Hi Fellow Australian PTO members :D

Seenitall is new to PTO, and he has offered to answer any questions anyone has. He is a correctional officer in one of the prisons in Australia, I have talked to him, and he is family oriented, and understands the pressures that having a loved one in prison holds upon us all.

I am starting a thread, where he has offered to answer any questions that we all have about inside Australian prisons. Please remember, although Seenitall works in a prison, he is here to offer us all support.

Seenitall, Welcome to PTO :D Its great to have you here, and thanks for your offer. :)

Thankyou Kyla for the support


I am happy to help with general questions but cannot obviously answer questions of Operational issues relating to any prison

So people how can I help

Thanks for the warm welcome!!

Hey Seenitall
I was wondering what kind of rehab programs they do actually do in the prisons, and does it knock any time of the prisoners sentence?

hello and welcome , just a question do Australian prison guard use "use of force " on the inmates ?

Kyla thank you for your question ,unexpected thanks

Prisoners upon reception are given what is called a Tier 1 assessment.
This assessment identifies the nature of the crime committed and the reasons behind it . when a prisoner is transfered to another prison , the officer in charge of their case load can access the Tier 1 assessment and together with the prisoner develop a sentence plan.

In years gone by the Parole board would seek advise from the Divisional Governor as to the progress of the prisoner however in most cases the Governor would not even know the prisoner and had to rely on hearsay.

Now the Parole board has access to what is called the prisoners Individual Management Plan which is a binder updated by the case officer once a month detailing the prisoners behavior program participation etc:

Recently the Board have refused to grant Parole to prisoners who have refused to comply with the recommendation of the Tier 1 Assessment and the Case Officers recommendations. Unfortunately prisoners don't take it seriously but find out at the end that it does effect their Parole..

To answer your question , Program participation play's a major role in reducing a prisoners sentence.

Caskaz

Yes it true

Correctional officers at times have to use force to maintain the good order and security of the prison. It is used as an option of last resort unless the situation calls for immediate action to preserve life.

The amount of force applied is only as much as is necessary to acheive the objective and believe me I hate it , but we have a job to do and if it means that force needs to be applied to prevent loss of life on either side , I will order it.

Thanks for explaining that to me.
With the force thing, I know officers in QLD are trained now not to use force, but to try to calm a situation verbally, and with warning. I guess if put in danger though, yourself, the prisoner, and the people that are in the prison, things could get tough. I hear alot as well, that the prisoners try and do "stand overs" and not really knowing alot about it, I would say that would be an awful situation to be in. !!!

Thankyou Kyla for your question

When I started in the system , officers didn't care what happened to inmates it was keep them behind the walls thats all.

Now Correctional Officers roles have changed and we have progressed from being the thug to a very professional organisation made up of people from a wide range of backgrounds. And contrary to popular belief their is alot of people who care.

Kyla, training is one thing and base grade recruits are taught different ways of approaching a situation to resolve conflict, but you can't get it out of a book.
I tell my prisoners "Do you know who teaches and officer to be a good officer, its you it not the officers" my prisoners have adopted this and believe me the change has been remarkable , hardly any incidents , staff and prisoners happy its great.

In other units , its hell, but there is nothing I can do about it , I concentrate on my own and it is not suprising that my unit is where 90% of the prisoners want to be , they don't have to look over their shoulder they are relaxed when talking to staff and everything is great.

In relation to standovers , yes its true and this applies to canteen items in the main but can extend to sexual favours. It is unfortunate but it does happen and we try to stop it but it is so wide spread. I have tried to create an environment in my unit which is safe from this type of behaviour and because I have older time prisoners it is working because they don't like it either.

Hope I have answered you question.

thankyou for answering my question ... I have so many i would like to ask but Im not sure where to start as Im still learning about all of this ..


Do we in Australia have "lockdown" and 23 hours in a cell like they do in States

Thankyou for your questing

Yes we do have 23 hour lockin's but this is entirely voluntary.

