Was curious to see what if any of your lifers have a good or bad "rep" in prison.If it's dif from the outside world or no. Most lifers I have heard of have a "body" but that doesn't always mean people in prison fear them,depending on who etc. Bryan pointed out to me several guys one day who have a "body" in the VR and oddly they act most "normal"!!! Bryan had a pretty bad rep going in and now to people that KNOW him(he doesn't let many get close) he's a "good guy" but to others....."He 'whacked' his mom what makes you think he won't 'whack' you!" For some in there I understand they are NOTHING to him,but he has been staying out of trouble for over a year now;) And I have NEVER been afraid of him at all.

Mine has a good reputation, but it's for being upstanding and doing right by himself and others. I've read that people in for crimes like murder, or anything we out here would consider pretty crazy, get an automatic "rep" going in so that people leave them alone. That's probably because it's the same way we out here would feel about them-------if they did it to someone else, don't push them or they might get you too. Most people aren't in prison for violent crime, so they probably feel the same awe (only more so) of people who are in there for extreme crimes. If they're not in a death penalty state, then what has the person got to lose if they kill someone in prison? They can't do anything more to them than the LWOP they already have, right? Getting a good reputation in there for the average, non-violent prisoner is probably a result of minding their own business, repaying debts on time, and not messing with anyone else but also not allowing themselves to be messed with.

Having a "body" doesn't mean a person is abnormal. Serial killers are abnormal, but any one of us could kill once, given the right stresses and conditions. We might not think we could, but we could. Being under the influence of alcohol or drugs and given the right circumstance, it happens a lot more often than you think. Then the person ends up inside on a life sentence and there you are. They're a person like you or I who just snapped under duress and did a very serious crime.

I agree with you about any of us "freaking out" and doing something we never thought we could do. It happened to someone I know, now he's got LWOP for that sudden reaction.

It could just as easily be said that the only people who fear lifers are the ones without a life sentence. That goes for other inmates and staff. From the other side of it, ...if THAT's what keeps you out of (my) face and out of (my) way and out of (my) day... Go ahead... Be afraid that the moon follows you too.

I don't think that it's terribly constructive to compare notes on how to parse out the shades of pedestrian's fear of one lifer over another....or one inmates comfort level with another on principle of a crime that earned the life sentence.

These people live with eachother. They have no choice.
They find common ground or demilitarized zones, or settle on the virture of indifference to eachother.

Let me share some theory here with y'all. People actually suffer decency if they are shown it. Even the dreaded lifer.
I figured this out back in county jail. Instead of being on high alert about everything that walked in the door humping a bedroll, I took the high road. Adopted a policy I was willing to share then, and willing to share now.

People in jail are guilty of exactly one thing. Being Arrested. And it's a helluvalot easier to do THAT then most folks realize. People in prison are guilty of exactly one thing. Being sent to prison. And it's a helluvalot easier to do THAT then most folks realize.

Anyone, and everyone gets the benefit of that policy from jump. The only thing that has ever caused me to take a different tact toward someone is if they manage to prove to me (by the actions taken toward me or within range) that they are 1. a liar, 2. a thief, or 3. crazy. Those are the three things that'll roll up the welcome mat at my door.

The crimes that took folks in are left at the door, unless it serves the ghoulish need of someone to find a reason to continue to harass someone else. Folks just don't have the luxury of not managing to find some common ground, confining themselves to the present, or basing it on the past THEY have with eachother. Not the crime.

An opinion. Mine.

I like the way you look at things Life,though I have found things happen on the inside much the same as on the outside. You deal with people when you have to and keep to what you like/know as much as possible

My fiancee went in Prison in 1980. He was sentenced to 25-life but refused to accept his "situation" and gave the CO's and everyone else a hard time, even those who loved and cared about him. It took him 5 long years to settle down, accept responsibility for what happened to him, and do his time quietly. Now, 23 years later, he's everyone's therapist. hahahha. Some inmates tell me they cant believe the person he has become over the years. I tell them to tell the Prison Board that so he can come home where he belongs. (smile)!

