ronnie is still in and he is in a minimum security facility awaiting a work center assignment. He was denied any of the rehab programs because they are all so full that they are only accepting court-ordered inmates. Isn't that crazy? Let's lock him up for drug use and distribution, but not give him any rehab program to help him change his way of thinking.

I don't know what the Drug War has done for me, but I know that drugs cost one of my brothers his life (either directly or indirectly depending on how you look at it...), and cost another brother - his wife, his business, his chance to say goodbye to his dying brother, his chance to go to his brother's funeral, his chance to go to his daughter's graduation from OU, his chance to go to his daughter's wedding, his freedom.

I don't believe that a simple rehab program for drug offenders works. I don't believe that incarcerating offenders without some sort of rehab program works. I think we should have better programs for teenage offenders so that they don't stay in the system their whole lives. Maybe a longer reform school that focuses on rehabilitation, spirituality, life skills and work skills. For older offenders, the same sort of program for maybe a year or two. I feel that everyone convicted of multiple drug offenses should be required to go through that sort of program. I also believe that they should work harder at keeping drugs out of the prison system.

jimmy sis,
Great post. Thanks for sharing. I am so sorry about your brother Jimmy. I often wonder just what will work to win the drug war. My son is in prison for drug related charges. Even before that happened, I went through hell for 4 yrs fighting a losing battle against his drug addiction. And it does amaze me that everybody knows there is a lot drug trafficing in prison. My son's parole board told me drugs are easier to get in prison than out. It doesn't make sense that these people who have so much power over inmates' futures and make the decisions over their life can't control ongoings within a locked system.

i got a conspiracy charge for hanging around someone i guess i was arressted for hearsay

wow, jimmy sis. that was certainly an ordeal to say the least. our son was 22 when he was arrested for conspiracy. just the thought of the actual charge he was convicted of makes me ill. conspiracy (thinking about doing something, conspiring to do something). he didn't have possession, or sell to an agent or anything. this 188 month prison sentence has ruined our lives. his son was 3 yo when he went in. his father was recovering from a serious heart attack. he'll be nearly 40 when he gets out under the current sentencing laws. he's been in for 3 years, and everytime there's some kind of "movement" or "reform" talk in the sentencing circles, our hopes get back up there. but the reality is that on bop.gov it says: november 13, 2015. i tell all of my friends that we're prisoners of the drug war. that's basically what it is. all of us are prisoners of the drug war, not just the incarcerated.
keep the faith!
stay focused!
mary

Hi poppi500,
I see that was your first post. Welcome to PTO. Sorry to hear you were arrested for hearsay. My son was violated on his parole because he was riding in a car that had pot under the driver's seat. The driver admitted it was hers, not his, it was her car. And it was the first time he had been out with this girl, a blind date.
His parole officer sent him back because it was "within arm's reach" of my son. He was just looking for a way to violate my son anyway. He and I had already had a few disagreements. My son wanted to plead innocent of the new charge but (once again) he pled guilty because they told him he would be better off; no time added. If he fought it, he might lose and get more time in addition to going back for the pv.
He has a felon record for behavior while under the influence of drugs and I carry part of the guilt. I called the police when he was threatening to kill himself (he was crazy from some wild drugs he had taken).I wanted them to take him for help. When they arrived, we discovered the knife he was going to use was an illegal hunting knife so instead of help he got arrested for having a concealed weapon because he had put the knife in his waistband when they arrived. As soon as they asked him if he had any weapons, he handed it over. They would not take him to a mental ward; they just put him in a cell. That was a hard lesson for me; learning who to call for help.
I wanted him to fight that one but he was told it would go easier on him to plead guilty since it was true he had the knife, even though he only had it to do harm to himself; possession is possesion. What a crazy system!

WOW ALL OF THIS HITS HOME. my man is looking at anywhere fr 105 to 300 months for poss w/ intent to distribute he is in the feds. he was selling to support his habits. he and i got together right after he got out of the joint for 3 years for the same exact thing! i used to beg and plead and tell him you do not need to sell drugs. what are me and the babies going to do if you go to jail?but obviously the choice was his and he told me that he was doing it so we didn't have to struggle with bills and so the kids wouldn't have to go without.mind you i am a hairstylist(self-employed) but i made enough to keep a roof over our heads and clothes on our backs.welfare helped us with food medical and childcare.but that was not enough for divine. he was used to the fast lifestyle of drug dealing which i for one am no stranger to i started dealing drugs at age of 12 started smoking weed a year earlier then there were valium and alcohol. so me and divine come from the streets and the same set of friends and associates who use and sell and belong to gangs. i grew up with parents who used and still do. so maybe it was inevitable that i followed right behind and eventually started selling crack to my own father.this is not easy for me to say because until now i guess i didn't see a pattern let alone a problem. well when i started seeing divine i was still selling crack at the age of 21 and still smoking weed every day. i had a son that had just turned 1 and me and his father had split because he abused pcp or wet as we call it. then came divine and i fell in love with him and so did my son.we were together for 6 months before i got pregnant with his son.we moved to a different area i stopped selling and started working as a hairstlist at a nearby salon and he started using pcp drinking alcohol daily and eventually started on cocaine. i could not protest his use because i was a weed head . well time after time he went to jail and each time he was drunk or high. he almost died once when he crashed my cadillac into 2 parked cars. not from the impact but because he was so high and drunk that he passed out and his breathing shut down. at court i cried when the judge who has dealt with divine many a time told him that this destructive behavior has got to stop he told him he needed to thank the firefighters who gave him the right drug to bring him back and told him he needed to start aa/na classes right away.of course divine didn't listen and ignored the advise and orders of the judge.presently we are waiting for him to be sentenced he took a plea. i am still working although we lost our apt.my two sons 3 yrs and 5 months and i are staying with my mom until i can get it together.i realized that i need to quit smoking weed one day when my cousin called and my son said "come over my mom got weed" that was my wake up call and quitting is going to be my new year's resolution.but it is going to be hard considering that everyone in my mom's house smokes and most of my family and friends do drugs and drink.i am looking forward to being drug free and teaching my sons that you do not need drugs to be happy.i know i can do it.this is how drugs have affected my life. and it's not even the half of it. lol lia

divinelove,
I am sorry you are in such a difficult environment. Maybe you should consider going to AA/NA. I hope you resist all the temptations so you can give your sons a great role model.

I agree with alot that has been said about the ones serving time. I feel that there is a difference between a dealer and a user. The dealer wants the money and he really don't care who from or what age the all mighty dollar is much more addictive then any drug on the market. I feel the dealers need sentance for a long time sorry but just the way I feel. the people who has became addicted to meth or what ever drug now owes his life to his dealer at what ever cost. The abusers are the ones that are behind bars while the very ones who stole their freedom away from them and their family ect are free. I am sick about this and believe me the dealer have the money to pay their way out. The dealer do not care about the wife that is getting beat or the child that is going without diapers or food they care about one thing the money. In short put the dealers away and put the poor souls that have an addiction in a long trem rehab.
Karen Mothers Against Methamphetamine Of Rolla Mo.

The war on drugs? Oh, you mean the war on people. Okay.

Well, it's done quite a bit to me-

It makes getting my perfectly LEGAL narcoctics from the pharmacy almost impossible without the pharmacist running 8000 checks on me, and then making me wait 2 hours to pick it up.

It even makes my doctor a little nervous at time to prescribe these things- and he's an ONCOLOGIST!

But, it's made NO difference in my ability (should I chose to exercise it) to buy pot from the guy down stairs, or some dope from around the corner.

The only thing this stupid "war" has done is hurt innocent people, AND put people, that don't deserve to be in prison, in prison.

Makes me mad!

kc8003,
I have always said the same thing, lock up the dealers. But what about the people who start dealing because they are addicts? Isn't that how a lot of dealers start? Do we treat them as addicts or dealers?

I know what you are saying. the abuser does mule for the dealers so they can get their drug. I still say (the DEALERS) that is in their plans to send out the weak to do their work for them. Do you understand were I am coming from. The main people is only out for the money and really do not care that much for the drugs. If they can get enough young or old poeple to mule for or run for them they can stay safe and warm in ther homes while our love ones are going to jail/prison. The main ones will never stop because of the love of the money and the life style it provides them. My son who was addicted to Methamphetamines would do anything for the dealer he was getting the stuff from. Guess what he is not behind bars while the dealer is still out destorying lives. Why because the dealer has thusands of dollars to pay for lawyers. Did my son do some dealing I do not know I do know he never had money. He would get paid and within one hour he would be broke. I believe that most people never pay for their first hit of drugs but they pay later over and over and over.

Yes, I do know where you are coming from. I always told my son I hated dealers more than anybody because drugs ruin so many lives. By at some point I believe my son did cross over to support his habit. In fact, one of his charges is for possession with intent to distribute (pot). My son was involved with a group of people that I don't even like to think about. At 16, he was attracted to the parties and life of no responsibilites. He counted down the days till he was 17 so he could leave home without me having the law drag him back. (It was an every weekend event for us to report him missing and the cops to bring him home). I tried to get juvie to take him and they wouldn't. They told me since he was 16, it was "too late" and they just wait until they are 17 so they can prosecute them as an adult. If I could only go back in time, they wouldn't get away with that answer now.
Anway, after he was 17, it took me 4 yrs to drag him out of that lifestyle. I am lucky I was never arrested for stalking or harrassment of some of the places he lived. Even my brother, who lives 200 miles away, tried to help which is odd since he has a substance problem too so he is no good example. Without my knowledge, he went to a house where my son was staying and tried physically dragging my son out. There was fighting. The porch railings were torn up from people crashing through them. Then somebody came up behind my brother and split his head open with a baseball bat. My brother drives an 18 wheeler. After he had his head split open, he got back in his truck and proceded to drive the truck through that yard, headed for the house. Good thing the police showed up. The police told my brother to leave town and no charges would be filed on anybody. (We live in a small town where things are done "different").They said they understood what he was trying to do and were watching that house, waiting for enough to get a good bust. A lot of young kids lived there off and on.
So, without meaning to, I have just told you one example of my drug trauma. I guess you could say that was definitely a "drug war".

Jan7e1,
What part of missouri are you from? If you do not want to give it to me I understand. I am from Rola Mo. and the drugs have taken over our high school. Meth is everwhere and the girls are loosening there looks fast by useing meth as a way of wt control. If only they new what was in story for them. Like you I pulled my son out of some pretty nasty places and I also ran some pretty nasty people away from his apartment. If I could turn the clock around I would had stop inableing him long ago. Love will make you do that. You know I am kinda of scared for my son to be release from prison because I am so afraid what will happen. Is that bad or what. He keeps saying never again but the triggers are all around here in Rolla. God help me I dont want him there but yet I am scared for him to be free.

kc,
I am in Moberly. Once again, the front page of our paper had a story about another Meth drug bust. They have really been reigning them in around here during the past couple of years, which I am thankful for. If nothing else, I hope it scares other people from trying the same thing.
I talked to my son on the phone today about the local drugs. He has seen others from around here recently coming into the prison where he is. They tell him the current drug of choice is cocaine.
I know exactly what you mean about the fear of when they come home. I am facing that now. I have no control over the situation. But I have faith that he is telling me the truth; that he is done with that life. He is ready to start anew.

I would encourage everyone who is concerned about the war on drugs, which is destroying families daily in our "free" country, to read about the latest facts, figures and join up with others in your local areas to get laws and reforms started or keep them going in your homestate. November Coalition is a grassroots advocacy organization dedicated to this exact subject.
http://www.november.org

Unless we the people speak out and let legistlative members know what we want - we won't see any changes take place.

My boyfriend got caught selling in 1995, after that he changed his life around. He worked his 9-5 came home and was a father to our son. Now all of this mess has caught up with him and they locked him up last year. Sentenced to 11 years! :mad: So now he is in Indiana - I am in Arizona and he is locked up with murders and rapists and he has totally changed his life around. He does NOT belong in there. He has never been in any other trouble - no priors at all. I just don't get it. They are wasting millions of tax payers money for a man that has already learned his lesson to sit in prison depressed.

I am sorry that you and your family are victims of the "drug war"-you know first hand, just how much of a waste the entire scheme has been, wasted money, wasted lives, and families destroyed, across the US. It is important that people speak out about this kind of injustice so that our voices are heard in places where it matters. Contact your legistlative members in your area, write letter, telling them what has happened, let them know you are mad and want changes in the laws. They won't vote for things we want to see happen if they don't know what those things are.

If you are in a position and so inclined at this time, please join up with others who are in this battle to put an end to the "drug war" and help bring justice back into the courts. If you would like to have more info, or want to talk, please email me anytime at robins@november.org, I will be glad to talk to you anytime.

I know how lonely it is when someone you love is gone, prison is not something most have any true concept of at all, and most of the community is not sensitive to issues that families must deal with once their loved one is in prison. It's hard. I have 4 children, and their father just went back to prison again, this time to serve two 6/5 year sentences. He has been in prison most of his entire adulthood now, only out for a year or two at a time inbetween. It's hard to rehabilite people who never were taught habilitation in the first place. Our children are 16, 6, 2 and 1.






My boyfriend got caught selling in 1995, after that he changed his life around. He worked his 9-5 came home and was a father to our son. Now all of this mess has caught up with him and they locked him up last year. Sentenced to 11 years! :mad: So now he is in Indiana - I am in Arizona and he is locked up with murders and rapists and he has totally changed his life around. He does NOT belong in there. He has never been in any other trouble - no priors at all. I just don't get it. They are wasting millions of tax payers money for a man that has already learned his lesson to sit in prison depressed.

I am new to this and need some advice My son was incarcerated at Putnamville due to his addiction to heroine and his need to rob to support his habit. He did alot of time for that love of his. He should have had intense treatment rather than incarceration but has paid for his crime, as I believe he should. He was released Christmas Eve has checked himself into a 9 month in house rehabilitation program and has 2 years of probation. He has been clean for a year and I pray every day that he fights to keep himself clean. Where can he go to get some assistance in helping him financially and emotionally get back into society. Are there programs that help assist them after they are released? This forum helped me through his time in prison. I didnt respond much but just reading the posts made me feel as though I wasnt alone.
Thanks

Hello,
Here is a link to a page that has a vast amount of resources for both you and your son. http://www.novembercoalition.org/ReEntry/index.html

Your son will need to contact public welfare offices/housing projects/employment banks/medicaid and social security administration and ask for information on state specific programs that may be avail to him right now. If he is living in a halfway house or transitional setting on parole/probation he may be eligible for food stamps in some locations, not all-although the laws recently changed regarding this-he will have to check with his local public assistance office to find out what programs he may qualify for.

Also, he will find lots of support that is very important to have-both now and in the future to assist in his recovery and stabilitation to maintain a sober lifestyle. Many addicts vow to the fact that the key factor to their ability and maintanence of being clean has been the support of others and more importantly staying away from old people, places and things they used to hang around or were familiar with when using, staying out of the old places and away from the old people keeps their mind on not using...when they see old things that reminds them of old times then that is when they say it gets hard to stay clean..and if someone they used to know comes around who is still using, then that is not good, it's hard to stay clean when others are offering it to you, esp. when you are already put in many new unfamiliar situations after being released into the community again from prison.

I would also encourage you to join a support group. Some find that groups like Al Anon- are very good for family and friends to find supportive help and encouragement, even if the loved one was not necessarily using alcohol, the program still focuses on the same basic principles that are noted to be very helpful to those who are seeking such help from others.

Please feel free to email me anytime if you would like to talk or have questions. I would be happy to discuss or answer any questions you may have, or if you just need to talk - please contact me anytime.
robins@november.org


I am new to this and need some advice My son was incarcerated at Putnamville due to his addiction to heroine and his need to rob to support his habit. He did alot of time for that love of his. He should have had intense treatment rather than incarceration but has paid for his crime, as I believe he should. He was released Christmas Eve has checked himself into a 9 month in house rehabilitation program and has 2 years of probation. He has been clean for a year and I pray every day that he fights to keep himself clean. Where can he go to get some assistance in helping him financially and emotionally get back into society. Are there programs that help assist them after they are released? This forum helped me through his time in prison. I didnt respond much but just reading the posts made me feel as though I wasnt alone.
Thanks

Thank you so much


Hello,
Here is a link to a page that has a vast amount of resources for both you and your son. http://www.novembercoalition.org/ReEntry/index.html

Your son will need to contact public welfare offices/housing projects/employment banks/medicaid and social security administration and ask for information on state specific programs that may be avail to him right now. If he is living in a halfway house or transitional setting on parole/probation he may be eligible for food stamps in some locations, not all-although the laws recently changed regarding this-he will have to check with his local public assistance office to find out what programs he may qualify for.

Also, he will find lots of support that is very important to have-both now and in the future to assist in his recovery and stabilitation to maintain a sober lifestyle. Many addicts vow to the fact that the key factor to their ability and maintanence of being clean has been the support of others and more importantly staying away from old people, places and things they used to hang around or were familiar with when using, staying out of the old places and away from the old people keeps their mind on not using...when they see old things that reminds them of old times then that is when they say it gets hard to stay clean..and if someone they used to know comes around who is still using, then that is not good, it's hard to stay clean when others are offering it to you, esp. when you are already put in many new unfamiliar situations after being released into the community again from prison.