What I mean by that is that prisoners can elect to go 23 hour lockin if they don't want to go on a protection regime, ie: don't want to be labled a dog.

The second situation for 23 hour lockin's is where the powers to be consider that they pose a substantial security risk , which can be seen in relation to the gang killings spree in Australia at the moment.

Hope this answers you question

Caskaz

I couldn't edit my previous post on 23 hour lockins and I forgot to add this information.

There one more situation where a prisoner can be confined for 23 hours a day that being "LOP" or Loss of Privileges. This normally occurs when a prisoner has breached a prison regulation and LOP has been imposed by a Governors Disciplinary hearing.

The amount of time a prisoner in confined in isolation is determined by the Governor hearing the charge.

thankyou so much for answering that , this is a more personal question , I've been reading alot about amercian Jails , do you believe in the death sentance ? do you think it should be brought into Australia .. Me i personally don't but just wanting to know your thoughts ..

Caskaz

No I don't believe in the death penalty and I would not personally support a move in that direction if it was ever proposed for Australia.

The last man hanged in Victoria was Ryan , and I read everything I could about it and I stood in the division at the very spot where he had stood before they ended his life . I have to tell you honestly , on what I read in relation to his trial and what happened after in relation to the officers who killed himself over it , I would have to say in my opinion Ryan was innocent.

And there is the problem for me , what if we take the life of someone who is innocent . How do you repair the damage, you can't!!!!, what do we tell that persons family "Oh bad luck we made a mistake, we are sorry , here is a few bucks that should make you feel better"

The courts imposes a sentence because they believe that the person has committed an offence and the evidence has proven guilt, but how many times have we read later that the person was indeed innocent and so there is a chance of a mistake and when we are talking about a persons life , I wouldn't take the risk or forever have that persons blood on my hands. NO THANKS!!!

Hope this answered your question , it was great to hear from you.

It sure does and i agree ... thankyou once again :)

Seenitall, you sound like a reasonable guy but sorry, my experience with CS is far different. I no longer have any respect at all for people who wear the uniform. I've known too many offciers who actually spread rumours and try to cause fights between inmates rather than assisting in "rehabilitation". I found out, for example, that two female officers at Mulawa CC were leaking out personal information about me and had cut out a newspaper clipping of my court case and had passed it around to other inmates, after I had been processed from Brady RAP to Teresa's, telling the inmates (quote) "She isn't a nice person she makes out to be" (even though I had not been convicted of anything). Luckily the other inmates caught on to what they were doing and had warned me about what was happening. I immediately asked to be transferred to Emu Plains and was moved from Mulawa three days later.

It's true what inmates say: "When you wear the green they never forget you". I've been back visiting friends in Emu Plains and Mulawa and the officers there always treat you like you're still an inmate even though you've done your time and in my case, been found not guilty of any serious charge. My running sheet while doing time was clean but that doesn't make any difference at all.

This is just a friendly reminder of PTO policies. Can we please keep this thread on topic, for questions in the Australian prison system and answers :)
Thanks


• Police/Guard/Correction Officer Bashing:
While we encourage full disclosure, investigation and the sharing of relevant information relating to abuses by Institutional staff (management, guards, jailers, CO’s,etc), blatant and unprovoked bashing of these people is not allowed. Please refrain from derogatory name calling as well. Further, it is a violation of PTO membership to go to any forum or site (ETC) where Correctional Officers are known to congregate and incite problems that may follow you back to the PTO website. If it is found that any member of PTO has gone to another website and created a problem, that then follows them back to our community, that member will be banned immediately.

It's true what inmates say: "When you wear the green they never forget you". I've been back visiting friends in Emu Plains and Mulawa and the officers there always treat you like you're still an inmate even though you've done your time and in my case, been found not guilty of any serious charge. My running sheet while doing time was clean but that doesn't make any difference at all.



Hi!! MEDEA

Thankyou for your question and your compliment

In answer to your question , Yes its true.
Officers can remember prisoners that they have met years before as a matter a fact I saw a fellow at a Melbourne trains station that I hadn't seen for over 20 years , and although the name escaped me at that moment I did remember him none the less.