My old man has a reputation as being one bad M*@!)?! F*!@ going in and to this day. Got popped for a double 187 & 2 attempted cause those one survived & testified But they didn't last much longer than the trial. He doesn't fill me in with details. they can't...safer for me. I just think it's a choice of life they want to lead. Alot of you women sound so naive. Is it that this is the first time your boyfriends got time?
and when they were out & were getting into trouble did you not know about his criminal activities or what type of buddies he ran with? Or even your own lifestyle weren't any of you part of the criminal element some time in your life? Not only this forum in most of them it seems that way. It trips me out sometimes. Makes me laugh.

Laughter is great, isn't it? I don't prefer to laugh at other people's expense, but a good laugh is a good thing usually. What you don't seem to take into account is that no-------not everyone was part of the criminal element their loved ones were into. In fact, most probably weren't. There are a lot of people locked up who weren't into that, either, till what happened that got them locked up. I respect your right to have pride in your man's bada** rep and to have been or still to be a part of the "criminal element" because it takes all of us to make the world and you have a right to your choices. I'm sure there are other people here who identify with you. But I think you should return that respect to those who haven't got your same experience. And we also have to give respect to those who might be in denial. There's not a human alive who isn't in denial about something.

I personally admire and respect a person who goes in bada** and then has the strength of character to make some changes so that they become strong and respected for being wise enough to see where they could improve. Being feared is not being respected. The person who believes they have to keep others at bay through fear is one scared person themselves.

Once again, toi_ama has very sensible words.

My fiance went in as one bad man and, because of something that happened while he was inside, ended up on the Row and that changed his life. He's the first to admit that being on Death Row actually saved his life, without that he would have died on the streets. I, too, admire a person who is big enough to admit the life they were leading wasn't necassarily the best and change.

I do have experience of the 'criminal element' but from the other side. I worked for the Probation Service over here and saw all sorts of people passing through. Some I knew I'd only see the once, others I expected to spend most of their lives in prison, if they didn't die on the streets in the meantime. What a waste of life!!

Rose

I am far from naive about human behavior and find it difficult to accept that someone would consider the fact that their boyfriend is "one bad M*@!)?! F*!@ " as a source of pride. Whether or not we had knowledge of our loved ones' behavior prior to their arrest is a moot point. If we did, does it, or did it, make any diference? Naivete has nothing to do with anyone's attitude or perpception on PTO. This is not a contestant forum to see whose loved one did the worst thing, or who's doing the most time, etc. It's about understanding and support and caring and informing and learning how to live our day to day lives with as much of our sanity intact as possible. We support our incarcerated loved ones and encourage them to use the time behind bars as productively as possible so they don't end up there again, and so they have a better chance at rebuilding their lives after release. Prison shouldn't be another "contest." In too many instances, it's that attitude of "being the baddest" (or "the dumbest") that got them there in the first place......

Never said I was proud of it nor was bragging about it just stating a fact anyone street smart knows you don't get respect from making people afraid of you. people like that don't live long enough to get respect that way. You can't bluff something like that!...come on. Like I said in the first place it's a choice of the kind of life you want to live! Just to clarify I asked weren't any of you aware of the kinds of friends your boyfriends ran around with? or what he himself was into?
More power to all your boyfriends that take thier 1st incarceration experience to come out a better person and never go back. Good Luck to you all!
P.S. As far as living day to day with as much sanity as possible. If you are going to stand by your man then
YOU JUST DO IT!!... Just like they have too... THEY JUST DO IT! and by the voters poll doesn't look like it's all that easy does it??

((with respect to the original thread starter...I'm going to make this off topic point and bow out...)))