I would also encourage you to join a support group. Some find that groups like Al Anon- are very good for family and friends to find supportive help and encouragement, even if the loved one was not necessarily using alcohol, the program still focuses on the same basic principles that are noted to be very helpful to those who are seeking such help from others.

Please feel free to email me anytime if you would like to talk or have questions. I would be happy to discuss or answer any questions you may have, or if you just need to talk - please contact me anytime.
robins@november.org

You are very welcome, please let me know if I can do anything else..I am more than glad to help out if I can.


Thank you so much

What has the drug war done to us ? Pretty much everything it possible can do !!!!!!!

I'm stunned at the number of you that blame the dealers; I'm not saying they are in the right to deal, but putting the blame ALL on somebody other than your loved one seems odd and I feel until your loved one accepts responsiblity what what they've doing wrong they're doomed to repeat it.

I understand parts of addiction, but I also understand that countless people have beaten it and it seems to me that passing the blame along does no good for anybody.

I haven't been on this site for a while, but I think this is probably the most important subject to anyone related to or involved with an incarcerated person or an addict. This entire "war on drugs" is bass-ackwards if you ask me. While we make everything illegal, we finance the bigger guys who finance the politicians who control the ethics of the so-called authorities and it just goes in one fierce circle. In the meantime we overload our prisons, hospitals and morgues with individuals who are victims of addiction from whatever perspective you look at it. Because drugs are illegal, our little genuises consider economics when attempting to developing cheaper and faster ways to produce and distribute the stuff to support their addiction to either the drug or the money. Meanwhile, back at the farm, the main guy - most likely one of the communities upstanding wealthy types is promoting the flow of this stuff back and forth and profitting on both ends. He manages to keep himself clean by buying his way out of it.

I honestly believe if you would legalize all of substances and then take the funds spent on arresting, trying to rehabilitate and torturing the supposed perpetrators and spend it on providing safe transport for users who can't get away from it, safehouses for addicts and strict monitoring on those who you can now know are purchasing, using and not trying to get over it, the world would be a better place. It's an easy pitch to make, but making it happen would threaten the stability of a very large underworld industry that reaches all levels of society.

My family has been victimized in many ways by addiction and I know how it hurts. But addiction is not a crime, it is a weakness! When you throw an addict into a prison without proper rehab, you can almost guarantee a very angry, mentally and physically unstable person. When you make addiction and all the problems that go along with a crime, you end up with the huge problem we have today!

I think its a safe bet to say that all addicts live with guilt no matter what they are addicted too, which might even come as a surprise to some of you and you may find it hard to believe. The more destructive the substance; the bigger the guilt. However, I doubt many dealers feel guilty when they make their countless daily transactions. Most dealers know better than to take their own poisonous merchandise, after all they see the pathetic begging and and death in the eyes of their customers everyday round the clock. They see a normal person turn into something completely different within a few months and often a few weeks, all because of what he exchanges for money. I have no pity for the dealers, they make lots of cash tax free at the price of lives of not only the addicts but their loved ones. There is so much distruction because of what they sell and they feel nothing. The addicts shouldnt be in prison, the dealers and above in the drug food chain belong in a concrete hotel, most of them in my opinion have murdered someone without even knowing it and they don't care, not even a tiny bit, they care about money. Most of the drug related imprisoned people in North America are addicts; most of the drug war money is going to keeping them fairly alive while swept under societies carpet. It is all backwards and makes no sense to me, it will all just get worse instead of better while billions get spent on prison food and metal enforced concrete.

The so called drug war has not solved the sale of drugs, nor the use of drugs! Dealers are still on the street, some are in prison, some are not- those using drugs are still using drug, despite the enourmous amounts of money poured into the drug war month after month, the manpower to convict drug users, the court time, the comm. resources to fight back against drug lords, drug houses, the clean up crews and other costs involved are far too great to even imagine for most. The victims are the children, the families, the drug users themselves. Treatment for addiction, addiction is not classified as a true disorder- a real medical problem just like alcholism- is there any reason to believe that a jail cell would be appropriate for treating any other medical condition or psychiatric disorder, nope, but the public in most communities certainly thinks putting drug addicts in prison will teach them a lesson, make them change, keep them out of trouble, put an end to their inability to handle life without using drugs- it's a ll a public view that has been formed by our own govt. the govt presents the public with a skewed view, one they want to create, so that billions of dollars are put up for fixing their alleged problems, drug wars- it's a war on our own people. Drug addiction is a disease, that needs treatment. Even if every single prisoner that had a drug problem received proper treatment, in prison and after they got out, long term even, it would not cost as much as it does just trying to put all the dealers out of business- taking of course along the way, each user, each child, each parent, each relative etc of that one person, dealer or user, both are likely to be addicted to the drug they are buying or selling. both need treatment. No prison. bars and isolation are not going to provde the help drug users need to stop using for good and it isn't going to help their children and famlies be self supportive, self sufficient or learn to live life wtihtout the same pitfalls their loved ones have fell into over the course of their life. The drug war is a farce, one that is killing our american families and destroying our children, across the US day by day. The war is creating victims from it's own scheme.

Without a doubt, victims everywhere.
I do know that a day doesn't go by that my family isn't effected by poor decisions on drug policies, sentencing guidelines for drugs, and pretty much everything else related. I know I'm so very far from being alone in that situation. Its a sad backwards world the way I see it.

Hi everyone, I am new to this so excuse me if I am doing it wrong. I also am a victum of the drug war. I was myself an addict. Or as you could say still an addict. This is an everyday struggle. Although I got off light. My husband took the fall for both of us. He is in an Oklahoma prison and I got released into the wild. I know sometimes it would be a lot easier to be in prison myself than to keep facing everyday without him. He got 2-20 yr sentences running concurrent . I think the drug penalty is way too strong. I am not denying the fact that my husband and I needed help. I will be the first to admit that. I jsut know that so many people in prison for armed roberry or even murder got way less time than my husband got. If there is anyone out there who knows anything about the Oklahoma State penal system and can help me through any of this please let me know
hi I also have a brother in a michigan prison because of drugs ,now dont get me wrong i know drugs are wrong but i believe giving these drug sellers more time than they give murders or rapists is ridiculous i also have my husband in a Texas prison and he also got lots of time for a non-agravated crime.my brother was just sentenced 9-40 on a drug charge .i really believe our system should consider our laws and change them and give our drug users help and send our murders and rapist to prison

Have you been to the Oklahoma forum, there are probably plenty of people there who could offer advice. As far as the sentences, I agree with you completely. My husbands father shot and killed his brother in front of my husband when he was younger, he served just under 7 years for that and it wasnt his first offence.
You have come to the right place though, there is lots of support and advice, and most of all friendship at PTO. Don't forget to check out the Oklahoma forum if you haven't already, and welcome to PTO.

Hi,

As a mother of a drug addict, who is doing 17 1/2 in Coleman, I can honestly say I do not believe that any addict is happy with their lifestyle. Instead of prison, put them in treatment for 5 year or more to treat them for the problems. They say that it takes 2 years for them to really get clean. Treatment for 30 days, 6 months, or a year is not going to do it for a lot of them. They got my son for repeat offender even though he has never been to prison. I have lost my son and my 2 grandchildren have lost their father. My son is bi-polar and has been since he was a child. He is off meds and is getting put in special housing a lot. Is there anyway that I can find out what is going on. I am not sure how to go about it, or if anyone will even tell me anything. I would appricate any help that anyone can give me. Thank you.

You can contact the prison and ask to speak to your loved ones CO - (counselor) - ask them your questions and if they can't or won't answer them for you, ask them who you can talk to that will have the answers. There is also a family liason office that can help you with problems, however they do ask that you try the normal channels first to get the info you are wanting.

Good luck!

Hi,

As a mother of a drug addict, who is doing 17 1/2 in Coleman, I can honestly say I do not believe that any addict is happy with their lifestyle. Instead of prison, put them in treatment for 5 year or more to treat them for the problems. They say that it takes 2 years for them to really get clean. Treatment for 30 days, 6 months, or a year is not going to do it for a lot of them. They got my son for repeat offender even though he has never been to prison. I have lost my son and my 2 grandchildren have lost their father. My son is bi-polar and has been since he was a child. He is off meds and is getting put in special housing a lot. Is there anyway that I can find out what is going on. I am not sure how to go about it, or if anyone will even tell me anything. I would appricate any help that anyone can give me. Thank you.

You can contact the prison and ask to speak to your loved ones CO - (counselor) - ask them your questions and if they can't or won't answer them for you, ask them who you can talk to that will have the answers. There is also a family liason office that can help you with problems, however they do ask that you try the normal channels first to get the info you are wanting.

Good luck!

When my brother was first incarcerated, he became very ill. He had been involved in a motorcycle accident less than a year before he was incarcerated and had fractures to his spine, ribs, and a punctured lung. However, I slowly watched as he became weaker and weaker but he refused my pleas to go to medic. I thought he was serious depressed---diagnosing at a distance! Not knowing what to do, I contacted his public defender. She was able to get a conference call with the counselor and I expressed my concerns. What ultimately happened was one of the guards approached my brother on the compound and said, "Combs, you are going to medic!" They ended up taking him out to a hospital because he had pneumonia! So, push and do everything that anyone can suggest and anything that you can think to do to get help for your loved one. Keeping in mind; however, that they are "competent" people who can make decisions for themselves and may reject your attempts at help.

I Am Sorry But This Is A Very Touchy Subject For Me . Drugs Ruined My Life My Ex Was Mixed Up In Them Big Time Also He Has A Major Dependancy On Them Still , My Daughter And Grandson Was Killed Because Of Drugs .

I Have Said It A Thousand Times They Are Going About It Wrong .but They Realy Dont Want To Stop It Why ? Because The Drugs Generate To Much Money For The Doc With Arrest And Schools They Have To Attend When Caught .

If They Wanted To Stop It . Quit Manufacturing The Ingredinanc They Use To Make The Drugs I Know There Is More Drugs Out There Than The Ones Made With Ephedrine But They Are A Big Part And They Are The Easiest To Get They Are Cheap And Are Made In Every Bathroom Shed And Barn Around It Takes Between 2 And 24 Hours To Produce 500 Grams Of 98.9% Pure Product
People Get Crystal Meth Confused With Crank And Crack They Are As Different As Crystal And Cok . Like I Said They Dont Want To Stop These Drugs ,they Would Lose To Much Money . And What About The Under The Table Money That Is Exchanged . See . We Are Locking Up The Wrong People .

I Am Sorry But This Is A Very Touchy Subject For Me . Drugs Ruined My Life My Ex Was Mixed Up In Them Big Time Also He Has A Major Dependancy On Them Still , My Daughter And Grandson Was Killed Because Of Drugs .

I Have Said It A Thousand Times They Are Going About It Wrong .but They Realy Dont Want To Stop It Why ? Because The Drugs Generate To Much Money For The Doc With Arrest And Schools They Have To Attend When Caught .

If They Wanted To Stop It . Quit Manufacturing The Ingredinanc They Use To Make The Drugs I Know There Is More Drugs Out There Than The Ones Made With Ephedrine But They Are A Big Part And They Are The Easiest To Get They Are Cheap And Are Made In Every Bathroom Shed And Barn Around It Takes Between 2 And 24 Hours To Produce 500 Grams Of 98.9% Pure Product
People Get Crystal Meth Confused With Crank And Crack They Are As Different As Crystal And Cok . Like I Said They Dont Want To Stop These Drugs ,they Would Lose To Much Money . And What About The Under The Table Money That Is Exchanged . See . We Are Locking Up The Wrong People .


I am so sorry about the loss of your loved ones.

I agree with you 100%. As a school psychologist, and long before my brother was arrested and incarcerated, I use to warn people to be care for what you wish for because it may come true----then I would tell them that if there was some magic to be applied to stop the abuse of illegal drugs instantly, our economy would sink into a deep depression. Stop and think of who you know who would loose their jobs if this war on drug was suddenly won. Think of all the prisons that would be suddenly empty. Think of all the drug treatment centers which would have no clients, think of all the MOs the United States Post Office would no longer sell, think of all the distributors who supply these prisons, and the list goes on and on. So, I agree with you.

We must continue to band together and demand that our government do things differently. Perhaps some of us who are physically able to run for office need to become involved politically.

this issue has affected me almost all my life my father was a heroin user although before he passed away he changed his life dramatically and became a preacher but all the drugs from the past affected his health way too bad and now my fiance signed for 10 years this week fed time all because of drugs it's very sad this issue takes so many lives and I do agree they need more help than more time in prison :( I think there would be so much more change if that were to happen

I TOO HAVE BEEN CLEAN FOR OVER TWO YEARS I WAS ON IT FOR ALMOST 2 MY EX MANUFACTURES BIG TIME . SO BIG THEY DONT BOTHER HIM
IT EFFECTED MY LIFE IN VERY BAD WAYS . MY OLDEST DAUGHTER IS STRUNG OUT MOST OF THE TIME . IT WAS THE CAUSE MY YOUNGEST DAUGHTER WAS KILLED . MY SON GOT CLEAN. THANK GOD FOR THAT . BUT I CANT EVEN SEE HIM FOR FEAR OF HIS SAFTY AND MY OWN . YOUR HUBBY MIGHT NOT BEEN ONE OF THE BAD GUYS OUT THERE BUT TO SOME IT IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN LIFE IT'S SELF HOW DO WE DEAL WITH THEM

My husband's in on a 1st degree drug charge, Manufacturing Meth...although the only thing they had to charge him with was the word of another meth cook who got his charges dropped...gotta love those snitches. He's got a treatment mandate on his sentence that cannot be met in the facility he's in (no treatment there at all)...but will they move him? heck no. *sigh*
He's been convicted before on 4th and 5th degree charges, he's an addict, as am I. I've been clean almost 2 1/2 years, from Crystal Meth. It's not easy.

I'm not stupid, I'm not irresponsible (anymore), I'm a college student maintaining a 3.8 gpa and raising 3 kids by myself. To give you an idea of how an addict can relapse, let me give you an example.

There aren't enough hours in a day, for someone like me. Between maintaining a school schedule, work schedule, studying, keeping up the house, doctor appointments, dental appointments, school functions and conferences for the kids, a teenager who by herself is enough to drive anyone insane with her attitude and now truancy, and trying to juggle all this without a driver's license or extra money for cabs, relying on bus schedules and bus routes to get around....it's difficult to say the least. I am a walking zombie by friday, but there's still laundry to do, test to study for, homework to oversee, meals to cook, and a job to get to. Sleep is beginning to look like a waste of valuable time to me, even though I get 6 hours a night MAX, including weekends. I think you know where I'm going with this. It would be SOOOO easy....SO damn easy, to give in to the craving....because I used to accomplish in a weekend what I can't do in 2 weeks' time or more. I had energy to spare....I got everything done that needed to be done and more, because I didn't sleep for a week!!! or MORE, depending on how long the drug held out.

But that memory, if I let it, is very selective. I can forget about the horrible inevitable crashes, the suffocating depression when the dope and money ran out. I could even forget that's why my family has been torn apart for the past 2 years. But I REFUSE to forget it. I struggle with this battle daily, hourly, by the damn MINUTE, but I see where my husband is, and how easily it could have been me, or both of us doing that time, and I thank God I was given the chance to clean up and stay free while doing so.

Eddy needs treatment, badly. I did it without treatment, at least thus far, I quit on my own, voluntarily. Is it better to do it that way rather than treatment? I don't know. I DO however know that locking me up wouldn't have done any more good than I did for myself. And locking Eddy up for 8 to 13, has not done us any good. Having said that, I'm on the other hand glad something was done. He was so far gone I knew he had 2 choices facing him; death, or prison. Thank God it was the latter, NOW, if they'd only stop warehousing him and others like him and actually work on this issue, the world would be a much better place.

Did You All Know That The Main Engredent For Manufacturing Of Meth Comes From China .

If we (citizens of the US) as a group, dont get together and get a hold on this manufacturing and using of Crystal Meth, it is going to be the ruination of us all.

I have two sons who have been on this mess. The oldest finally figured out what it was doing to him but NOT before it almost killed him. Causing weakening in the aorta just outside his heart.

The other son, is still using and it seems it has such a hold over him that his only child is not even important anymore. She is just 3 months old and he was believed to be sterile sinc he was 27 before she became pregnant. I thought that this baby would make a big change in his life. Boy was I wrong.

Pray for me and my children. Gosh knows we all need it.

Meth is tearing alot of families apart. Our son was just sentenced to 12 1/2 yrs yesterday for manufacturing (unfortunately there were guns in his house from drugdealing). The pain is incredible. You hope & pray they'll get help in prison but you know it won't happen. His addiction cost him the most important thing in his life...seeing his kids grow up. Unless you've been through it, you can't understand. Thank God the Iowa legislature is finally doing something to make it more difficult to make the stuff!