Having said that, In your case the reason that they remembered you was because of something you did or said or maybe the problem was on their side ,without knowing the full story I can't really comment further other than to say it appears their thoughts of you at that time appear to have been negative in nature.

This doesn't happen all the time and based on my own personal experience In most cases where a prisoner has been returned to custody and the relationship between him and you has been good when the visitors come in they are happy to see you again and you them probably not the best environment to meet again but you would be suprised how many strike up great relationships with staff , it doesn't need to be "Us and Them"

In the case of an ex-prisoner visiting , of course they would be treated with more supicision than a normal visitor , I am sure before you went there to visit you would have had that very thought in your mind.

Over time those officers will have left the service and been replaced with others and if the visit had of happen then ,no one would have blinked an eyelid except maybe in relation to your previous Crn:

This also applies to female or male staff who have left the service because they have form a deep relationship with a prisoner and then return to visit them, they also would be treated with suspicion more than the average visitor.

Thankyou so much for your question , I hope there are more

Wow i have just read all this and once again very interesting stuff and good learning but can i ask?Do all jails have different rules and regulations from stae to state if so are they pretty much on par with the rules with other jails?

This would be so confusing for the inmate that gets shipped around getting used to one set of rules then having to learn a new set...

Thankyou for your question chezza

If you are talking about a prison within a particular state the answer would be yes they would have the same rules to a point. The rules of a prison are determined according to to the classification ie:Maximum, Medium, Minimum. Each prison may vary their own rules but must stay within the legislation for that particular state. In addition the Department responsible for administering prisons for that state would be setting the paramiters that the prisons must work within.

If you are talking about different states then the answer would be no because they would have different legislation to follow, but even so generally speaking most prisons would have significant similarties with it other .

Hi Seenitall

It is fantastic to see an officer who is willing to listen and respond to questions from people that are not sure of the rules and regulations.
My fiance is in Port Phillip at the moment, and it is his 4th time in the system..he has been to Fulham, Loddon, Map also in his time. Petty charges, but still in there none the less.

Just to let people know, that the systems are VERY different in each state of Australia. So what may apply for one state will not necessarily mean it will be the same in others.
Everything from visits, phone calls, what you can and can't send in and more are different in each victorian prison.

Seenitall, you may or may not be able to answer this...but why is there still so many drugs getting into prisons?? I realise that bodily seaches for inmates are done after each visit etc, but drugs are still rampant in every jail and used as power and stand offs between inmates. Are calls monitored regulary etc?
What do you think personally is the solution? Proper internal searches?? No contact during contact visits??
It is sad to see that most offenders are in for drug related problems, yet nothing changes when they are inside.
You insight would be appreciated.

Hi Mella thanyou for your question

I agree with you that Drugs in prison are a big problem with every correctional facility trying to stamp it out. Yes it has a lot to do with violence inside and standovers a real big problem.

The Prison system in Victoria currently has what is called the Victorian Drug strategy which requires random and targeted Urinalysis testing across the board to identify those who are taking drugs and this then leads to further targeting of prisoners and their, mail , visitors , phone calls etc:. Law enforcement officers are also notified to monitor activities on the outside as well.

At least 80% of crimes now are drug related crime and the prison runs various programs to help a prisoner kick the habit so to speak and to assist them by way of substitution therapy "Methodone and Buphrenorphine".

The Drug strategy has also changed of late , it was found that the sanction imposed were having the reverse effect , that is the prisoners were going for the harder drugs to prevent detection and this is not what we sought so now Cannabis use whilst still and banned substance has lessor penalties that those for harder drugs.

The prison runs drug free units, where prisoners who want to make the break can apply to reside there , any prisoner returning a positive result in these units are transfered to other units.

My own view is that we will not be able to stop it , now they want to ban smoking which will only make Marijuana use more attractive, all that we can do is what we are doing at the moment and try to draw to the attention of others not to bring in drugs.