Pilgrim, I see from your profile you have a 'lot of friends' inside, so I'm not entirely certain who's experience you are talking about in this thread.. I will mention that this thread is in the Lifer's forum, and continued reference to
"More power to all your boyfriends that take thier 1st incarceration experience to come out a better person and never go back. Good Luck to you all!" leads me to believe that you didn't know what forum you were posting in.

Catchy thread titles, and polls seem to bring all folks by..
But the first rule of good theatre is Know Your Audience.

This poll, and thread wasn't meant to survey every person doing every sort of tiny time any way they can. It is in the Lifer's forum.

Here is the link to the "sticky' Mission Statement/Intro for this forum
http://www.prisontalk.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=25264
It might be worth a read.

-Life2thesequel, Moderator

I was addressing DeNada's post.

My fiance went in to the State pen 12 years ago. He went in as a gang member from Cali. We live in Nebraska. He went in the first day on the yard as the new mexican kid. He is serving life from a murder charge he didn't commit. Anyhow back to the point, he fought his way into respect from everyone on the yard and now this institution is a lot different from the way it used to be. But he isn't the big man on the yard anymore. Time changed that. He was 19 when he went in. He turns 31 at the end of this month and he is respected from the staff and the other inmates. I guess he learned something from all of the fighting. When he hit the hole for the last time in the early 90's for something of the sexual nature he found that turning his life over to God would be a good thing. From then on, no more fighting, no more nonsense. He is a good man. It is amazing what a little time will do to make a person change.

My brother who is doing life for murder, murdered again in the first few years he was in. He has a good reputation and great respect from his peers. Many people look up to him inside. Not at all because they consider his a badda$$ either. Because he is very smart. He is considered the jailhouse attorney and he is the one they go to with their questions.
Just because you committed a violent crime (or two) does not mean you are a badda$$. And, just because we love them and support them does not make us naive.

He said he was a "PUNK" when he was out doing bad things and had some major bad habits,he said if he was still "outside" and had never got caught he'd still be a PUNK! Because his family didn't care enough to do what it took to teach him discipline and they're all paying the price now :rolleyes: But he said while he wishes he were out and hopes to be one day. It took prison to make him realize a few things. And he has matured and grown up some he is making choices and working hard to be a better person now and to leave that lifestyle completely behind him when he's out.

well , 19 years ago my friend received life , he came home this past april ,
he went in va doc , running things , and yeah he was a bad a** ,
year after year m, he was moved here and there , i swear he was in every joint va has ,
he always wondered why parole was denied again and again ,
well once he dropped the bad boy routine , i suppose he was known by now , so he was okay ,
he got paroled , hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

WELL I RECEIVED TWO LETTERS TODAY FROM LIFERS THAT SAY THEY DEFINITELY ARE BETTER NOW.

Bryan's implied this too,jail stopped him when nothing else would,sad that it has to be this way sometimes!

My loved one has been serving a life sentence for twenty years now. He went in with the wrong attitude thank god he changed it fourteen years ago. He has often told me that prison has saved his life and is truly a blessing. Being the way he was back then by now if he wasn't in prison I would be taking flowers to his grave. Just the thought of that helps the both of us get through this time together. He went in as a very imature twenty year old young man. At the age of fourty he is a strong black man emotionally,mentally and spiritually. He gets me through a lot of difficulties that I face. I can say that I drive of of his strenght.


SisterSoul

Les has been in for 26 years; but he's an ex-Marine & stays in shape. The only things he's told me about that would indicate what his reputation might be is that he's been asked to look after men when they transfer to the prison he's in (as a favor to someone he knows in other prisons) & that he never locks his footlocker & has never been stolen from. My guess is he's well-respected.