I can't make any sense of the war at all! My sister is a heroin addict. She is 31 years old and didn't start until about 3 years ago. At first I didn't believe it and acted like it was nothing. Then, I started enabling her. I moved in with her and she would say she needed money for this or for that. I would give it to her because I felt I had to because I lived in her house. Then I started realizing, with all the money I am giving her I could have my own house and more. So, I moved into my own house. She started getting worse and her husband denied it, but he noticed a change in her. She spent all the money he gave her for bills and they got evicted. He is from Ireland, so he packed up her and her kids and moved to Ireland. They lived there for one year. During that year, we KNOW she did NO drugs. She was around someone 24/7 and they lived in the country. There was NOTHING around. The doctor there put her on an anti-depressent. After a year, they moved back to Philadelphia. So, I brought her to an Easter party (with kids) one night after she came back and found out she was asking my friends if they knew where to get some heroin. I was so embarrassed. I asked her why? After all this time, why do you want to do that again? She said she was only going to do it once. Well once turned into a bunch of times. Then it turned into going to rehab 5 times. They were rehabs where you check yourself in and you are not supposed to leave at all. She left all of them. Then she started going to meetings. That is where she met her so-called sponsers. Her sponsers were the ones finding her drugs. Then she started a methodone clinic. She would be all tired and hurt and run there in the morning. She quit her $18/hr job at the hospital because she had to work weekends and they wouldn't give her the methodone for the weekend, she had to go to the center and take it. She worked the hours the center was opened. (she always snorted the heroin) Then she started leaving the methodone clinic with all the people there and getting high. She couldn't get high anymore because the methodone would block her high when she snorted. That is when she started shooting up. She has gone from a size 11/12 to a size 5/6. She is 5'10" and looks so bad! I tried talking to her, asking her what are you doing? Do you need some help? This is NOT you! She is a smart girl, went through college worked as an EMT. She told me she IS NOT getting high. She tells me that she don't want to be around me or my family because she knows we think she is still getting high. She says we do not support her. I want to support her, but it has been 9 months since she started going to the methodone clinic and telling us she is not getting high anymore. HOW AM I TO BELIEVE HER? It has been 9 months and she left one of her kids with me. I support her 11year old son. I buy him shoes, clothes, food etc. I do his homework with him. I take him for haircuts and to the movies. He lives with me. She is living in a room (just a room) with her 7 yr old daughter and a boyfriend. They share bathroom, kitchen with other people they just met. The guy rents out rooms to transients. Her boyfriend doesn't work. She has been telling me she is moving in to a house for the last 9 months. She has told me she is starting school for the last 9 months. I REALLY REALLY REALLY want to support her. I want to be there and not push her aside. But she seems to be all talk! All she has been doing for 9 months is TALK AND NO ACTION!

IF ANYONE CAN GIVE ME SOME INPUT, PLEASE DO!
I don't want to leave my sister and something happen to her or her daughter, but then again how do I support her if she obviously is NOT doing anything with her life or to change?

Hi all- I am the new Moderator for this forum. :)
If you are reading this thread, it is probably more then just plain old curiosity. Meaning, you could have a loved one who is in trouble because of drugs, or you might be that person who is in trouble because of drugs. Either way, drugs hurt everyone involved.
There are many different opinions regarding how drug users, pushers, addicts, etc should be handled. As it has been in the past years, the war on drugs has been our most expensive war. And what has come out of this war? Some say the "bad guys" are where they belong-in prison. Others see prisons maxed to overflowing, tax payers spending much more then they should to keep these people locked up, and scariest of all, they see men and women getting out of prison for drug crimes, just to go right back to using again because of lack of treatment.
So, what do you think about this war?
This is a forum to talk about your feelings on that subject.
My boyfriend is a heroin addict. He has been clean for over a year now, but he will fight this addiction every day of his life for the rest of his life. He is in prison now because of that addiction. Should he be a "prisoner of war" so to speak because of that? Many feel that he should. Many do not.
So, feel free to discuss, share, and give opinions. We are here to make sense of this war, and to understand what it is that not only the addicts, but what their families go through.
It's a hurtful subject, but one that we can learn a great deal from. So, have at it!
There is one thing that those of us who love an addict have in common- fear of the unknown. Let's face the unknown together!
Enjoy!

I know drugs can really make a person self destruct. My husband is in jail because he choosed drugs over life. He had been in prison for 33 months only to come out and use drugs after being clean for so long. I often wonder was it because he became frustrated and couldn't find a job because of lack of skills or because he didnt want to face reality. He turned into someone that I became more and more frightened of. He wasn't that same man I had married 5 years ago. So besides being a parole violator, he committed a crime of robbery. He keeps bugging me to call and see where his green sheet is, for what I ask to come out and cause the same harm you caused before. My mind tells me that but my heart still cares for this man. I hope however long he gets it will not just make him stronger physically but also spiritually and mentally. Drugs climbs our streets everyday but you dont have to be a part of it. I learned its a choice that one makes. Whether they want life or death because that's the end results of drug use. Jails, instutions and death

The problem with some coming out of prison is their actual problem wasn't dealt with ( just their crime against society, not the one they did to themselves [suicide is illegal though] ), they were instead sheltered away under a rug where society can't see them, away from all the normalities we consider everyday life, all the responsibilities and stress that are just normal for most of us. There is a different life in prison (someone else makes most of their decisions for them, everything happens at the same time everyday, and they don't have financial responsibilites that run most of our lives on the outside ).
Often an addict comes out worse off though its not always apparent right away. They have a false sense of security; thinking they have been clean for so long that it won't be that hard. They have dealt with the guilt that comes with being an addict and often hurting those they care about, they often come out with an unrealistic plan. It ends up being much harder then they had expected because everything is still the same on the outside, they are just even less use to dealing with it and many of their previous bridges have burnt to the ground, especially for addicts. Often its disappointment everywhere they turn or where they least expect to be let down. Often they hold that inside because that is what you do in prison, hiding your feelings. The most unfortunate part is that drugs are everywhere on the outside, and it will try to get a hold on them again, especially when they are dealing with stresses inside of their minds that they aren't use too dealing with. Self-medication to some, and others its because its the only thing they understand on the outside and eventually they run to it; something that they feel they can control somewhat.
But the good thing is there are some that get it right when they get out, and often its taken a few goes to get it right. It can happen and does happen. Addiction is no easy battle and it can take a while for some to understand that its a lot harder than prison, its a battle for life, that does get easier in time, but it will always be there.
My husband is pretty much in the same shoes as yours Marquita, and that is what I have come to believe about addicts in and out of prison. Also, depending on the drug, it can take up to three or more years for the drug to be completely out of their system. 33 months may not have been long enough. My husband is now at the beginning of a very long sentence, unfortunately timewise, but I know it will save his life, and bring sanity to mine,,,at least for now. But I know that so long as he is alive, there is hope for his future.

"...because everything is still the same on the outside," quoted from Witchlinblue's post above. This is something we all need to seriously give thought to and discuss in preparation for our loved ones coming out. Is everything still the same on the outside? Now in my brother's case, should he serve his full sentence as it stands today, that is surely not to be the case. However, even after being locked down just 4 years, I ask myself is everything still the same as it was when he was convicted? The answer I come up with is a definite "no." Drugs abuse in his home town is worse now that it was 4 years ago. His children are 4 years older. His wife has remarried. One of his step-daughters now has a child. His siblings are 4 years older, many reaching the retirement age so their ability to help him readjust will be harder. The price of a gallon of gas has jumped exceedingly. Affordable housing is more limited. Government benefits have been cut and are being cut more daily. The unity of the country has been badly damaged and the war in Iraq has drastically altered the perception of America abroad. So when our loved ones return home, they will be dumped back into a society that is even more stressful, with less opportunity for success, while more opportunity to escape reality exits on every corner of the street.

The money wasted on the war on drugs would be better utilized if it were directed toward health care, education, and the creation of job opportunities.

You are right, and in many cases things are worse than when they went in. But they are completely sheltered from all those changes. They haven't had to adapt to much of them if any. You are right too, serious thought has to be given before they are released. Its so easy to get caught up in the excitement of having them home (I made that mistake in the past). But the reality check I think probably has to be discussed with them before they get out, months or even years before hand without sugar coating.

Leon's Sister - you really gave me a reality check on how the world has been changing. I guess we see it happen everyday and live it, but when you really start listing changes, its strange how we seem to just ride with it here on the outside. I guess the world really stops for our prisoners in a way. Its sad, really sad.

'Less opportunity for success....more opportunity to escape reality' as you put it, pretty much sums up the state of our North American world these days. I guess that is where the loved ones come in, plenty of support and helping them prepare before they get out, corrections sure doesn't help there.

Yes, they are sheltered. For example, another change which will probably surprise them is our current money. It is my understanding they are not even allowed to touch money while on the inside. I know when I visit my brother, it is I who goes to the vending machines because he isn't allowed to touch money. Think of all the new quarters that have been released and the new nickels---and the new $20 bill! So, I do think they are sheltered inside which does nothing to help them prepare for return to society.

One large service this board provides is an opportunity for us all to share and learn from one another. Sometimes, just reminding ourselves to think rather than drift is one of the best things we can learn from each other.

Thanks Witchlinblue you are absolutely right. The quote made by Earl Nightingale is right on target.

this war on drugs has gotten so out of hand, it's scary! something has to be done to inform the public! my husband too, is incarcerated for being a drug addict. he is free of it at this time, but he is in his fifties and this is possibly a life sentence for a first time offence. the prison he is at is more than 100% over capacity. budgets are being cut, food is going from bad to worse. for every prisoner, i figure each one has a mother, father, spouse, children, as well as siblings who's lives have been affected. if you add them together, this barbaric way of handling the drug problem is affecting people into the millions. i can not believe what the country i have loved all my life is doing! there is something to be far more concerned about in this country than the drugs. when the government can take so many lives and destroy them, how can they feel drug use is worse than they are? don't get me wrong, i know there is a problem! drugs were destroying my marriage. i hate drugs and what they have done to those i love. but the war on drugs hasn't saved anyone from pain, it's just changed the source from where the pain comes.

dlamb- i hate drugs and what they have done to those i love. but the war on drugs hasn't saved anyone from pain, it's just changed the source from where the pain comes.

Wax- Well said, and accurate!
Prohibition has never/will never work in society. Whether one is speaking of heroin, crank, mary jane, or beer.

The problem is that a certain percentage of society will use whatever is available to escape reality, and a certain percentage of those people will become addicted to those substances.

I don't like pot (the only thing it ever did to me was make me tired) and I don't like the idea of my neighbor's kid sitting in his basement all day smoking his life away. But if he choses to do just that he is only hurting himself (and those he loves) not society as a whole.

Now... if we decide to create a "war on drugs" atmosphere by not only denouncing the behaviour but also punishing it, we are only insuring damage to society that matches the escalation of punishment!
When was the last time you heard of someone shot in the head for a cigarette?
How about a driveby shooting sparked over a twelve-pack of beer?
Both things are frowned upon by many in society but their use is not punished in a severe enough way to insure that violence is an option to obtain them.

But the fact is this (and we have already seen proof of it) ban alcohol and threaten to lock people away for years if they sell it and the streets will run red with the blood of their fallen rivals (and anyone else who gets in the way).
Allow its use and place whatever restriction you wish on it and the problem of violence subsides.

Drug use is not really the problem in our society... drug enforcement is!

It has made me want to help revise the current laws regarding rehabilitation, sentencing guidelines and the 85% time for federal inmates! It makes me want to speak up and out about how the Federal government is using slave labor for UNICOR.

Well i'm not sure if this fits in with the subject but, after my brother robbed someone for like $200, the guilt just ate away at him. It was during the 3-4 week period between his crime and his arrest that he got on the drugs. I mean he spent the money on good stuff...no drugs...but after the money was gone and his name and crime was put in the paper it hit him in the face. he was like paranoid, he wouldn't leave the house for more then 5 min and he would just like veg out on weed and alcohol. he would still do the normal stuff like cook and clean and chill with his friends. you know pretned that everything was cool...but at night it was a completely different story. my room is next to his and i would hear him up all night watching tv and stuff. it bothered me because i didn't know that he was trying to "self medicate" so that the world would be better for him. okay but now here comes the part that i don't like the most. i can't blame myself...but i know who to blame...my father. see my dad wasn't the perfect dad...he was a crackhead for the majority of mine and my brothers life. so i figure it this way that my brother turned to drugs because he needed attention, but not anyones attention, just my dads. i'm happy for the fact that he didn't tell me about it bgecause he doesn't want me to worry about him. but i knew something was up. but thats besides the point, at the time when my brother did his crime my dad was locked up for 3 months for drugs. and i'm beginning to feel that my brother did the drugs and stuff to be closer to my dad like i said...that even means going to prison. so i'm thinking my brother went to jail to be with my dad...but lil did he know that my dad would be out in a month while my brother sits for 5-20. so in my brothers efforts to be close to my dad he only got farther away from him. i agree with what everyone is saying...why do they treat drugs like murder and murder like robbery? its not fair for people with their first offense to be treated like it's their thrid strike while people who it actually is their third charge go untouched.

My husband is incarcerated because of his addiction to painkillers. Theyshould not be perscribed to just anyone. It is a multi-million dollar business/game and has utterly devasted our family, short term or not, and has interrupted our lives in more ways than I ever imagined. I agree with msmack, this system is retarded!!!! It is so stupid to incarcerate instead of rehabilitating addicts!!:argh

I agree1My husband is doing 10 years on drug charges. He had Kicked the drug habit and was doing well until he got hurt. he got bucked off of a horse and later developed what they call R.S.D. The doctors put him on , 270mg of MS Contin! which i fought them to give him something other than a narcotic, but they said it was the only drug that could help him and was the safest. He was on it for 2 years,(made him a nut!) until we lost our insurance and prescription card. He then started self medicating, and was in full blown addiction once again.

This is a touchy subject because my boyfriend has also been in and out of prison since the age of 14 due to his cocaine addiction. My opinion on drugs is that nothing good can come out of it for individuals will do anything to get there next fix including lying and stealing so there will always be a victim involved and someone will always get hurt at the end. The state has become much more harsh with the laws on drugs with the habitual laws that are now in effect but they see it as a means of keeping it off the streets mainly because there is so much crime involved to get them. I believe in reform and rehabilitation which is why i think the habitual laws are way too strict. It is the law saying lets lock this person up for a long time as opposed to lets rehabilitate this person and allow them to contribute something positive to society. I'm only for rehibilitation for someone that truly wants to change not for someone who is unwilling to change.

What drugs have done to my family is destroy it. My oldest son has been a paranoid schizophrenic for the past 8+ years. The Drs.' think it may have been induced from using meth. He will never be the same. He has to take anti-psychotics for the rest of his life.

My youngest son was just sentenced on May 17th to 25 years for intent to distribute meth (94 grams). He has an 8-year-old little boy (my only grandson) that he has only seen once in the past 6 months. When they did see each other at one court appearance, they both completely broke down. My grandson was nearly hysterical because the deputies wouldn't even let my son hold or touch his little boy. My grandson had to see his dad brought into the courtroom in a jumpsuit, handcuffs and shackles. It is something I regret doing. I doubt my grandson will get to see his dad until he is released, because I doubt his mother will let me take him.

Me... well, I now live day-to-day. My home was raided last summer (my son lived in the basement in the family room - which was the only room they touched and destroyed). I was made to lay on the floor, was handcuffed and questioned. There were about 20 agents swarming all over my house. I now jump at every little sound. I can't sleep and have to take antidepressants. Most of the time, I'm petrified to even answer the door.

Sorry for the rambling..

Hello all, I too have a husband in prison because of drugs. He started using with his mother when he was 8, he ran with the wrong crowd and never even finished 6th grade. His mom died at the age of 35 because of an overdose. Mike is a wonderful person but drugs had the best of him. After he was arrested for fleeing dui, intent to sell, and possesion of pot and coke he broke down and ask for help, guess what, everywhere I called had a waiting list of over 30 days. I tried to explain he was asking for help now and would most likely go use again as soon as he started withdraw. Well I finally took him to the local hospital and litteraly droppped him off and refused to take him home. Well 31 hours later they had him headed to rehad 5 hours away. I am very lucky, Mike has stayed clean since and has turned it down in prison. He only has 17 days untill parole and 6 months till he maxs out. I know this is only the begining of a long and hard road to come. We will fight everyday also to keep him clean. I do know one thing and that is that we will be loyal na goers from now on. Thanks everyone for being here and always being so positive and not judging. Alisa

My bf is incarcerated in Louisiana because of an addiction. Every one of his charges are a result of him trying to get high. I lost most of my valuables to his addiction and I ultimately was the last one to have him arrested. He was in drug court for previous charges and started using again, the addiction got out of control and I had no choice. He says that if I wouldn't have called the cops he would have ended up dead or worse, something would have happened to me or the kids. So they sentenced him to 8 years for breaking his probation. Most of his charges were contempt of court, then iwc, then 2 simple burgulary chargers. I think he was over charged because he was in drug court. None of his crimes were violent. He's not a criminal he's a drug addict. It is definately true that the biggest fear i have is the fear of the unknown. I never know what the next day is going to hold... I question every day if when he comes home will he stay clean. He has been clean for 4 months and looks healthier than I have ever seen him. I pray every night that he stays this way.

DoingTimeinLove: it is a sad fact in North America that drug addicts arent getting the help they need and even sadder that once they are in the criminal justice system and are recognized as an addict, little is done as far as the addiction. Unfortunately many go to prison as an addict and re-enter prison again as an addict and a criminal. Its all related back to their being no help for a disease at the beginning. Once they start going in for burgulary and robberies etc to pay for the drugs, they are criminals and they unfortunately make up a large portion of the prison populations even though they are addicts. Its really too bad that things arent done when addicts first come into the system.
Its also too bad that so many tax payers do not realize that the prisons arent being filled with criminals and overflowing, they are filling with addicts who became criminals because there wasnt the help they needed at the beginning which is billions of dollars more cost effective.
Anyways I feel for you for sure and understand how you must feel.