Clearly prisons cover a large area where drugs can be hidden or just thrown over the wall , but a lot are recovered from visitors and some time staff. Its an ongoing battle and one I don't think we will win , Cannabis has been around for how long, have the authorities been able to stop it , No!!! just moved it underground just like the prohibition days with alcohol never suceeded then won't suceed now all we can do is try and curb it's use inside that all.

Hi Seenitall
I don't know if you know the answer to this, as I know you are from a different state. My bf is C2 and was in minimum security. He was charged with a prison infringement, about a month ago and sent back into medium security. Since then he has heard nothing. What usually happens in a situation like this? Is there a time limit in which this is addressed, he hasn't even been asked whether he pleads guilty or not guilty.

Secondly I would like to find out about the parole process, any suggestions, where I might get some infomation.

Thanks

In the prisons where I was in urinalysis was a regular thing, they got me on the last day I was in Arthur Gorrie, at the worst possible time - just after morning unlock. I objected mildly, and was rebuffed not so mildly. I knew a guy who got put up on a charge for taking Temazapam when he was not prescribed it. What had happened was he was given it in the watchhouse to help him sleep because he was going nuts. It took a month to sort it all out, and all the time he had the DU hanging over his head, and wanting to get parole in a few months time. It all got sorted out in the end fortunately.

I heard stories from my parents of people waiting in line to come in for visits and doing a runner when they brought the sniffer dogs around. Mostly however, they just used a 'sniffer chamber' - a concept that wasn't fully explained to me. They did catch quite a few people. I knew a number of people who couldn't receive visits from certain people because of their drug usage. Which is kind of sad... deep down.

I know with people that visit that have either had drug charges against them, or have been involved with a drug crime with the person, that they can only visit non contact, and not allowed contact visits.

Also, parol, Indeep or seenitall would know more. They normally classify them within the first week of being in prison, and offer a deduction on their sentence, so say if they have 2 years, they will say something like, do this course, behave in prison and you will only have to do 18 months.

Hi Seenitall
I don't know if you know the answer to this, as I know you are from a different state. My bf is C2 and was in minimum security. He was charged with a prison infringement, about a month ago and sent back into medium security. Since then he has heard nothing. What usually happens in a situation like this? Is there a time limit in which this is addressed, he hasn't even been asked whether he pleads guilty or not guilty.

Secondly I would like to find out about the parole process, any suggestions, where I might get some infomation.




Hi Positive

Thankyou for your question

It appears from what you have told me that our state is in fact run along the same lines. If your boyfriend was a C2 prisoner and he has been cited for a breach of prison regulations , yes he would be returned to medium security and his C2 classification removed.

If the offence was serious ,he will in time be charged with the prison offence and face a Governors hearing , having said that the penalty I would suggest would be a Reprimand given that he has lost his minimum security placement and his C2 rating. The authorities however may not decide to charge him for the same reason hard to know without further information relating to the offence committed.

A removal of a C2 rating for your boyfriend is serious because this information will be considered by the Parole board as a breach of trust and may have an effect on possible Parole,especially if it was drug related.

What will happen now is he will have to start again so to speak, that is he will be asked to do certain courses, remain incident free for a period normally ( 3 ) months and must not return a positive urinalysis result. He would normally then be given an opportunity to apply for a C1 rating and move to Minimum again but under tighter control and if his leave programs were cancelled he will have to go through the whole process of escorted leaves again and open camp placement might be restricted.

As to Parole , there are information sheet made available to you by the Board itself, just write to them and ask for one, but the board always looks at the following points as a general rule of thumb:

1. Nature of Offence
2. Minimum Term or Non Parole Period
3. Program Participation to address offending behaviour
4. Incidents whilst incarcerated
5. Past History (Offences)
6. Past Paroles granted
7. Urinalysis results
8. General prison behaviour
9. Support network ( Family & friends etc:)
10. Accomodation for release
11. Incomes support upon release

Hope this helps

Seenitall

Thank you Seenitall, it makes things so much easier when you know what is going on. As my bf doesn't get told things and I find it hard to find information, I get all worked up and frustrated and the answer is simple. The offence was having too much food and tobacco from the buy, so I guess as it is not drug related or violent it is not too serious. Anyway thanks again, the info on parole was also helpful.