Adrienne

Bryan has given protection to some as well that needed it and it has helped him and them in other ways too:)

All I can say is this: I am hoping and praying that with time.. my wild man will become tamed :)) and therefore earn parole.. or first be moved to a diffrent prison . I use to say things like can't you just be good.. why do you have to always get into the :"mix " of things. and he would say it;'s not alwways that easy Donna, prison.. is prison.. and sometimes you are just there wrong place wrong time.. bad attitude cops.. what ever.. it is a very hard way to live
I have noticed a change in my baby.. though he really seems to want to move on.. even though he is facing LWOP, he i s trying to remain positive.
SO to answer question it has taken about 20 years but i belive my babys rep for being wild is calming down.. as he says he is getting older now:)) also he never went in as a tough guy.. he was too young..

Donna

my man has the same in/out. don't f--k with me and i won't with you.
the "nature of his crime, i hate that statment" it happend in a moment of panic. he still can' belive he did it. he did'n go to trial he just pleaded guilty. after 31 years he is still the same person

Why do these threads keep floating to the top as new posts when they haven't been posted in for months? This one is a little bit more recent, but I've seen several and they're pretty old, usually.

Because someone must have voted on the poll.

My guy is a lifer and I was just having a conversation with a friend about this. I am sure lifer's get a lot of respect over here. Not so much for the crime they did but more because of the long amount time they have been inside and its seems like a type of hierarchy system. I never feel the need to worry about my mans safety as Im pretty sure no one would ever touch him. Anway he's done 12 years so he's big enough to look after himself! I can sense though that he doesnt have much time for short-laggers. In saying this however I know that one of his other lifer mates recently got a hiding but we have no idea what for yet. Love and respect to all the partners of lifers, Sandy

Retired-1 reflects the attitude I most find in practicing and ex cons. That idea is that respect generally earns respect, or in the case of those who have yet to be taught respect, if you come lookin' for trouble you are likely to be obliged,on the inside. I know guys who have done real hard time that I would trust alot quicker than most who have been on the inside short-term. Never judge a man by his crime, but by his heart I was once told. I have always known my friends crimes, nomatter what they were, but I have never looked away from thier eyes, in knowing the rest of the world would want to condemn them to hell. I believe that alot of people need to examine the true content of thier own heart, before declaring any man unredeemable. Some of the best hearts I have found in this world have belonged to men whose lives did not seem to reflct any sort of goodness at all. Many things influence a man's life and seldom, even the crime of murder, is simply murder as the system wants us to believe. No, I make excuses for noone, but neither do I make judgements without knowing the facts. One of the people I have held dear to my heart as a friend for 27 or so years served 18 years for the death of a gaurd in a bank robbery, in his youth.When he went through a divorce I had no qualms about him staying in my home. And I found it down right funny others feared him. He did have his line and if a man passed they had gone to far, but if treated with respect he returned the same.He passed away this year and I do sorely miss him. He was my mentor in many ways, though by his death he had spent more than 30 years total in corrections units. It was never meanness, just not being able to deal with a society that attempts to make men like him less than.As for a reputation in prison, respect does not come free inside or out, it is earned. A man's reputation on the inside has nothing to do with the crime or the time. The man that goes in thinking he will be big dog in the pen, is likely to learn of respect the hard way, I am told. While, the guy that goes in and conducts his business like a man will find his place and at least as much sanity as those kennels allow.

My guy has gotton in trouble but once it was because the CO's played that lil game of popping the wrong door. He has much respect but always has. He does the whole jailhouse lawyer thing too. He has matured alot, I can say that much. Im proud of his positive changes.

My hun is a very respectful guy and in return, alot of people even CO's respect him. It's the way he carries himself and he has a heart inside too even though he doesnt show it, he has a way. Even though he is wrongfully convicted, this is not the first time he's been in prison. Before he was arrested, he was turning over a new leaf with a new job, a new home, and reconnecting with his family and swore off bad things. Even when he was awaiting trial, he has told me many times that god has brought him in there to keep him alive and to learn from his past situations and god brought him in there for a reason, one of which was to meet his soulmate (ME!!!!). We are fighting every step of the way to prove his innocence and will do everything in our power to. But in the 5 years I have been with him, he has become more man to me than ever, he really matured alot and I am so proud of him.