"The War on Drugs". A very glamourous name that a politician came up with to make it seem as though he was standing on a platform for change. " I am going to wage a war against this evil that is destroying our country" .

Hmmm. There is a movie called "Wag the Dog". I encourage all of you to watch this film. It's in most movie rental stores. Its about a president whose ratings are falling and he wants to win (of course) in the upcoming election. So what does he do? He pulls no stops in staging a bogus war against a fictitious country. He solicits the help of a production studio to create footage of this "war". They even go so far as to create a war Hero named Two Shoes. It's an amazing film.
Bottom line, in politics, you need to know who is in control and are you (the tail) able to Wag the Dog instead of him wagging you.

The War on Drugs is not working. Neither did Prohibition. There will always be hustlers looking to make more money and get ahead. (The Gold Rush, Diamond Rush, Moonshine... Drugs)
There will always be those who need an escape from reality because life is too hard for them. An addicitve personality is just that - an addictive personality. Be it Alcohol, Nyquil, Wine, Chocolate, Coca, Ibuprofen, Whiskey, Poppy Seeds on a bagel....

From reading many posts here and on other websites I have begun to form an opinion. And it is this - Decriminilize drugs. Remove the factor of illegality. Monitor the sales, tax the sales. Obviously what's going on is not working. The drugs are still here. They haven't disappeared in the twenty-thirty years this war has been going on. Sometimes you must let Ego fall back and say This is not working, let's try somehting new.

I have never used drugs to get high, but that's because I simply don't want to. I don't think it is morally wrong for someone to use a drug. Most of these substances are natural herbs, seeds, plants put here for us to use in the first place, but that's a whole 'nother topic for debate. The problem is when it becomes abuse and their - already present - addictive personality sets in and takes over. For that they need treatment anyway. Or maybe just someone to understand and listen to what they are going through (Because you know we Americans don't have time to "just listen" to a loved one anymore) Sometimes a sturdy shoulder and good cry will carry you through it.
America has some serious issues....The working poor (of which I am a member), No national health care, High rent in most cities, Little money for our schools (most teachers buy their own supplies), a Homeless population that is horrific!, More prisons being built than schools, Car insurance Rates (hello new jersey & new york)
A long history of corruption in political circles that does exist, Still grouping people based on the color their skin....etc.

Let's wage a war on homelessness and give every homeless person a safe place to live. Let's wage a war on hunger and give everyone food when they are hungry ( let's have community gardens everywhere. Let's wage a war on true evil and start loving each other again.

My boyfriend was arrested, not yet been sentenced, for posession with intent to distribute. He's not a "drug dealer." He never has any money. (wrong place /wrong time) This man is not an evil criminal. He has hurt no one. He has killed no one. Yet what he faces is more than that of a child molester who stalks his prey knowingly, or someone who commits cold-blooded murder.

If there is to be justice ( until this crazy "war is over") then look at each case on an individual basis. If help is needed, sentence help. If there was a crime, let the punishment fit. Judged should remember that is a life, a person in front of their face, not a docket number. And behind every face there are least ten more in the life of that person.

Keep the scales balanced and above all - please go back to the drawing board.

Peace and blessings,
Sparrow

GREAT post Sparrow!

Sparrowdove, AWESOME post.

Now for my 2 cents! :twocents: I don't have an opinion on most drugs or drug users because I have no experience. But I do have a very strong opinion on the legalization of marijuana. My sweetie is one of those with an addictive personality. He didn't want to smoke pot because it was illegal, so he drank alcohol instead. I think alcohol is far more dangerous in terms of bodily damage to the user and destruction of people and property. Had marijuana been legal, he would have been doing that and would not be in jail today. I'm sure there are many of you with the same story. It's patently ridiculous not to legalize and regulate the sale of marijuana for recreational use. Not to mention the tax benefits to regulating body, be it the federal government or state governments. I have found, in the main, that pot smokers tend to be laid back, whereas drunks like to fight. Tell me which is more dangerous!? An addict is going to use something to appease the craving. Shouldn't we take another look at what's out there, what's available and what's hurtful? Times, they are a-changin'. Shouldn't we change with them?

I think that the war on drugs definitely added and abetted politicians when they needed something to invest time and the governments money in to create a smoke screen and get some kickbacks out there to themselves and thier cronies. there is no evidence that criminalizing drug dependancies has done anything except create state jobs (whom use drugs as well) and fill the prisons to capacity. I think that they weren't happy that they had money tied up in stocks that serviced or created prisons and jails, and there weren't enough 'threats' to society in jail or prison.

and the war on drugs wasn't good enough so they continued to tweek the system with mandatory minimums and truth in sentencing. then they add bills and passages and in the end, we have our very own little war at home. I think that the cops and guards are desensitized and condiditoned to inmates and those caught up in the drug war.

it affects everyone of us whether or not we see it. it can affect your neighbor, coworker- family- your child- anyone, and that is about the only trickle down effect that I can see. we now have a goverment that proclaims it's family oriented but does nothing in terms of supporting nor maintaining any family structure when it throws everyone in jail or prison all the time.

Well although my hunny isnt in jail for drugs, he is in jail for something he did to get the drugs. My man stole a check from a loved one and forged it. I wasnt with him then but i didnt find out till later on the whole truth of his past. When i met him, he started using again for the first time in 2 years. His problem was crack/cocaine. Although i didnt think it was anything big b/c i wasnt aware of his past, it ended up effecting me alot in the long run. Not only did he do time and is on parole for stealing that check, but it doesnt seem he has learned much from it. He stole from me 1300.00 for the stupid drug. I didnt find out till after he went back to jail on a parole violation that he has done it to alot of his loved ones. Maybe knowing they wouldnt turn him in?. Not sure what his state of mind was thinking at the time. I dont think anything or anyone can help an addict get straight. My guy has said to me before that rehab doesnt help one bit. Putting a bunch of druggies together in one building just leaves for discussion on how to get it again when u get out and new hook ups. After he stole the money from me and i was still there for him, he stopped with the drugs. But knowing he has had many problems with it in the past worries me that he'll go back to it in the future. It seems that all he needed was love and support and he never really had that. All he ever had was his grandma and a girlfriend who left him whenever things got bad and came back when he got out of jail. The only thing that can turn an addict straight is that person. With enough ambition and determination, they can do it. They have got to want it enough to resist all temptations. The only we and the system can do is give them support ALWAYS, and try to keep the loved one out of any situation where he might be tempted. Thats really all i can say about it. I do know that i used cocaine for a couple of months with my boyfriend until he did that to me. After i saw that a simple drug would make someone that supposedly loves you, turn on you.. i hated it! And it made me go sober and spread my story to everyone else who has the problem. Don't know how well it will do any of you guys, but anything is worth a try.

Drugs were legal until about 40 years ago when someone snuck in another bill. I have read in several places that this person got rich with a pharmacualtical company. The war on drugs is a failure....it always has been and was started by Nixon. The people in this country need to wake up out of the deep sleep of it's ok.....and realize that we are living in a police state now. Voices to to start demanding changes to the laws and demand better treatment for the disease of drug addiction. It is a disease and we have to educate all the cringing do-gooder so called christians out there that prison is not the answer. Drugs have not ripped my heart out, but the ignorate who are making the laws have. Drugs have always been around, and the addiction disease has always been around, so why not offer answers instead of punishment. An addict and their families go through enough suffering, without the addicts being made into felons so jobs and housing become another nightmare. Here I am on my soap box again.

We have a twisted little story! My husband and I both have had a long hard struggle with meth in the past. We both suffered the horrifying effects of the drug on previous relationships, from abusive situations to homelessness, we were both lucky to have survived. We also managed to slip through the cracks of the legal system and never had to face legal action during that time. About two years ago, when I got pregnant with my little girl, we put it down. We walked away from the junkie life and went on to build an stable home for our children. It is a struggle every day, but we get through. Here's were the twisted part comes in. My husband was arrested last june for possession of 8.2 grams of pot, about $10 worth. He had a weak moment and after 18 months of being totally clean, he wanted to smoke a joint! He is currently serving 2 years for possession of marijuana. The big conflict I have with the "war on drugs" is the corruption of the system. We are from a small town in the south. When we were heavily involved in the use and selling to use process, there were always local officials eager to help us work around the system to 'pad their pockets'. When we got out of that lifestyle they hunted reasons to drag us back in. Maybe it's just the 'dirty south' but the 'war' has proven to be a tool of corruption in my life. They are overlooking the 'big guys' to serve their purpose, and locking up the 'little guys' for an excessive amount of time. Even in the legitimate realm of narcotics enforcement, a 'big guy' can walk after being picked up with a large quantity if they are willing to turn in someone else. What good does that do? It puts the dirtiest ones back into the free world. I agree, as someone who has been at the bottom and lost so much, that something should be done with the drug problems that affect everyone's life in one way or another. I do not believe that the current system is working. I feel that in some circumstances it only perpetuates the problem. Not to mention the fact that now that my husband is locked up he is faced with haveing to remain clean in a hopeless, drug ridden environment. Kinda ironic huh, they take him out of a clean home and stick him in a cell surrounded by any kind of drug a junkie could ask for! I am proud of him, he is keeping clean. I pray for him every night that he can stay strong and get through the hard times without turning back.

All I know is that when I found out that my boyfriend was using crack cocaine, etc., I hit the roof. Everyone became the enemy--the dope dealers that sold to him, his drug addicted mom, even my dad--who often asked my boyfriend to roll joints, etc. for him--became a problem to me. Thus, I lashed out in turn. I called the police immediately and told them about all the places I knew that my boyfriend had copped at--then I confronted my boyfriend's mom and my dad...last but not least, I made my boyfriend come clean and tell me the truth.

I am still angry, though.

I am a person who has had to feal with other peoples drugs addictions my whole life. my mom, my father, my brother my extended family and my boyfriend. with my experience on the subject and the things going on in my life and of course my own addiction with food i feel as though i have a first hand experience and an opinion.alot of people feel as though the drugs is a disease that should be treated. i agree and disagree.i think people who allow themselves to do those things are weak willed and should really consider what the true problem is which is usually a lack of self discipline and self esteem. i think we need to still have this war on drugs. we need laws that dont allow drug abuse. the thing is if we allow them to do drugs legally its almost as if we are condoning people and allowing them to do drugs. we are telling them its ok to become something else and act different. people need to be punished for what they do and lets face it when people do drugs they do things they would never do if they were in a normal mind set. i know my brother shot someone. if you knew my brother you would know that he isnt that kind of person but being that he was extremely high and stupid he did it. you see so many people blame the drugs say oh it is a disease because its easier to say that instead of saying he was weak. the person who decided to do the drug is just as much at fault for it as much as the disease is. so yes we should put these people in prison. they must see consequenses for their actions... if we just tell them its a disease then we are giving them exuses and then they wont learn anything from it.

Curious why your son stopped taking his medication treating his bi-polar. Didn't think this was a mental disorder that just goes away that it has to be treated. My son was diagonsis with depression at the age of 11 so I've done some research. For your son to beat this I would think he'd have to be treated not only for his addiction, but his mental disorder as well. Without having additional information can't see where your son would ever beat the addiction.

Not current on information pertainning to addiction, treatment, and recovery but can speak from personal experience. Can't say that all people that use drugs and/or drink alcohol do it because they are unhappy. I will say in my situation it is to escape the pain of abuse as a child. Using drugs and/or drinking has always been a way to escape being hurt any further. The exceptance I don't recieve from my parents fuels my drive to be successful hoping one day I'll hear they're proud. Your comment that any addict is happy with their lifestyle. In my case that is true. I'm a professional making over 50k without a college degree. The challenges I face each day at work far out weight confronting issue behind my addiction. Once your hooked ..... your hooked. It becomes so easy just to take one more drink or do whatever then to say no it stops here. I tell myself I can stop if I wanted to but as soon as stress sits in the need hits. Not knowing your son and his circumstances I can only imagine the demons he must have faced. The last thing I want to leave you with is it's important you find the root behind his addiction. Treat the cause not the effect. Unless you do the cycle will continue.


Hi,

As a mother of a drug addict, who is doing 17 1/2 in Coleman, I can honestly say I do not believe that any addict is happy with their lifestyle. Instead of prison, put them in treatment for 5 year or more to treat them for the problems. They say that it takes 2 years for them to really get clean. Treatment for 30 days, 6 months, or a year is not going to do it for a lot of them. They got my son for repeat offender even though he has never been to prison. I have lost my son and my 2 grandchildren have lost their father. My son is bi-polar and has been since he was a child. He is off meds and is getting put in special housing a lot. Is there anyway that I can find out what is going on. I am not sure how to go about it, or if anyone will even tell me anything. I would appricate any help that anyone can give me. Thank you.

I also have a loved one locked up because of drugs and I believe it is outrageous how men and women can rape and murder and seem to almost get away with it, only to get a slap on the hand... But it all depends on where your at when you get busted...Or who you killed or who you raped... Most people believe if you do the crime you do the time...I agree but hey a crime is only as bad as the DA makes it...Men and women spending there young and joyious life behind bars is just abnormal... Lets these mild offenders out and give them a second chance at life...Most prisoners commited a crime when they were young or because they were high on drugs... They were not in the right state of mind... If they were the crime would not have been commited and locking up the dealers for enternity isn't going to make the drug war any better or easier on anyone... This is why our loved ones are suffering for 5-life and we can't do anything about it... If we all stick togeather though we can... Why should we work so hard to pay taxes every year and not get our 2 cents in???? Yeah I don't know either but thats how this "wonderfull" U.S. is... But hey lets go over seas and try to make their government like ours cause we have it all togeather!!! OK.............Thanks, Always, Misty.........

My boyfriend was sucked into the drug world too. He stated cooking Meth, running around with the wrong crowd, pretty much doing things he never would have done if he wasn't hooked on drugs. He's doing 18 months in Indiana and Lord only knows how much in Illinois. He's pretty lucky in Indiana but probably not so lucky in Illinois. A few years ago a daycare provider was jailed for killing a baby by putting her leg that was in cast over the crying child. She got off with only house arrest. I don't know all the details about it. I don't know what was involved but she did kill the child and got house arrest. No prison time at all. So, my baby is doing a heck of a lot more time the her. It's just crazy how things work out for some people but not for others. I just hope something works out for us in Illinois.

Here's my 2 cents....Meth is my husbands drug of choice. He is in TX. What makes me angry is that stuff is killing families and everything it touches. They talk about it on the news. They bust more people with more and more quantity. They lock up someone with an addiction in prison and there is no rehab for it. They do their time and out they go to the wolves. I have watched my husband try to get off of it in this world and meth is like the devil himself. People track him down and offer to give it to him. With no rehab, it is hard to resist ALL of the time. What is one supposed to do? go out on an island and live by themselves until they have the control to get a grip on it? Most places in Tx just want to lock them up over and over and over again. Don't they know that doesn't work? Get these people some help, some tools, teach them some skills. My husband says there are men in prison that all they talk about is getting out so they can do some. Young men, old men, age doesn't seem to matter. My husband got recipes for it last time he was in prison! Now he really wants to fight the addiction. He gets out in 11 and 1/2 months. It is hard for a family to live while the main breadwinner is in prison, I don't know how people pay for rehab but we will have to try. I refuse to let meth destroy our family any more and I believe if the world would stop blabbing about meth use and do something about it besides continue to put people in prison for years, we might have a chance at a better world for our grandchildren.
Joy

Also to bring up a different point, there are a lot of illegal immigrants who are in jail for non-violent drug offenses. Not only are tax dollars going to pay for these prisoners, but they are usually placed in the federal system where they are treated much better than they would be in their respectable countries. I think that is another issues that our polititicans have failed to discuss-not only are our prisons filled to the max with non violent drug offenses, but many of them are not even citizens of our country.

I found out last week that there is a 7 month waiting list for the women to go to SAFP, from Harris County jail. This disturbs me, and why does it disturb me, it means that there arent enough rehabs out there that can take care of addiction so therefore our loved ones spend more time in jail or prison where they can get their hands on almost anything, nor does it help with their addiction issues just sitting in a cell all dang day!

I would love to see more positive but I do not think it will happen anytime soon!

The oddest part of all that is the treatment programs cost less then the prisons. Go figure.

oh yeah that 2 I was like wt heck!

Lord God, it has taken my Wife away from me! It has put us into such a financial crisis it scares me to death. My Wife, who needs help so much in working out her addiction, has been tossed to the side, bacause she was an easy bust for the system. Another mark on their score board. Don't waste any time or money on her or others like her. They are addicts, they are the reason people sell drugs, we get rid of the addicts who will the pushers/dealers sell too? Well thats like telling a little kid, stay out of the tall grass and the snake won't bite you. Maybe if the government and the "system" would wake up and realize that maybe, just maybe if they stopped the drug trade from the top, we would not have all these addicts in our jails and prisons. Well, we all know that would be far to difficult and not cost effective. The main problem is as we all know, to many in our government, state, local or federal are making big bucks off the drug trade, they are not going to do anything to stop the influx of their side incomes to do this. Even though they let their storm troopers go around busting in doors, shooting people and destroying the lives of families of the ones that need help, it just makes it all look like they are really trying to stop all this. B.S. who are they kidding, just other politicians who want in on the cash flow! Come on Wake up Amooorica!