Hi Seenitall


Just womdered what it means in jail terms when someone is put in the slow, what happens, why etc
also why people get moved to another jail after they've already been sentenced.

thanks in advance.

Hi Mella

Thankyou for your question

I think you mean "Slot", A prisoner can be put in the slot for a number of reason as follows:

Diciplinary reasons, the prisoner may have been put under a period of loss of privileges for breaching regulations , this means that they are kept in solitary confinment for the time specified, no smoking,limited exercise and no contact with any other prisoner.
Protection reasons, the prisoner may be placed in the slot if there has been a threat to his life by other inmate/s and he is kept there until other housing can be arranged normally at another location.
Investigation, A prisoner may be placed in isolation after being accused of some serious offence ie: the stabbing or harm of another prisoner or assault on staff.
Duty of Care, the prisoner may have attempted self harm or suicide and as such is placed in the slot and placed under close obs.
As to your question about being transfered, it could be that the prisoner falls within one of the above categories or the classification panel believe he would be more suited in another facility which could cater better in relation to program needs. It may be that the prison is full and other due to arrive with a higher security rating which means they would move others to different locations to make room.

Hope this answers your questions.

Regards
Seenitall

Hello, Nice to hear of someone wanting spend the time answering questions that are hard to get honest answers of. If my man in WCC does all that is asked of him, will he get granted his parole on his 1st application? He learning as much as he can about himself & helping his fellow inmates in a positive way. He has not had any breaches & is working now as 1st cook for the officers. he so wants to get to a farm asap.
thank you
sandy

Hi Sandy,

I have to be honest with you, parole is a bit dodgy, and the rumour around WCC was that no one gets it on their first time. If anyone deserves to get Parole it's Joe, that's for sure. But there seems to be an unwritten rule that no one gets parole on their first attempt. Unlike other states, there is no such thing as "truth in sentencing" in Queensland - which basically means you have to be released at your minimum date, unless there are extenuating circumstances.

Getting to a farm is a somewhat slow process, because you have to be reclassified as open, before you are eligible, and sentence management reviews (SMRs) only take place every 3 or 6 months (I can't remember which one it is) so it takes a while for the cogs of bureaucracy to move.

I was an Open in Wolston - I chose to stay there rather than go to the farm because I only had a few weeks left to go when they offered it to me. I didn't want to change facilities because I didn't know anyone at the Farm, and I was happy enough in Secure. I know they were trying to empty all of the Open classifications out of Wolston because Arthur Gorrie (the remand and reception centre) was full. When I left Wolston, there was 87 people shacked up in a block at R&R designed to hold 52... It's ridiculous.

I really wish Joe the best of luck. Maybe the system will grow a heart. :)

Dave

Hello, Nice to hear of someone wanting spend the time answering questions that are hard to get honest answers of. If my man in WCC does all that is asked of him, will he get granted his parole on his 1st application? He learning as much as he can about himself & helping his fellow inmates in a positive way. He has not had any breaches & is working now as 1st cook for the officers. he so wants to get to a farm asap.
thank you
sandy
Hi Sandy , sorry for the delay in responding

From what you have told me he would normally be in the best position for Parole and whilst I cannot really comment on what the Parole board normally feels is appropriate for first timers in Queensland , I can say he is in a better position than most. One other thing that should be considered would be the Prison Governors recommendation which may effect the decision of the board and further if the prison population is busting at the seams it would also be a consideration of the board whether to keep him in or not. Dependant as to how far his is away from his minimum term will also determine whether he would be considered for an open camp environment. Given what you have told me though he is doing really well and once he reaches that point in his sentence he would be considered for open camp, no doubt about that.