God Bless

JR

yup I agree, solve the problem from the bottom with proper treatment and iradicate the problem from the top and the middle man wont have a job anymore. Crimes will decrease dramatically and this could end up being a half decent world instead of the drug ridden neighbourhoods, and the sardine packed prisons full of addicts not getting treatment. Its a dollar store bandaid thats being put on all this and they just dont seem to get it. Addiction will not go away until its treated properly and the source is stopped. I wish they would put even half the money on the Iraqi thing on fighting the drug war at its source. South America, central American, Burma, Afganistan, etc.

It took my life 5 times but I am still here it has ended my boo in jail on felony charges! It has ruined the lives of many friends and family!

my brother is doing time all brought on from meth

My fiance is doing time because of meth 15 years / 7 1/2.Iknow that drugs are not right but unfortunatle some time some of us fall in to the path.I have seen larger amonts thatn my old man had with less time then he got.I just don`t understand that.Plus this is his first offense.

one of my half sisters is addicted to drugs and its hurting my birth mother and the rest of us

My fiance was sentenced to 10yrs for meth trafficking. You would think he was some drug lord....not even the case. He was a punk teenager that got caught up in the money and the wrong crowd. He was set-up and was just the middle man for a "fake" deal organized by the GBI. He had never before dealt anywhere near the same amount that he was busted with. Of course the idea for GBI is to get him to rat out the people they really want. Well, for fear of his life and the lives of his family, he decided no to do that. Now he is serving this long sentence with some of the most violent, mentally ill criminals in GA. He is not a drug addict, he is extremely intelligent, and a hardworker. He does not deserve to be there, and I am so angry at the system and the drugwar. It is so much BS that he is having to serve atleast 3 yrs in prison. He was 19 when he was busted and now he is 21. He could definitely have learned his lesson with some fines, community service, and probation. This will now forever haunt our lives, and I don't feel that it is justice. I hope that the government will wake up one day and see that this drug war is a huge mistake and do something about it. Just a thought...what other crime is there in which the government sets it up just to bust people. Like, do they tell a violent person that some man just raped his wife, and then watch the husband kill the rapist just so they can put him away??? How screwed up is that to operate in such a way that you are creating crime. What the H&#! are they really accomplishing by putting away teenagers for their first crime? Should they not be givin a chance to grow-up and learn from their mistakes? Do they really think that a 19yr old that commits a crime is just damned to commit crimes the rest of his life...I mean he still had time to become who he was going to become as an adult and learn from his mistakes. Did you know that someone older has a better chance to get out on parole? He is considered less of a threat because he is still selling drugs at the age of 35?! Young and first offenders need second chances...We can't afford to lock them up. If there is a 3 strikes law, why can't the first be a warning instead of a ticket to jail? Sorry, just have a lot on my mind, had to vent.

Everyone I write in jail 12 of 13 people are in there because of drugs, nuff said.

My daugher was sentenced to 7 years for meth trafficking. First time offense and tried to get help from a county program and got recommended to treatment but in the end it is all up to the DA. The DA refused to be reasoned with and the big dealer will most likely get little or no jail time. There is no justice in our legal system when they would rather send a 23 year old mother to prison and let the bad guys go free to committ more crimes.

The judges hands have been tied with the mandatory minimum laws and the State gets money for each conviction they get. It's still and always will be about the mighty dollar. How do celebrities keep getting rehab when our kids get 5-25 years? Because they can afford the high priced lawyers who don't take no for an answer. My kid was an abuser of drugs, not a dealer but she got set up by a criminal with priors a mile long so he could escape conviction for his crime. Yeah, that's fair.

AriesMom, it is a growing problem in our country that there is not enough rehab, just longer prison sentences. I sympathize deeply with you over your daughter!! Unfortunately meth is becoming a serious issue and the laws will continue to grow regarding meth because it is such a dangerously addictive and deadly drug. Meth is killing a lot of users and destroying families, as well as the individual lives it ensnares.My hope for your daughter is that she completes any and all drug programs available while she is incarcerated, and that you will help her get clean with a rehab program when she is released. I can understand your pain, and I agree the bigger dealers need to get caught, and slowly, they are; more and more everyday. The issue with meth is that there are so many home labs creating it, far more than the task forces can handle. However I do see a change regarding this, with the regulation of ephedrine and pseudoephedrine. It is becoming harder to obtain.I wish you the best for your daughter. Stay strong and be there for her. We here at PTO will be here for you!

Thank you Eternal Hope. Yours is a Great Name for all that we are going through because of our kids bad choices. I know that meth has been on the rise and am also glad to see them starting to take the drugs off the shelves. I don't see that as helping a whole lot since all other illegal drugs are just as accessible but at least innocent people aren't getting blown up by meth labs gone wrong.

The part that gets to me is how long the sentences are for first time offenders. They are getting more time than sex offenders and murderers. No chance of gain time, no such thing as parole. By creating the mandatory minimum laws, they have taken the personality of each person out of the equation, it's all a numbers game and how you score. Doesn't matter the mitigating circumstances that created the addict in the first place. Prison doesn't rehabilitate and most drug programs don't work unless the person truly wants it. So what is the answer? I don't know, I have only questions at this time and lots of venting to do about the lack of justice in our courts.

Thanks all for allowing me to vent and I do so appreciate the support of this web site. Most people who aren't going through having a child or loved one incarcerated just don't understand what feelings they unleash in us. It's nice to be able to get things out, knowing there will be a kind word to follow-up.

They could save enough money for rehab for the whole prison population if they got rid of judges. Sounds sillly, but.......the prosecutors call the shots anyway. They have taken all of the drug treatments except one (and it is real hard to get into it because of the great need) out of the state of Florida.Of course Jeb says it wouldn't do any thing to effect recidivsm. The only way I have gotten almost through with a minimum mandatory sentence with my son is PRAY. We visit him as often as we can and make sure he has a support system(family) Get involved with support groups, as you are now with this one, get involved with letter writing to the state legislatures and govenor. All we can handle is "ONE DAY AT A TIME"so try to live in the now. There is an ministry called, Mothers Against Meth. Be as good to yourself as you can. God bless.

Oh yeah..let's talk about Jeb and his daughter who was facing 5 years in prison for drug fraud. Do you think she actually did any jail time? Of course not, she got rehab..it's not what you know but who you know. Are you going through any appeal with your son, Scarlett? I'll have to check into the Mothers against Meth but while I don't condone it, I feel the more important issue is to get rid of these horrible Mandatory Laws. There is also a group called FAMM to keep you updated on recent laws and such..families against Mandatory Minimum. There are a few local chapters throughout Florida and nationally.

Good luck you to and your son.

No, AriesMom, We don't have an appeal going on. I'm a member of FAMM in Tampa tho I haven't been to a meeting in a long time. It is a wonderful organization. Lawmakers are so afraid of being labeled soft on crime that they are afraid to support anything that looks like it's not TOUGH ON CRIME. Will talk more later. Good luck and God bess you and your daughter.

My Brother died as a direct result of the war on drugs! My son is in prison and my grand kids are suffering because of the war on drugs! The War on Drugs is a sham:idea: . Lets get real! Treatment programs are a non priority in this country. If they can give you meds when you OD that clear the drugs from your system, do you think they can flush it from your system for good or on a regular basis until your system is free of it:eek: :idea: ? How much recovery can you get in 28 days? Even the 90 day programs don't have much effect when you talk about years of doing something. Being drug free involves changing your whole life, new friend ,new home, new talk, new ideas. The system is not much help with that:confused: ! Next! Why are the drugs entering this country and flowing freely? Why don't we see more major drug bust than young men going to jail for street sales? I believe if they have machines that can find sunken treasures or burried bodies and they have machines that can find bomb making chemicals, they can find the drugs that are entering this country by plane, boat, and other cargo haulers. They do however find it on the mother needs extra funds:eek: and decides that she could do it this time to better her life! Oh but I forgot that if you have money (ie. the new tax breaks, etc) you have the power:eek: ! Most of our young men and women that are locked up for sales could not even afford to pay for a lawyer and are in the streets risking their lives and freedom to feed their kids and keep their utilities on. Yes, they show those who have the big cars and flashing money but how many of them get 20 years for distribution. How many of them are paying the cost? Mine is - he had no car, owns no home, no bank account. He did feed his kids, keep a roof over their heads, keep them clothed! He was in the life trying to meet needs, not to get rich! Yes, we quickly say get a job, but I know that you can't keep a family going on minum wage. My son got a job and after child support he was only able to get to and from the job, I had to feed him and take care of most of his needs. Although he has nice clothing ,he has about 5 outfits (His mother taught him to buy things that mix and match:) ) 2 pair of gym shoes. Their life is nothing like you see on TV!
Also, If this was a real war on drugs the punishment would be equal! On drug dealer gets probation, another gets 6 months, another gets 20 years, all with the same ammount of drugs. Users get punished for having more on them but they don't consider the fact that they have a bigger habit. The goverment officals child get a slap on the wrist while our kids get the tough sentence! THE WAR ON DRUGS, or is this a WAR ON PEOPLE:eek: :idea: :confused: ! I don't see it. Where is the war on poverty! Maybe if they were agressive with that on there would be fewer drug crimes. Insted of trying to run other peoples business the U.S. Goverment should find a way to take care of home!

Drugs are just some peoples way of dealing with problems in their lives. Some people drink alcohol, some smoke cigarettes, and then others abuse drugs. Then when an addict is convicted of a drug crime the family of the addict is the one being punished. I was once an addict. Cocaine had taken control of my life! The man I'm married to helped me to quit. Actuallly he brought me to his house and would not let me leave so I could not talk to any of my "friends" and go get messed up! That was nine years ago and to this day I have not touched it. I loved it so much nothing mattered and I hate myself for ever allowing myself to get that way. People have offered and I can say NO with no problem. I have two children and they are first in my life and that will never change!

Congratulations Abslady, on your continued recovery!!!! I am glad you were able to meet someone to help you and love you enough to stay with you through this !!!

It is still hard exspecially now that I feel like my life is crashing down with my husband in prison and having to raise two children alone. It would be easy for me to turn to drugs so I can forget all my problems....... but I know that the problems will still be there no matter what!!

You are exactly right. You may forget your problems while under the influence but the problems just grow and never can be solved if you do not face them head on while sober. Your kids need you now more than ever. So does your husband. Regardless of what he did to land himself in prison, he was there for you to bring you out of all the "h!?@" of addiction. I know it hurts, and being alone with kids is not easy, but hang in there!!!! You can do this!!! We are always here to support you!!

It may make me forget about my problems for a little but if it wasn't for "METH" I really wouldn't have any problems to forget about!! Thats all I need to know to keep me away from it.

Sure it may take the problems away for a little while but when sober, guess what? They are back and more! I am so glad that you see that METH is not the way to go, and you are a stronger person for that knowledge. Keep taking it one day at a time and don't use anything to dull your reality or blur your vision. HUGS!

I'm not sure exactly how it's worded but its something like this.... God doesn't put anymore on you than you can handle.......................
Well God really thinks I am one strong person!

I can certainly relate to that! Sometimes it does appear He thinks we are VERY strong, but I think He may just be right...we just haven't figured it out yet.. ;)

I'm not sure exactly how it's worded but its something like this.... God doesn't put anymore on you than you can handle.......................
Well God really thinks I am one strong person!

Also, If God brings you to it God will bring you through it. Keep the strength and faith. Have a blessed evening.

MicheleCJr...... I sure hope so because its hard to do alone!

Abslady............hard nothing........impossible LOL

I find it important to reward myself for remaining clear of alcohol, and to a lesser extent, to celebrate the anniversary of the day I stopped smoking. Every year on September I buy myself something that costs the same as a carton of cigarettes. And I'm in the process of buying a motorcycle with the money I didn't spend on booze this year. It makes for a great reinforcement!

Dave - that is a great idea!!! Rewarding one's self in these ways is a positive plan! :)

It's a great reinforcement. Simply doing your daily meditations and telling everyone "I quit smoking/drinking/whatever" can be (and was, for me) a way of setting off that little inner voice that says: "see, there's something missing from your life now". Mind, I do both of the above and don't knock anyone else who does, but when I get on my bike go for a ride, that little voice always reminds me: "now isn't this better than puking the same money into the toilet?"

Believe me, it helps.

MicheleCJr..........AMEN TO THAT.....LOL

drugs and drinking made my life and my kids life a living hell .my hubby is in jail right now for wanting help with his problem so his po vop him for is first dirty p so hes going to court for the second time on tues we hope he gets out .

the drug war has cost me alot yes i know that drugs are bad and maybe we were the lowest of the low we didnt do any drugs my husband just dealt, and for his first offense he got sentenced 12 years for 2 conts of trafficking and 10 years for possession of firearm and no good time he just has to hope for parole in 4 years as for me they labeled me a felon for life and charged me with receiving proceeds from drugs

I don't regard drug dealers as "the lowest of the low" any more than I do the owner of one of the local liquor stores. Do either force people to purchase their products? Is either responsible for the fact that a percentage of the populace is prone to addiction? Of course not.

Not that I expect many to see eye to eye with me on this subject, but I find it ridiculous that such draconian sentences are handed out to non-violent "offenders" who have done no more harm to "society" than liquor, tobacco, coffee, junk food, and soft drink companies.

To be sure, a drug addict is a nasty sight. So is an alcoholic. So is the person who overate until s/he can get around only with a wheelchair (or the $4000 scooter Medicare provided them at taxpayer expense). The day we start putting people in jail until they reduce their weight to a healthy level will be the day I might start to agree with the idea of locking people up for anything to do with drugs.

I don't regard drug dealers as "the lowest of the low" any more than I do the owner of one of the local liquor stores. Do either force people to purchase their products? Is either responsible for the fact that a percentage of the populace is prone to addiction? Of course not.

Not that I expect many to see eye to eye with me on this subject, but I find it ridiculous that such draconian sentences are handed out to non-violent "offenders" who have done no more harm to "society" than liquor, tobacco, coffee, junk food, and soft drink companies.

To be sure, a drug addict is a nasty sight. So is an alcoholic. So is the person who overate until s/he can get around only with a wheelchair (or the $4000 scooter Medicare provided them at taxpayer expense). The day we start putting people in jail until they reduce their weight to a healthy level will be the day I might start to agree with the idea of locking people up for anything to do with drugs.


Here is one person who agrees whole heartedly with you.

DaveMoff... That is a good point! I like your way of thinking.

I am not saying that a drug dealer is the lowest of the low, because I would not say that about anybody.

I just want to add that I had a crack dealer move into my building about a year ago. Before he got there, no problems. After he got there--he and a rival dealer had a shoot-out in my parking lot. It was scary. Luckily no innocent people were hurt.

The drug dealer's customers were hanging out in the hallway, harrassing everyone who went by. When my friends came over, the drug dealer's "assistants" would go out to their cars to ask them if they wanted drugs. It was embarrassing. Women who were prostituting themselves for drugs started propositioning the residents and other people who were there, that was also embarrassing for me when my friends came over.

Finally, the guy was evicted, so I did not have to move for my own safety.

I just wanted to point that out to anyone who has never lived by a "crack house." There is plenty of harm done.

If it were up to me, I would make drugs legal so that people could purchase them just like alcohol at the store. That would end selling drugs on the street and all the extra crime that goes with it.

Now, what I just described as my experience will in no way apply to every single person here, of course. But I have never heard of a crack dealer who doesn't carry a gun. They do that because it is a violent business.

I started to agree with Dave but June5 makes a great point. Drugs cause a lot of problems for innocent people. Overeaters are mainly hurting themselves. I've never heard of a driveby shooting over a package of cookies.
I'm not sure legalizing drugs is the right answer. I'm not saying it is any worse than alcohol. Alcohol kills a lot of innocent people too, especially on the roads. But two wrongs don't make a right. On the other hand, I agree that the punishment is too harsh for dealers, especially for first time offenses.

I have a 20yr old daughter that has been trouble from the age of 14. I did not realize until I received a phone call one night from the police that my daughter was into drugs. She was picked up for prositution,given a warning and released to my custody. I immediatly put her in rehab. They told me she was depressed and prescriped Zolot. Needless to say this didn't help. AT the age of 16 was picked up again for prositution and drugs. Given a warning again and I immediately put her in another rehab center. SHe ran away from there and did not see her again until she was picked up again for tampering with gov records and falsying documents. (used her sisters name). She was given 6 months probation. She was doing good until she got ansy again. Ran away again and was picked up for poss. of controlled substance spent 3 months in jail and was released on ten years probation. Needless to say that lasted about 3 months. Rearrested for transporting illegal immigrants and sentenced to 10 months federal prison. She did her time and was released. The final straw she was picked up again for outstanding tickets and warrants. Now she has violated her probation and sentenced to 8 yrs prison. My daughter did not come from a bad household but there is addiction and her dads side of the family. Grandfather in prison (murder),grandmother for stealing and her dad for drugs. I just dont know what i can do to get her to see she has a problem. I myself have never done drugs but I do smoke and know the addiction is awful. Let me go without and I will show you my bad side. I guess my question is probation,county jail time, rehab nothings worked. I keep praying she will see that she is wasting her life. I believe prison is not the answer. She has been months without drugs but comes out and still does them My opinion is major couseling to find the underlying problems and learn how to deal with them. Thanks for letting me vent.

ccsmom,
I know your pain and frustration. I think the answer for some addicts is long term treatment. Some offenders. like my son, go to rehab over and over again but the rehabs are too short. The gov't would save money if they would just offer serious rehab. What they give now is the punishment form, 30 or 60 days and out they go, only to return again. The program needs to be much longer.

ccsmom, I'm very sorry to hear about your daughter. The main thing is not to beat yourself up over HER illness, and not to cause further family problems by looking for ways to point fingers or try to find a "reason" for her illness. Remember that it's not your daughter who has created all this chaos--it's her addiction.

Unfortunately, no one ever abandons an addiction until they truly decide for themselves that they want to. It may happen that someone finds something they prefer doing; it may also be that the addict is self-medicating for depression or the like and finds another way out of the pit. Speaking as a sober alcoholic (which got me into its share of trouble--and alcohol is quite legal!), no amount of rehab kept me sober until I decided that I wanted to BE sober. Rehab can provide the tools--it's up to the individual to put them to use.

I've been in treatment twice, and didn't stop drinking either time. Finally made up my mind that I had to do something about it and with determination and the help of Alcoholics Anonymous (which is not perfect but I would never hesitate to recommend it or any 12-step program) I've been sober apart from one very brief period since 1994.

I too would like to see more treatment resources available to addicts, but you know the saying about leading a horse to water.... During one of my stints in treatment I met a fellow who was going through the mill for the 13th time--each time he'd been offered treatment as an alternative to jail, so he took it, cooled his heels for a month, and picked up where he left off. Two other guys were in treatment as a condition of parole and wound up being kicked out for using/drinking--one was going back to prison for several years as a result. An addiction truly can take a terrible hold on a person--AA refers to it as "insanity" and they're not far off the mark.

Perhaps longer stints in rehab would help if, say, the first 30 day "spin dry" doesn't help. Certainly it would be more effective than putting non-violent drug offenders in prison without addressing what put them there! Probably cheaper, too.

You're quite right--we don't see drive-by shootings over a pack of cigarettes or a Quarter Pounder With Cheese or a bottle of cheap wine. That's because these products are sold openly, mere possession of them is not unlawful, and there is no need for sellers to operate out of apartments with one eye peeled for the police. Any given night you'll probably find a certain number of prostitutes patrolling local bars, and if you have a casino nearby....well, gambling can be an addiction as well, not to mention that there is probably alcohol available in abundance in such places--very possibly drugs and prostitutes as well if you know where to look.

It seems to me that if the mere sale or possession of drugs were decriminalized, the government could tax the heck out of them and use the proceeds to finance treatment for addicts who want it. Meanwhile, violent or property crimes should be prosecuted against addicts just as they are among those not under the influence of any substance.

It's off the subject, but much the same is true of prostitution. Providing one is a consenting adult....I don't believe I have the right to tell you what to do with your body. Anyone coercing someone into prostitution or holding them against their will is of course committing a serious crime and should be treated accordingly. Countries that have legalized prostitution have seriously reduced this sort of crime, along with the spread of sexually-transmitted disease. I personally have no interest in the services of a prostitute, and have no idea why anyone would want to go into that line of work, but that's just me.

ccsmom, you may find some help at a meeting of Al-Anon or one of the similar 12-Step groups for the families of addicts. There you will meet people who share your experiences and may well have much to offer. There is no charge and chances are that the location of the nearest meeting can be found in your daily newspaper. What do you have to lose?

I finally got the courage to call NA. I will be attending these meetings. I just have a hard time excepting this. My daughter was a good kid until the drugs became a part of her life. I didn"t see the signs. Sneeking out her window,staying the night with friends or supposedly and then sneaking out their windows. These girls were friends of my friends. Stealing my things which of course was blamed on my other kids. I guess I just cannot get over the guilt I feel. I should have done more. I have other kids and not once thank the LORD have they ever gave me this kind of pain or heart ache. Crying seems to be a part of my everyday life. Hopefully this will dull in time. Thanks for the advice and the courage you gave me to make that call.

Yea, if someone doesnt want help then treating them probly wont help them, but what if one were to get educated about the drug and the addiction and what its doing to themselves and their loved ones and that makes even a small amount of those who didnt want help to begin with change their mind and acually put the effort into beating the addiction? I still think they should atleast try to rehabilitate addicts. Its got to do more good then just throwing them in prison to deal with it alone.
My husband and my sister in law are both in prison bc of a drug related crime. Its very sad bc they are both wonderful ppl who just made a bad decision out of desperation bc of something that was, at that point, out of their control and both of them would benefit greatly in a treatment program. They should atleast treat those who are willing and want to stay clean.

well my husband went to court he got a 90day drug program a year taking off his probatoin

I don't regard drug dealers as "the lowest of the low" any more than I do the owner of one of the local liquor stores. Do either force people to purchase their products? Is either responsible for the fact that a percentage of the populace is prone to addiction? Of course not.

Not that I expect many to see eye to eye with me on this subject, but I find it ridiculous that such draconian sentences are handed out to non-violent "offenders" who have done no more harm to "society" than liquor, tobacco, coffee, junk food, and soft drink companies.

To be sure, a drug addict is a nasty sight. So is an alcoholic. So is the person who overate until s/he can get around only with a wheelchair (or the $4000 scooter Medicare provided them at taxpayer expense). The day we start putting people in jail until they reduce their weight to a healthy level will be the day I might start to agree with the idea of locking people up for anything to do with drugs.
I agree with you completely. That was a very interesting way to put it, it's just so true. Thanks for your :twocents:

Originally Posted by DaveMoff
I don't regard drug dealers as "the lowest of the low" any more than I do the owner of one of the local liquor stores. Do either force people to purchase their products? Is either responsible for the fact that a percentage of the populace is prone to addiction? Of course not.

Not that I expect many to see eye to eye with me on this subject, but I find it ridiculous that such draconian sentences are handed out to non-violent "offenders" who have done no more harm to "society" than liquor, tobacco, coffee, junk food, and soft drink companies.

To be sure, a drug addict is a nasty sight. So is an alcoholic. So is the person who overate until s/he can get around only with a wheelchair (or the $4000 scooter Medicare provided them at taxpayer expense). The day we start putting people in jail until they reduce their weight to a healthy level will be the day I might start to agree with the idea of locking people up for anything to do with drugs.



I also agree, You have made a very good point!!

The disparity between federal and state sentences abhores me. My wife obtained a 12 year federal sentence for a first offense, and feds offer NO parole. Period. Manslaughter, rapists, arsonists, burglars, embezzlers get lower sentences on the average, and those convicted under state law serve only a portion before parole. If she had robbed them rather than selling them drugs, she would be free today! The fed war on drugs is killiing our economy, our citizens, and our lives. It needs reform.

I Have Lost Everything But My Life B/c Of Drugs.my Whole World Felll Apart B/c Of Drugs.i Am A Rcovering Addict And I've Been Sober For A Year And 9 Months.i Am In The Process Of Rebuilding My Life And So Far I Am Doing Good.i Just Hate It That It Took Drugs To Take Everything That I Hold Dear Away From Me.all Is Good When You Follow God.

My boyfriend is about to start a drug related trial. He has no previous record and he is going to get screwed by minimum sentencing. I agree that you should do time, but minimum sentences are crazy. There are much worse crimes that get to be judged based on circumstances and your previous record. One bad choice could take away 5 years or more of your life.

I Am Sorry About Your Boyfriend. My Prayers Are With You All. My Son Is Going Into His 12 Year. Trusting God Makes Things Easier. I Am Concerned About Your Comment That You Agree That There Should Be Time. It Is My Opinion That These Type Of Comments Allow The Increase Of Jail Sentences. We Need To Concentrate On Worse Crimes Or Someone Who Uses Powder And The Discrepancies In The 100:1 Minority Sentences.

My mother was a crack and heroine addict for years. Her drug use began in the 60's (not hard drugs then but they followed soon after) There has been periods where she has been clean for a year or 2, but she has always fallen. She finally became clean when she violated a 5 year probation and got sent to SAFP. (she had been found guilty of check fraud which was related to the drugs and they had just given her probation) She's been out since 2001 and is clean. Thank God. I'm still scared she might fall back into it.
Growing up, it was a big secret for my brother and I. We never told anyone until it was far too late and I regret that. I often wonder if I had just told someone, would my brother be in prison now? We had a hard time growing up and my mom's drug usage had pretty much destroyed our family. It's hard to describe what life is like living with an addict, unless you yourself has.
My brother has a history of drug usage, too, including meth, pills, and alcohol. On the night of his offense, he was very drunk and high. Not that it excuses it, but he was a different person when he was messed up. SO was my mom.
My uncle also died in 2004 from an overdose.

What about those who weren't addicts when they went in but damn sure are now. My boyfriend has never been a user and there are many more who WERE'NT either. I pray it doesn't happen to him too

First--My baby brother first bid for 1 1/2 rid for Meth, 8months out 2 bid 6 years--only out a year doing good so far. Cousin first bid 3 years for Meth out 6 months 2nd bid 5 years out 6 months on his way back using everyday. My Aunt lost 180K life insurance policy for husband who worked for state prison system has done 2 bid first was 3 years then out 12 months back for 8 years and now homeless--never hear from her. 2 cousins got 26 years for manufacturing Meth. I would have to say this system doesn't work--I mean the whole thing is insane--when I had my children there where Mothers waiting to take part of the drugs used to wing the babies off the stuff. This state has now passed laws behind to counter only--but what upsets me is 100 years ago Heroin was sold in the Drug stores as the cure all drug--obviously their is an issue when kids need to get high to enjoy life. Just another story--I refuse to use cause I watched everybody I love turn into monsters and give up everything they have for a hit. Honestly I would rather they leave my relatives to self destruction instead of paying people money to keep them alive to suffer again and again--if they want to do it they will--sorry--I don't beleieve in rehabilitation any more haven't seen any--:(

Its time to legalize drugs-----take the criminality out of the game. Most of our societal problems stem from the seedy underworld of drug dealing. If you made it legal, prisons would empty, crime rates would fall, and those who need help would get it.

LEGALIZE DRUGS NOW!

The man I love with all my heart is now in prison because of his addiction. I tried for 2 years to help him, and I do believe that he tried too. He just didn't try hard enough. I guess he didn't want it that badly. We could have had a wonderful life together. I had to walk away, because I could no longer take the mental, verbal, and yes, the physical abuse. He could be sweet and wonderful one minute, and a monster the next. I could not accept living like that any longer. He did horrible things to me, which I, of course, did not deserve. All I ever did was try to help him. Even his family couldn't believe that I took so much before I said, "enough"! His own family wants nothing to do with him. He has noone. It got so bad, that I moved 1000 miles away, and am trying to move on with my life, but it is so hard to forget. It is very hard to forget all that pain. I know he is in pain too, what the root of that pain is, I will probably never know. I hope he finally gets the help he needs in the prison programs. I'm not really sure if they are good programs or not, but on the other hand, he has to want it for it to work. There really wasn't anything available to him on the outside, as he had no insurance or money. What money he did have, what he earned and also stole from me, he spent on crack. So you see, it was a no win situation. Well, the outcome is, he is in prison for a violent crime, and I am living alone, 1000 miles from home. I am safe now.

I think that addiction to drugs needs to be treated as so!!! Instead of locking people up for it and wasting everyones money we need to start helping people!!! What have we become as a society !!!!?????

I have heard this said a many of a time...."Illicit Drugs are only illegal because the government has yet to develop a plan to tax them"

I agree whole heartedly with this statement. My husband is currently in FCI Petersburg because he was distributing cocaine. While I don't believe that he should of been allowed to go free, it was very hard to sit in a court room and watch other men be sentenced to much less time for violent / sexual offenses.

My son has also bounced back and forth with drug usage which caused bouncing in and out of prison, starting with the age of 17. Now he is 24. He has been out for a year this time but has struggled with finding a decent job. Wal-Mart wouldn't evne hire him. They called him for an interview, he got excited and went but when he got there they said they had "overlooked" where he had answered "yes" to a felony conviction. Drug crimes keep you down and people go back to self-medicating for their depression.
I started this post mainly wanting to vent my frustration at the "inequality" of the drug felons compared to other felony charges. I now work for the state, determining eligibility for food vouchers and temporary assistance. The only people we can not give help to are people who have a drug felony any time in their life. We can give help to murderers, child molesters, rapists, etc but not to drug felons. I'm not saying some of those people don't deserve it too; just making a point about how drug felons are singled out. I was told it was due to a strong lobby group and concessions; you know the typical political bs of trade off.
I was shocked to find that out to the point of wanting to quit because it makes me so angry. Drug addicts can't get the help they need to start over.

I agree with your statement completely, My boyfriend is in prison for 24 months because of a meth charge, he had in his possession 8 grams, and they still nailed him with a 2nd degree attempt to sale. I don't see how taking people away from their family and support system does anyone any good, for some offenders who's wives and girlfriends don't stick by them, and they have no family what then? The sytem just tore their whole world apart and left it in pieces, and they make it so hard for those people to get all the piece back together, almost impossible. They sentenced my boyfriend one week after our daughter was born, and left me here to raise 2 children by myself. That is exacly why I feel that the drug war is not a war on drugs it is a war on families. I sent out letters to all of my states representatives stating just that, and only 2 replied, but neither were very understanding, or seemed to want to be of any help in fixing the issue.

I agree that the sentencing guidelines are strict. I hate the fact that he will be gone 8-10 years for a non-violent offense. He will be 35 when he gets out. The fact that prisons are meant to torture and not rehabilitate concerns me as well. What happens when he gets out and no one will hire him. I'm affraid that he will say "Hey, heres an easy way to make money. I'll sell dope again." I am working very hard to make sure that when he is on the outside I can take care of both of us so that he actually has a choice. I pray that he sees the error of his way while he is gone. I want him to come out and be a man who wants to stay, create a family and live together in peace.

I entirely agree. Our present system is not intended to rehabilitate, but rather to keep people behind bars. We now have the highest percentage of our population locked up of any nation on earth, along with, to my knowledge, the highest recidivism rate on earth.

So long as it remains profitable to run prisons--remember that many of our prisons are now run by private companies--and criminals of all sorts remain an all-purpose boogeyman for politicians (when's the last time you heard someone running for office promise to get more prisoners back "on the streets"?), I'm not sure where the incentive is for anyone to do anything differently.

My Man And Me Were Both Selling Drugs And He Took The Time. He Is Sitting In A Behavior Modification Program And I Am Pissed The System Isn't Helping Him. Rehab Is What I Prayed For But I Didn't Get Why Not Because The System Sucks Thats Why. Now I Can't Even See Him Because He Is So Far Away And Talking To Him Is Almost Out Of The Question At 12 Dollars A Call.

Good luck to you Katieones.
You are right to worry about "the easy way to make money." But you taking the position that you will take care of both of you when he gets out isn't the answer either. He will have a lot of spare time on his hands. Even if he doesn't need the money to live on, he will probably still want to make a fast buck. He needs to be willing to start at the bottom and work into something else. My son couldn't handle that. He worked fast food since they were the only ones who would hire him but he hated it. It was a daily reminder of how much he gave up when choosing the drugs. He was a very intelligent person before the drugs invaded his mind. Besides a physical withdrawal, there is a long mental withdrawal too. That is the part that brings him back down. He ended up losing those jobs too because he hated going.
Right now, I only know that he is living about 150 miles from here but I don't know exactly where; could be back in jail for violation by now.
It's been a never ending battle for 8 yrs and I've finally had to let go (as much as a mother can).

Because my Fiance decided to selll Cocaine,not use it, He will not be here to see our daughters 1st birthday, Her 1st word, her 1st steps, Nothing. I am absolutly torn. It hurts but he chose to do it. he got caught. we have to deal with the consequences. I also know of many people who are in because of addiction. LOCKING THEM UP DOESNT HELP. they just want to come out and go right back into the old ways. Prison doesnt do anything. It just tears you down. Gives you a lack of esteem. Thats my view.



And also good luck amanda! i hope everything works for you.

Drugs - would this include prescription drugs that you are not suppose to drive under the influence of....did you know that if the label on your medication says "do not drive while taking until you know the effects of this drug" means that you will be charged with dui (at the least) and with intent with a deadly weapon if you are involved in an accident. The lawyers and judges in this country would go to the poor house if it wasn't for drug arrests....

Before meeting my husband I had never been around anyone who had done drugs of any kind, and I never really understood what this addiction can do to a person and a family, now I know. I met my husband shortly after he got out of prison the first time. He was in for drugs, and when he was released, it only took him two days to find meth yet again. When I met Scott he was in a period of trying to quit, and me not knowing anything about drugs thought that was really cool, and was totally behind him one hundred percent. When my husband is sober he is the funniest, greatest guy that I have ever known, I can totally be myself around him, tell him anything, and know that even if he doesn't agree, that he will still respect me, and try to understand my position, but when he started using again I didn't realize it. All I saw was the man I fell in love with was no longer around. He became distant, mean, and was gone all the time. It took me quite awhile to realize what was going on. At the same time my best friend was getting into this drug also, actually doing the drugs with my husband. Both of them ended up in prison, she gave birth to her child while incarcerated, giving the baby up two days later to her sister. And for the last two and a half years I have waited for my husband. This time around I think that he will be able to make it. This time around in prison, I have heard him actually say that he has a drug problem, he's never admitted this before, and that he has to ger a new group of friends, actually we will be moving away from this state as soon as he's out, he needs to go home and help raise his daughter, who is finally in his life this time around. I have come to see in these last years, that our justice system is not so just. That prisons do not release rehabilitated men back into society, it takes these men to realize that there is more to life out there, and having something to look forward to. Scott has me and his daughter, and his whole family backing him up, and letting him know that he can make it, that he is worth something to all of us, and that we love him. The day that Scott said that he can never touch drugs again, I cried, because that was the most precious thing that I have ever heard, now I have hope that I will get the man that I fell in love with back in my arms again, and is making me laugh more then anyone ever has before.