Hope this helps

Seenitall

HI, Thanks for that. All info is much appreciated. There are so many things to concider I guess. He is trying to take it all on board & take what comes as calmly as he can. Trying not to take what he hears as gospel as well. At least we can talk on the phone, he calls me twice a week, first thing in the morning...thats if the phones aren't down! We are both learning patience..Ha Ha!
Thanks
Sandy

Hi MadeinOZ, Thank you for you info, did you ever meet Joe? How did you cope with the 2hourly lookins by the officers at night? ie. broken sleep? Do you ever get used to that? It seems like torture to me. I didn't like it when I was in hospital for a month! How is you job going too? Hope you are able to cope with the freedom of doing what you like when you like.
sandy

Hi Sandyg

Just was wondering. In Victoria, do you prepay their calls, here in Queensland, every week I put money on a phone account, and then seperate for his comissary. I was lucky the calls were local (40c) he had to approve me for his phone list, then had a pincode to use in the phone, then dialled a number (whatever number I was on his list), and it dialled straight through. I was wondering if its the same in all states in Australia, it was a really good system, now I am getting calls from the USA, and they are outrageous with there reverse charge rates there. I was hoping that it was like it was in QLD in all states in Australia, as you can put on their phone account what you can afford each week. I was lucky I found a company I can prepay calls in the US, but I have read in the phone forums here about the ladies in the US phone bills. :(

Just was wondering. In Victoria, do you prepay their calls, here in Queensland, every week I put money on a phone account, and then seperate for his comissary. I was lucky the calls were local (40c) he had to approve me for his phone list, then had a pincode to use in the phone, then dialled a number (whatever number I was on his list), and it dialled straight through.

The method you have described is the same in Victoria, with one difference.
The prisoner is the only one who can put monies on the phone which is done by way of application to his respective manager or via canteen day.

The prisoner must place you on his phone list and the number must be verified by staff prior to you becoming an active phone listing.

The prisoner is allowed additional monies which can be sent in from the outside one a month to assist with the cost of phone calls and this amount does vary from prison to prison.

The funny thing is the whole verification of phone numbers is a bit dodgy. I had several blokes who would get wrong numbers put onto their account, either which they had written down wrong, or what have you. So I don't know who they thought they were talking to, or who the person on the other end imagined might be calling them. :P Very odd. We could have up to $100 in our phone account if I remember correctly.

Hi Kyla, No I don't put any money in his account. He wont let me. Joe actually sends me a liitle money, also his Mum. He says he doesn't need any extras, he doesn't smoke & he works as a cook..so the food he has is better. Becouse I am in another state I guess the time on the phone is shorter for the money spent. We laugh & joke & get very soppy...if anyone is listening they must get sick of it..Ha Ha! I tend to keep anything I want to get serious about for the once a day letters. But he can tell by my voice how I am. I was in hospital last year before he went in. He took such good care of me when he was with me. He worries that I'm doing too much. I try to see him every 3mths or so & he knows how much it costs me to do that, even though I have such wonderful supportive friends in Brisbane. It is wonderful that he can call me & we both look forward to those mornings when we can chat. He also calls just to leave a loving message when he knows I've been away or returning home from seeing him. My kids do that for me as well just to let me know they are thinking of me....so sweet.
Sandy

Hi Seenitall, Sorry another question that some else in the USA asked & I wonder if it applies here.
Does it make any difference to my Joe's parole release if I write to the parole board & let them know that I there for him when he is released? (in Brisbane)
Is there anything I can do to help other than support by letters & visits when I can? Do they take note of what we write & say to each other? Or they only looking for the bad things said. Haven't said anything bad but do they look for that & not the positive things.
Thank you for all your answers
Sandy

Ack, sorry Sandy, I didn't notice your questions before... The two hour look ins weren't too bad, I had a light on outside my cell all night anyway, so there really wasn't that much difference. I had trouble sleeping anyway, and most of the time I slept during the day when the workers went out and there was little else to do. I regularly spent all night writing.

I don't smoke, so it was never really a problem for me, but other guys who smoked in their cells - using a variety of innovative lighting methods - had to be careful they didn't get caught. Most of the time the screws would just wave at them, and tell em not to do it again, but it certainly did make for interesting stories. I knew one guy who was smoking in bed, and he fell asleep, and set his blanket on fire... :P A little off topic, I know.

Yes I did meet Joe, as I think I said in another thread, I spent a couple of weeks or so in the induction unit at WCC with him, before I got moved on to another unit. I can't recall really spending that much time talking with him, but I did get put off playing Scrabble with him. :)

At the moment I am still looking for a job, which is very slow, and somewhat depressing at times. I've been keeping busy doing stuff for my brother's wedding, which is coming up this weekend, which is one of the reasons why I haven't been around a lot lately. Before I left prison, I had made all of these plans to do things, and then when I was about to leave, I kind of went "You know, I'll probably end up sitting on my butt and doing none of these". Which has happened to some extent, but I have done a lot of the things I said I would - like going away, and getting in contact with some old friends I hadn't talked to in ages - it's just taken a bit of time to get back into the swing of things. I think that even once you leave prison, you tend to find a new cage of your own choosing.

The outside world is a wwonderful place nonetheless.

Hi Seenitall, Sorry another question that some else in the USA asked & I wonder if it applies here.
Does it make any difference to my Joe's parole release if I write to the parole board & let them know that I there for him when he is released? (in Brisbane)
Is there anything I can do to help other than support by letters & visits when I can? Do they take note of what we write & say to each other? Or they only looking for the bad things said. Haven't said anything bad but do they look for that & not the positive things.
Thank you for all your answers
Sandy
Hi Sandy

All ways nice to hear from you

As to your question , the answer is yes, you should write the letter and you can help.

The Parole board , are looking for a release plan as such, ie:

Has the prisoner got personal/social support upon release
Where will the prisoner reside
Has the prisoner arranged employment
Has the prisoner addressed offending behaviour through program participation
What will the prisoner be doing upon release ie: followup programs
Who will the prisoner be associating will
How many times has the prisoner re-offended
Nature of offence
This one of the most important," Has the prisoner identified the factors which contributed to the offending behaviour, ie: Out of a job, , stress, family issues, drugs" etc. Having identified them "What in his plan has he put in place to prevent these factors coming into play again.

Another point is "Empathy with the victim" , not just saying sorry or I know how they must feel, but more on how the crime effected them.

I guess what I am trying to say is that a release plan is essential, yes by all means write to them but do so in a letter that is short and to the point , things like " I Love him" will not mean anything. Try and answer the questions they might have, keep it to one page , use heading for each question. The big thing is to put a case forward of what he and you are going to do to prevent further reoffending. Think as they would , what would you want to hear from a prisoner and his family etc:

You will need to talk to him , because l your case for release could be blown out the window if what he says to them and what you write don't match, do you understand.

What you can do is talk to him about the release plan , and do the leg work in relation to things that he can't do such as employment enquiries etc:

Hope this helps

Regards
Seenitall

Hi, Yes Joe's pretty crazy about his scrabble :D Good luck with the wedding plans. I was doing that only last month when my bro got married in Cairns.
Regarding the looking for work..mmmm I was in that position last year after being made redundant after 13yrs!!! & then being in hospital for a month, then learning to walk again! You know what helped? I decided what I needed to do for the short term..put it out there...and got it..part-time work close to home & not stressful....I still can't beleive it. Yes it will take time adjusting to a new life..my body is my prison at the moment. Make a small list and prioritize it, break it down and when you get to cross off the smallest thing, it feels great!!
My damn list keeps growing though and I don't have the strength to do most of them, just have to work around them. One small step at a time & you will keep moving..LOL..good luck with everything.
Regards
Sandy

Thank you very much. That helps a lot. Is there a specific form I fill out or is it just a letter to the parole board. Can I call them & ask to talk to someone who knows him. Can Joe ask someone there for more information? He is up for his SMR next month. So far they have been fairly helpful.
Regards
Sandy

Hi sandy

No there is no generic form , you will need to write it as a letter, you can ring them and seek advise, you can also talk to his case officer within the prison.