Our system needs to more rehabilitation with drugs and with the penal system period. We need to have people who are more compassionate working with our loved ones while they are incarcerated to get to the root of why they turned to drugs, and not beating these people down for making a mistake.

Screwed me!

I was giving a friend/dealer a ride home. Long story short, I ended up with 4 charges (2 intent to distribute, 2 possession). I was able to plead guilty to a F3 and will be on probation for 2 years. Thankfully, this is a deffered sentence so things aren't as bad as I had expected.

The price I am paying:
-10k in legal fees
-5k in court costs
-UAs once a week ($10)/BAs twice a month ($4)
-education classes twice a week (pretty sure I have to pay for those..haven't started yet)
-suspended license for 3 months (i was passed up for a good job that would have helped pay for all this crap)

:thumbsup:

Bad enough, I should think, since you committed no crime. Dang, if being in close proximity to a drug dealer is sufficient evidence for multiple felony counts, how long is anyone likely to remain a "law-abiding citizen"?

Well, I was guilty of possession but the intent was bullshit. The cops searched my car and found a pill box, which I forgot I had. There were 3 ecstasy pills in the box and I guess over a gram constitutes as intent to distribute.

My son is losing 13 years of his life because of the war on drugs. His supervisor tricked him into taking a passenger on a flight under false pretenses. The passenger picked up cocaine; son didn't know about it until it was too late. Because he dared to go to trial, the prosecutor tried his hardest to get him at least 19 years. The war on drugs increases the value of drugs much above what they would cost if they were legal. The w.on d. makes black markets flourish, makes corruption rampant, etc. Drugs become more dangerous (like whiskey laced with paint thinner, etc. during the prohibition); they are cut with added ingredients to pump up profit. I'm totally against it. It destroys far more lives than drugs by themselves ever did. People who are determined to get high will do so. Meth labs spring up, people find that flowers can get them high. Now they are even doing with methane- (human feces!). Regulate and tax drugs instead. As long as people don't hurt others and drive impaired-let them alone!

My husband is addicted to meth. His problem was very severe. He would stay up for days & even weeks!!! He had been up for 6 days when he got busted trying to buy from undercover cops. They sentenced him to 25 years! I couldn't believe it. He is the kind of guy who walks the little old lady across the street now he is in prison. I think it is horrible that the government is not helping drug addicts they just lock them up. I mean my husband has never received treatment for his addiction nor been offered help. Now my son who is 3 only gets to see his Daddy every 2 weeks for 2 hours at a time. It is very very sad but I guess there is nothing I can do.

I have a brother who is a drug addict. He has been in and out of jail a number of times and I cannot begin to tell the affect this has had on my family and I. Drugs are everywhere even in prison. I agree with most of you when you say that the justice system should send these addicts to a long term institution different from the standard prison. All I know is that drugs are the worst enemy because they just leave you helpless while you watch loved one waste away.

There are a lot of researchers working on vaccines which will keep you from getting high from cocaine and/or methamphetamine. The vaccine will last a lifetime, according to some Yale scientists who released preliminary results earlier this year.

My question to you folks is how will your life be different once you can get a shot which immunizes you from getting high from coke/meth? If you or a family member has a problem with one of these drugs, and a shot can cure it, will this just be a motivation to switch to a different drug like Ecstasy, heroin, sniffing glue, or whatever? Or will it be the salvation which re-unites families and solves the recidivism problem?

[p.s. as a believer in civil liberties, I don't think there should be any laws of prohibition, including any laws against buying/selling/using/making narcotics and thus anyone jailed for these or related offenses is in my opinion unjustly held. But that doesn't mean I think people ought to be smoking ice or crack. They are bad for you.]

How do you decide? Who wants to be clean and who doesn't?[/QUOTE]

People who want to be clean are people strong enough and brave enough to face the demons that put them there to begin with. Some people might not be able to do it on their own, they especially need lots of love and support around them to give them the strength to try.

Addiction can be a sickness you develop by accident, like the pain killers in which case you will probably want to get back to normal and need help to do that. people with street drug problems might be in a tougher spot because they sought those drugs out for the purpose of losing themselves.

You should give your boyfriend more love than he can imagine - when his heart is open it will hurt and he will want to change his life.

My boyfriend is serving 9-23.5 months in county jail for drug charges. He got taken away on september 25th, last thursday. We are expecting our first child in febuary. He will miss the birth of our child, his little sister's graduation, and probably the death of his terminally ill grandmother. He has been clean since May, right after his arrest, and because his sentancing date kept being pushed back. He's made such an incredible effort for himself and our families and I pray that he will never go back to how he was prior to his arrest. Drugs are so incredibly harmful, but no-one seems to realise just how much they can hurt people until the worst possible happens and families are torn apart. I'm one of the lucky ladies here that only has about 9 months to wait, but I have immense respect for all of you that have been waiting, and will continue to wait for months, even years, faithfully. I never knew how hard it was to be alone until they took him away, and even though it's only been a week since he has been gone, it hurts.

My girlfriend just took a plea bargin and got 18 months as a first time offender. She was a middle-man in a federal drug investigation, the money and drugs passed through her hands so she took all the heat, and the dealer is still free to sell more drugs. She had...had a clean record, now because she was caught in the middle of this she is a convicted felon. First time offense with what used to be a clean record, and still her federal judge showed no sympathy or remorse and wouldn't knock any time off her sentence. Do I think she deserved to be punished somehow...yes, do crime and get punished, but something has to give. 18 months in federal prison for a first time offender is a little absurd. Who's gonna suffer from her ridiculously strict sentence...her 2 kids of course. If it was up to me...
First time offender...probation/house arrest
Second offense...jail time
Third offense...prison time
Of course the type of drug and the amount of drugs would have have a say so in the sentencing.

Please do a search on "justice fellowship". Please click on legislation and 2nd Chance. You have the ability to send a form letter or your own letter to send letters to your State Representatives to get funding to our states to aid ex-offenders. (sorry I cannot give you the link because PTO states I have to have 25 posts) The "2nd Chance Bill" that was signed by President Bush in 2007. Pretty easy to do and hopefully it can make a difference. The site has a lot of interesting updated information on how we can make a difference. Barb

My heart goes out to you and your situation. There is no doubt things are unfair, especially with the "drug war". My husband is POW99987071, USP-LEE serving a Life Sentence for Trafficking... you will get through this and things will become easier. ((((hugs)))) Delphine


My boyfriend is serving 9-23.5 months in county jail for drug charges. He got taken away on september 25th, last thursday. We are expecting our first child in febuary. He will miss the birth of our child, his little sister's graduation, and probably the death of his terminally ill grandmother. He has been clean since May, right after his arrest, and because his sentancing date kept being pushed back. He's made such an incredible effort for himself and our families and I pray that he will never go back to how he was prior to his arrest. Drugs are so incredibly harmful, but no-one seems to realise just how much they can hurt people until the worst possible happens and families are torn apart. I'm one of the lucky ladies here that only has about 9 months to wait, but I have immense respect for all of you that have been waiting, and will continue to wait for months, even years, faithfully. I never knew how hard it was to be alone until they took him away, and even though it's only been a week since he has been gone, it hurts.

YOu know, thank God for PTO because I didn;t know there are researchers working on vaccines...there is no doubt that...come to think of it, we can say what folk should or shouldn't do, but ultimately it's to the individual to choose. We're enfused with free will, so whatever we choose to do or get involved with we have to be able to handle the conquences of our decisions...I'm not critising (forgive spelling) anyone, just it is what it is.
my :twocents:


There are a lot of researchers working on vaccines which will keep you from getting high from cocaine and/or methamphetamine. The vaccine will last a lifetime, according to some Yale scientists who released preliminary results earlier this year.

My question to you folks is how will your life be different once you can get a shot which immunizes you from getting high from coke/meth? If you or a family member has a problem with one of these drugs, and a shot can cure it, will this just be a motivation to switch to a different drug like Ecstasy, heroin, sniffing glue, or whatever? Or will it be the salvation which re-unites families and solves the recidivism problem?

[p.s. as a believer in civil liberties, I don't think there should be any laws of prohibition, including any laws against buying/selling/using/making narcotics and thus anyone jailed for these or related offenses is in my opinion unjustly held. But that doesn't mean I think people ought to be smoking ice or crack. They are bad for you.]

Drugs is what caused my husband to do the crime he is in for. Although he has been clean since being locked up in 2005, I believe the true test is when he comes home. This has devasted my family, tough on my kids, not having their dad around since he was a great father as long as he didn't use. I think prisoners with drug problems should get help, don't think prison will really most cases. I just wish that more drug offenders could be placed in drug rehab rather than do lengthy sentences.

I know your pain. Laws for drugs use are rediculoous, but we do not see this until it hits us in the face with a family member. My family member is in another state, so this was a great shock. Someone told me recently that if you wanted to do something wrong in that state you ought to just shoot someone, you would get less time than you would for a crime of addiction. From what I am seeing--that is right.

My boyfriend is locked up for his addiction. He is addicted to Meth, he now is back in for a parole violation. 12 years! What gets me is he could of robbed someone or a place and got less time. Locking these people up and then just setting them free isn't going to help. He gets out - NO JOB, Cant find a job, has no money to get back and forth to meetings, then he starts to feel like a burden and then goes to make some money and the circle starts all over agian. Why dont they help them come out with a job to try and rehibalitate theses people, but no they put them on the bus (which they have to pay for) and say "See you back here in a year or so" It's so frustrating, they are already stripped of their pride when they come home. So why not help!

My son is currently in the middle of a court case. He was outside of his friend's house, a guy he has known since he was 8 yrs old. He was on the sidewalk, was going to walk up to the door. The house was raided for drugs before he made it off the sidewalk. Drugs were found inside the house. My son had none on him. He was charged with possession. The police say he admitted that some of the drugs were his which he would not do, even if they were his, which they weren't. Even the lawyers are baffled on how the charge can stick. BUT because my son has a drug charge from 5 yrs ago which he completed prison time and parole, he is advised to try to plead out. What, he had nothing on him :confused:
The guy who actually had the drugs in his house just got 5 yrs probation. He had a public defender. The prosecutor wants my son to do 6 yrs prison time. :confused::mad:
Why does he have to keep paying for past crimes that he already did prison time for? There were two other friends with him and they got arrested but not charged. Why does a criminal history makes him guiltier? The punishment never ends.
Plus this charge has cost us thousands in bail money and lawyer fees. He is going to plead guilty but tell the judge he is only doing so because we can't come up with another $10,000 for a trial lawyer. The judge won't give him a public defender because he is supported by us. He has applied for a ton of jobs but not found one that will take a felon. He is supposed to start Voc Rehab next week, after waiting for months. His next court date is Dec 18th so I don't know if he'll get to continue the Voc Rehab.
In response to the thread title, the drug war is definitely against families, at least ones who try to stick by the addicts who are trying to recover.

Hi, I am new to this drug war. I have spent all my life (over 60 years) believing that the law always did the right thing. No sympathy at all for anyone that used drugs. After all I never used drugs, so why would anyone else have an excuse for doing it. Then it hits you like a ton of bricks when you find that a loved one--a really wonderful person has gotten caught up in this mess. I see the people that have no sympathy and remember how I was once the same. Once it hits home you begin to understand the problem and see that changes need to be made. I agree that it does no good to send someone to rehab that does not want to change, but when they do and especially on their first arrest, yes. A short while in jail for most of these if enough to scare them into wanting to change. However, for some in law enforcement a big prison sentence means a boost to their careers. After all who cares about the life of a druggie Drug rehab is so much less expensive, but some do not care how much money it would save. It seems they would prefer to send them to prison, hoping they will stay on drugs so they can again rearrest them when they are finally free and then say they are cleaning the streets of drugs. Yes, I am very bitter at the moment and do I ever know how they will try to make the small guy out to be a big dealer when he has hardly a dime to his name. I don't know why God did not answer our prayers, but he must have a reason. Maybe he needs the help of more of us to spread the word to those in charge of what this is really like. All I know to do is write to anyone that will listen and hope we can convince the public of a better solution.

The "Drug War" is a joke, a perverse political joke!!! The government doesn't care about the health of the people, if they did they would outlaw things such as tobacco and alcohol. The politicians are pissed at drugs because they can't tax them. If they cared about the people they would demand treatment for addiction and do more to educate the young generation.I think the war on drugs is just a way for politicians to try and get votes. Think about it, a first time non-violent drug offender will get more time than a child molester, a murderer, bank robber, etc. The drug laws also allow, excuse me, DEMAND forfiture of assets. If you have worked your ass off for years and are starting to have a little something, you can lose it all for a joint or a personal sac of whatever.This allows the government to fatten their pockets and worst of all you don't even have to be convicted to lose everything, trust me I know!!Sorry to rant but the "War on Drugs" has severly PISSED ME OFF!!!!!WHAT A PERVERSION OF JUSTICE!!!!!!!!!!!

bow-hunter,
You are so right about the unequal treatment of drug offenders. I worked for the state of MO until March. The only people who are automatically disqualified to receive food stamps (not stamps any more but still called that) are people with a drug felony. Now that the benefits are issued on EBT cards, the gov't can't use the excuse that drug users trade their food stamps for drugs. But they haven't changed the ruling. It was tough for me to do my job when I so strongly disagreed with that policy.

My boyfriend was originally put on probation for having...well... alot of weed on him. But not over a pound. Since then, he has not been around it at all but got stuck on the probation. Due to his charge being in Rockwall county right off HWY 30, I believe they are trying to make an example out of him. With him being young and all. It sucks because he has had nothing to do with weed since the day he was arrested but still, 3 years later, he is serving 2 years in TDC for it. I really have a question though for all the women reading this... Does it ever get better? Like I just bust into random crying sessions, will that stop or am I the only one doing that?

God bless you guys.... lord knows we need it. =]

This war on drugs is probaly one the hardest I have ever had to swallow. Watching how the system is with my guy and myself. He got parole violation and sent away for 12 more years, but the hardest part is they got what they wanted, they have him locked up, but that wasn't good enough for that particular officer, he wasn't done destroying our life. They harrassed me every day I left my house, by pulling me over EVERY time I left the hoiuse, yes I had a problem, but after he was out the last time, WE STAYED CLEAN and far from everything, and that is what I think they hated the most. I have never been into trouble before until they day after I refused to let them search my car, not for guilt but tired of the harressment! Then the next day when they search my car as I was in the process of moving (due to all of this) they what do you know----find a controllled substance in my car. I have had enough of this, so I moved out of state away from my guy which is hell in itself, I am now 5 hours away from him, unable to have any visits and an still awaiting my court date for this. All I can do is hope this time goes by quickly and by the time he comes home, I will have a new start in a new state to begin our life over. Thank all of you this forum is a lifesaver.

A vaccine? personal responsibility should be everyone's priority. Drug addiction is hell but I'm advocating taking personal responsibility for what you put in your mouth, vein or nose. If you're a secure individual you don't need the chase of the high. A person needs a foundation of sense of self, respect for self, they (parents, school, church) should teach that first and foremost ,be confident in yourself , somewhere along the lines we've lost the basics. I have hope.

People have to stop playing the victim, once you're an adult, there is no one to blame. That is the easy way out, blaming the system, the government, oh woah is me. you know what? suck it up only you have control.

If indeed it were possible to develop a vaccine against substance addiction, and if it were mandated that everyone receive such a vaccine, would this not essentially constitute the use of medical means to further a subjective "moral" agenda? And just how would this be a higher moral position than simply providing those who want them with drugs?

Drugs are already available which will block the effects of most of the more common intoxicants (naltrexone, among others). Should taking them be compulsory "for the public good"? Think about it.

If indeed it were possible to develop a vaccine against substance addiction, and if it were mandated that everyone receive such a vaccine, would this not essentially constitute the use of medical means to further a subjective "moral" agenda? And just how would this be a higher moral position than simply providing those who want them with drugs?

Drugs are already available which will block the effects of most of the more common intoxicants (naltrexone, among others). Should taking them be compulsory "for the public good"? Think about it.

No drugs or vaccines are mandated under the law. Parents can say no to vaccines for their children. So I don't think this is a problem. Is someone here advocating a mandatory shot, if one becomes available, if so i missed that?

Not to my knowledge--I was speaking hypothetically. Perhaps a better way of phrasing it would be: is it ethical for "society" to give someone a drug or similar to prevent them from possibly taking another drug? Who decides?

For that matter, let's suppose you receive a vaccine which blocks the effects of opiates and later require morphine for pain. What if you are "vaccinated" against THC and later on need relief for nausea from chemotherapy? This tangent opens a significant can of worms....would be interested in hearing the thoughts of others.

well, you can talk hypothetically until the cows come home. Who decides? The individual. Anything you want do to your own body whether it be drugs, surgery, food, tattoos, a fruit basket on your head, is your choice and your own damn business. I don't want those choice EVER to be regulated by the government. It's not a can of worms, it's a slippery slope.

It took my heaven away.

what i can appreciate about this thread is that we're finding out some real truths about our situations. someone said about certain liberities being not regulated by the government. interesting...once upon a time, the government was thought of to solve all of society's ills...now it's become the very thing WE thought would save us...boy...now look at things... now the government is crooked, maybe becoming more crooked each day and we're not in a real position to do anything about it-or are we? what can we do now? government doesn't fear her people anymore-and that has become a receipe for absolute chaos...

My fiance has been an addict for the past four years. He was addicted to marijuana and ecstasy. As a result, he did not finish school. He sold drugs to make a living. He was arrested and charged with distribution of a CDS in the second degree and now sits in Bergen County Jail here in New Jersey. He missed his sister's wedding, was not able to be there for his mother through her liver transplant, and lost his unborn son.

He has been able to get help since he hit rock bottom. He is now in a Drug Rehabilitation Program in jail. They have NA and AA meetings, group discussions, meditation, one on one time with a counselor, as well as educational classes. The program has helped him a lot in learning how drugs have affected his life. He actually wants to be sober now, which I am very proud of.

I am just hoping that he does not end up being sentenced to serve prison/jail time. I would much rather him be sentenced to Drug Court, which would help him get his life back on track. He actually wants and needs the help. As long as he's sober and clean, he won't be committing any crimes.

dont know if any will read this , here goes... i did 4 years for drug sales and poss. . the war on drugs ? well i have many sleepless nights thinking about just that ! started out mad at the world , at the bullshit the cops pulled [even though i WAS guilty of all i was acussed of] . after some time of being pissed i started to read again , all about drugs crime and the law . now i am out [still on paper 'till 2010] and this is the result of all that time to think... i do not agree with the drug laws or the man. sent laws - corrections has become way too big of BIG bus. . nonetheless i was not living a good life and was hurting all that i touched [including myself] . i would not have stoped with a slap on the wrist [such as probation or a county bit or even bootcamp]-i guess i needed just what i got... the problem is thats not what any of these laws are about ! they are about one thing and one thing only CASH! i now live clean and have walked away from all that was . guess i have paid what i owed ?

Not to my knowledge--I was speaking hypothetically. Perhaps a better way of phrasing it would be: is it ethical for "society" to give someone a drug or similar to prevent them from possibly taking another drug? Who decides?

For that matter, let's suppose you receive a vaccine which blocks the effects of opiates and later require morphine for pain. What if you are "vaccinated" against THC and later on need relief for nausea from chemotherapy? This tangent opens a significant can of worms....would be interested in hearing the thoughts of others.

I don't think it's "ethical" or even morally responsible for society to be deciding that ALL drugs are without merit to those of us who need them, who can use them responsibly, for their intended purpose.

I should be able to use marijuana to treat my disease without being a criminal for it. I don't, because that would make me a criminal, and instead, I am forced to take drugs that will ultimately cause me liver damage and shorten my life.

I wonder how long it will be before the stupid dieters of this nation manage to successfully get our herbs pulled off the shelves. Ephedra, used in Asia for thousands of years, for bronchial problems, is abused here in America, because Wall street says every woman must look like a stick, or risk being thought unattractive.

People don't read or research their medications and unwittingly kill themselves or close to it by mixing herbal supplements with their prescription drugs. St John's Wort, a natural antidepressant, CANNOT be taken with many prescription antidepressants. This should be a no brainer, but because most people don't do their research, we all wind up paying the price even when we have done ours.

If you want to manage drugs socially, then manage the ones that damage society. No good ever came from anyone smoking, snorting, or shooting crystal meth. It has no medical use, and it's made from some of the most caustic chemicals out there. It rots your organs, including your skin, takes your teeth, takes your family and destroys your life. And we don't manage those drugs. All we do is lock up the people we catch making or distributing it and give them more time to learn better ways to not get caught next time.

The entire war on drugs is BS and has been since the National Drug Act was signed.

Drug addicts are not criminals, they need rehab.
Locking our boys up is only for money. Prison is not meant to reform, it's meant to keep them in there, like a revolving door.
Studies show that if rehab and reform were exercised, they could become productive citizens in society.
Prison is a money making venture. That's all it is and what it is.

http://www.nicaliving.com/node/15079

it's called 212(d)(3) Waiver Nicaragua and I'm se_vnt3 on the site too

anyone may pm me if they're interested in an international movement against the war on drugs. it's been going on 40 years to long since Richard Nixon declared it. make sure to click on all of the links provided in order to inform yourself thoroughly before reaching a decision on the subject

Ruined the lives of our family!!!!

Drug dealers kill many people. in many ways, I was one that was spiritualy dead for over 10 years on crack. But if I were not buying the stuff, no one would be selling it! So the fault lies with users, and not the dealers!
Thank God for Jesus showing me the way out of darkness 2 years ago, now there is love back in my family. Love is so important in life, and we as users put crack above love in our lives. I have seen women give up their children for the love of crack! And you know thats real crazy! But we can change this if we all just reach out and help one other person from darkness to light. " Seek first the kingdom" 6:33 This scripture changed my life, perhaps you cab help another with it.
God bless you
clean888

All I know is that I have never taken drugs and I lost everything. My wife of 14 years, the family, and evrything I owned. Thats how powerful these drugs are that it reaches out and destroys everything it can touch. I lost a lot of good friends over the years also. Some died, the others tuned into somebody else. As far as i can tell, it seems to rewire the personality penamently. Thats why i never tried it, I watched what happened to my friends, and then it crept into my family. I recently got back from Vegas. Its the first time i've seen so many people trashed and homeless in one place. And thats just one city. Its got to be stopped. Its no doubt going to bring us as a nation down. it already started and is growing stonger like a cancer. How many more generations do you think we have left? At the rate its going, we might have 4 or maybe 5 more befor the nation buckles. Were spending a lot of money on the drug wars, and we still have to support a growing nation with a new big home security bill. All I no is it looks like the human race is in a kind of trouble were not going to get out of.

My heart goes out for you. It seems like once you get caught into the legal web of justice you cant get out. The laws are so finely tuned that theres no monuverability. One mistake and thats it. If theres not another side to your story, then maybe you need a better lawyer. My boyfriend got caught selling in 1995, after that he changed his life around. He worked his 9-5 came home and was a father to our son. Now all of this mess has caught up with him and they locked him up last year. Sentenced to 11 years! :mad: So now he is in Indiana - I am in Arizona and he is locked up with murders and rapists and he has totally changed his life around. He does NOT belong in there. He has never been in any other trouble - no priors at all. I just don't get it. They are wasting millions of tax payers money for a man that has already learned his lesson to sit in prison depressed.

The use of intoxicating substances has been around for as long as people have. Noah is mentioned in the book of Genesis as making wine and getting drunk, leading to various embarrassments. Any number of ancient tombs in various parts of the world have been found to contain the dried substance of or the seeds of any number of intoxicating plants. And few anthropologists have ever written about a newly-discovered tribe without detailing the myriad ways in which they get high.

It is speculated by some that the fall of Rome and the craziness of some of its leaders may have been hastened by the practice of storing bad wine in lead-lined pots, which sweetened it but also rendered it poisonous. That does not equate to the present situation, where the major cost to society lies not in the use of the substances, but that the very possession of such substances can lead to incarceration for decades.

I quite agree--we cannot go on like this. We cannot continue to exist as a productive nation if we continue to imprison a larger percentage of the populace every day. Let those who commit genuine crimes while under the influence of any drug bear the responsibility for same. But we are fools to cram our prisons with people whose only crime may lie in having a pocketful of a weed that grows wild in 49 of the 50 states (and is routinely hothouse grown in Alaska).

It is not the substances that are wreaking havoc on society. It is our draconian response to those who use or merely possess them.

MONEY is the key to this issue; my children’s father was sentenced 15 years for unarmed robbery but was charged with 1st degree robbery. At the age of 64 he became highly addictive to OXY...legally given to him by a local physician, one that did not see him for 19 months, a local pharmacy that filled 2 scripts for 7 months, the same day every month and he was paying cash, than turned him in after he walked into a bank, unarmed, no coverings, left his checkbook on the counter, and fell going out of the bank, he was arrested 2 hours later. He thought he seen a sign that said free money, it said free checking. He has little memory of what happened, he didnt need the money, he was a home owner and had a nice retirment and was also on disablity, he lost everything AND his Children lost there father. We had to resort to a public defender, she offered nothing in his defense, and had no morals or ethics at all. A man that went into the navy at the age of 17, gave 5 years with an honorable discharge, than 2 yrs community college to become a very dedicated aircraft mech, 15 yrs to McDonald Douglas, and the last 10 years to Pemco Aerospace, at age 62 he took an early retirement due to a broken neck injury from a car accident in 89 and a lower spine injury due to a car accident in Jan 2003. No Prio Felonies, but seeking relief from pain put his future in the hands of his physician and now he will probly die in prison. He is 67 years old and looking at spending at least 10 more years in prison if he lives.
It is amazing that these pharmaceuticals and doctors are creating more drug addicts that any illegal drug in our history and yet it’s ok. Our Goverment is doing nothing. But filling our jails and prisons with legal criminals. They do not have to suffer the pain and issues we as families face when a family member becomes addicted. And try getting someone help if you have a limited income. Our daughter didnt have to go out into the streets to become an addict to Opiates. And let someone become a drug addict and there labled as worthless and should of known better. Why do they put a lable warning , this medication can become higly addictive, how ironic. I think these Doctors that are freely handing out these scripts without maintianing or doing any lab work to monitor these patients on these highly addictive drugs should also have to suffer the pain and separation we families have to live with every single day of not having our loved ones with us and especially knowing that we would not be facing this in our life’s if not for these man made legal drugs. My heart goes out to each and every family that has lost a loved one from death or prison from these legal addictions. It is a monster in our society and our prisons and jails are full of these types of people.

hbragdoll...WELL SAID!!!
It is true and very sad. The younger generation is also being affected by being prescribed controlled rx's.
It has already been statisically proven that children with ADHD are more predisposed to drug addiction, alcohol abuse and getting into trouble with the law.
I think many of these presecripiton drugs are definitely a gateway to the misuse of other drugs and alcohol at a young age.

Our youngest son was diagnosed with ADHD, we had him on and off medication. He couldn't tolerate ritalin, so they put him on a generic..... he was also told to be on during the school year and off during the summer. I guess back then they new less about ADHD. And yes, I was so darned naive.
As parents we already felt terrible medicating him, it was very controversial and still is, so we were very torn. We even took him off his meds. for a period of time hoping that maybe he would be able to compensate as he matured. Well once he got into middle school and high school he started to experiment and self medicate. Later his last year of high school his peditrician put him on vivance. It was supposedly less addictive, huh...right. Unbeknownst to us our son continued to drink and do drugs (mostly over the counter).

Dr.'s should take more responsibility when prescribing a controlled substances to teens and young adults.
We can all see that the government doesn't give a hoot once a person becomes addicted.
It's such a crazy cycle.

I'm so mad at myself as a parent! I feel like I contributed towards my son's addiction by having him on mood altering drugs at such a young age. HIND SITE SURE IS TWENTY, TWENTY.

You shouldnt be mad at urself. We also had a son with ADHD, and understand what you had to deal with. His issues started at the age of 5 and no one can truely understand what one lives with. I have seen this child hold his head and cry because he couldnt shut down. We didnt medicate him, best advice a doc gave us was when in Calif. He said our child was different, you cant change him but we could change our life style and help him learn and adjust with his issues instead of medicating him. He turned out to be a good kid, he is now 22, with 4 years Marine Corps behind him and 4 th year of college. We were one of the lucky ones with him, but blaming urself isnt right, u as many others followed the advice of a physican and put ur trust and faith in someone u belived in. As with so many legal drugs, alcohol, pain meds, medication for mental illness that are legal yet leave such a devastating and lasting effect on oneself and families, As for as our 21 year old daughter, she does suffer from Depression and being spoiled, she started stealing her dads meds, has tried commiting suiside several times, been in drug rehab, and now on probation. Her dad drank all his life, but worked everyday, never hang out at bars, and was a fuctional alcoholic, i have never seen such a change in anyone, until this wonderful so called pain mangement specialist started treating him with pain medication, even through two major accidents and long term healing, he never had any addiction issue with meds until oxy. Perdue the makers of oxy was fined 450,000 due to not allowing the public to know the addiction level of oxy , yet the gov still allows any physican to hand it out like candy. I truely hope your son and ur family find peace in this war on drugs this society faces today. But as I stated it starts with the drug makers, than the doctors, than jails, courts, prisions, rehabs, its just a HUGE MONEY SCAM...And our GOVERMENT is allowing it.

The drug war is filling our prisons with people that should be in rehab not prison. Then there is a crisis of overfilled prisons. These prisons should be for violent offenders, not addicts that need help.

Let me start by saying that I am not a drug addict, nor do I have any loved ones in prison. For that, I am very grateful. I'm just an ordinary taxpayer who is paying to incarcerate hundreds of thousands of people who do not belong in prison. It seems that we always need a boogie man, and drug addicts are an excellent target.

Addictions are a complicated problem, and I've never seen anything that suggests that locking people up does anything to solve it. About all the war on drugs seems to have done, is thrown away a lot of people who could probably be saved if we Americans thought that it was important to save them. If you want to talk about apathy, I cannot think of a more apathetic approach than simply branding people as being unworthy of being with the rest of us and locking them away in a place where they receive minimal treatment.

Even worse, upon their release we make it very hard for them to hold a decent job and stay clean. Those who do manage to stay straight are to be commended. Unfortunately, I think that they are the exception to the rule. Even with the best treatment, the vast majority of drug addicts relapse a few times. I don't think that drug use by itself should be a crime.

IMHO, prisons should be for people who commit violent acts that hurt people or to a lesser extent those who commit property crimes. It is estimated that 5.6 million Americans have served time in prison. That's roughly 1.8% of our population, or one in every 50 people. It is also far too many.

It costs about $20,000 to lock someone up for a year. I cannot help but wonder if that same amount of money spent treating addictions would do far more to help people and ultimately reduce property and violent crimes. Either way we are going to pay.

Every other week we try to vist my ex husband and the father of my children due to an addiction to oxy. He total lost his mind and freedom over trying to overcome pain from two auto accidents. He retired at the age of 62 and at 64 he walked into a bank thinking he seen a sign that said free money. Unarmed and no coverings and even left his checkbook lying on the counter, he got 15 years. We know he should be punished for his actions but after giving 5 years to the Navy and than 40 years as an aircraft mech, working on jobs with McDonald Douglas, Pemco, mostly gov contract work, a taxpayer and voter all his life, a good father and provider, a homeowner, a good retirment. He is going on over 2 years locked up behind bars and facing a sentence of 15. He is and was a good man, a good person, a good heart. He would have never taken anything from anyone in his whole life, never stole or hurt anyone. He aches to be home with his children. Even being on house arrest would not bother him at all, but we are not sure if we can achive this, we do have an attorney working on trying to get him home. We his family and friends and neighbors truely feel he will not go back to wanting anything in the form of oxy to treat his pain ever again, he says that in all his life he has never faced such a demon, nor allowed anything to over come him as this drug did. My heart goes out to each and every family that suffers these issues. I wished the goverment would step in and make a few changes to the way doctors can just hand out these harsh addicting drugs and the lack of maintaining and seeing there patients as they should, and that instead of prision a better way to reform and battle addictions. Its all bout Money....they say there is an issue with over crowding but we seem to see no change in the overflow in the system, and you are right, it takes taxpayers about 40 to 50 dollars a day to house an inmate. James sure has paid his way in taxes over his lifetime, but 15 years for unarmed and being under the care of a physican was a bit much.

you said it all MONEY !!! my son is in his late 20's and got almost 16 yrs in prison...
ON THIS 'DRUG WAR ' ! we don't help drug addicts we just lock them away in prison
for many years.......Greed and money is what all this is about,
This so called drug WAR is a lost war ..... It's time to make some changes on it
how can our prison's hold any more peolpe....
GOD BLESS I FEEL YOUR PAIN

Personally it gave me three years in prison, and has sent many of my friends and family to prison also. But drugs have ruined a lot of my friends/family's lives also. It is a tradeoff.

what has the " Drug War done for me " well I don't see where It has done to much to help anyone... it has hurt many more than it will ever help !! It's a war on people that helps no one. people are locked up for way to many yrs. family are hurt by it and it's more drugs on the st's than ever be-4 this so called WAR ON DRUGS ! has not stopped anything addicts are locked up most sold to pay for the drugs they used... I am in no way taking up for the use of drugs. But let's try to fix the problem... not lock them away with no help for 20 + years.... THIS IS A LOST WAR !! my son got almost 16 yrs in prison ... so 16 yrs in prison can help a person ? or will this much time hurt him more than help him...
lost just lost !!!

It's made me want to be a prosecutor. I think I would be fair in my pursuit of justice.

According to research it is not street drugs that is our issue today, are people that blind to think its only street drugs that are affecting this country. NO it is man made and approved by the goverment. LEGAL DRUGS, and to be honest, no one cares until they commit a crime, they dont even care if one dies from overdoses, its not there problem or loss. Do some research and see the billions of dollars that the drug compaines and goverment is making on legal drugs...You will be amazed. And as for as Justice,,,,it depends on the cash you can throw on an attorneys desk.....sad but true....