The main thing to remember is that the board I guess have "heard it all before" in a sense and your letter should be sincere and truthful because if not they will pick it in a minute.

Even so some prisoners still get Parole , but if they breach it then I can tell you they will pay for it because the Parole board never forgets. I know what I am about to say may sound stupid, but If you want some advise tell your man to go to the Police station near where your going to live. Ask for the person in charge , and tell them that you want to start again , no bull**** tell it as it is , tell them that you are going to make a go of it and would like their support.

If you do this , then you will see a difference , believe me , think about it the person in charge will know what you want to do he or she will give you that chance because how many people would do what I have suggested . Normally the police would follow your every move whilst on Parole one stuff up and back you go , but if your sincere the person in charge who make that decision at to whether to go for you or not is more likely to say backoff . does that make sense.

I wish you well and if you need a hand with your submission pm me and I will help, but be patient please , for I have a long list of people seeking the same.

I am here for you

Regards
Seenitall:)

Hi Seenitall, Thank you so much for that. I realise honesty is best. Joes parole application comes up in March I think, so I do have some time to speak to him about it all. Maybe I can get to talk to his case officer when I am next up there. I have the ph.no to call. I guess that is the next big step too, starting again with the law with you not against you.
Regards
Sandy

With you always Sandy

I would hate to think of all the time I have done something wrong and just not been caught, I am here to help and help I will if you need any assistance just pm I am here for you, okay!!!

I was walking down the road today, and I was waiting to cross at the lights (this was just down from the police station, and there were a multitude of police officers hanging around the intersection) I noticed a sergeant come up behind me. The lights went green to cross, and so I took off at a reasonable clip to the middle of the road. (it was a 6 lane road and you can only cross one side at a time) I heard this stentorian-sounding voice say something behind me, and turned around and said "Sorry?" (it was the cop) he said "Oh no, no, you didn't do anything wrong, I just said that they don't give you much time to cross the road" I agreed, and we had a bit of a laugh about it. I hate to say it, but sometimes it's hard not to be a little paranoid... even though I knew I wasn't doing anything wrong.

Hi Seenitall, I spoke to Joe this week. His SMR has been brought forward 1 mth. His case officer spoke to him about all that he's been doing, work, courses etc. & said he was going to put a good word in for him! What would all that mean? he could get moved to a farm soon? He is happy about that too. I have friends who live near either one in those areas beleive it or not! So visiting him where ever would not be a problem.
Yes we will talk more in detail about his parole when the time draws closer.
Thank you
sandy









With you always Sandy

I would hate to think of all the time I have done something wrong and just not been caught, I am here to help and help I will if you need any assistance just pm I am here for you, okay!!!

Hi Sandy,

If he is moved to an open classification (assuming that he is presently medium), then they will try to ship him off to a farm as soon as possible. I got offered the farm - as I was Open when I came in - but for a number of reasons, I did not want to go there - I only had a little bit to serve anyway. They generally like to make people do 1/3rd in secure, 1/3rd in Res, and 1/3rd at the farm, although this is more of a thumb-rule than an actual one. (I'm assuming since he is a cook that he is in res)

Wolston is chock solid, and there is a backlog at R&R, so it's in their interest to lower Joe's classification... I hope that he gets it. :)

Dave

Hi Sandy

So your fellow is up for Review and the Case officer has indicated that he will put a good word in for him , sounds very positive to me .

He has been a good worker, he has undertaken courses to address offending behavior, a very good position to be in I must say.

Open camp placement seems inevidable and it is only a matter of time before he gets a transfer.

I wish you well.

Now to all those who took the opportunity to have their say in respect to my last post ie: having done things wrong and not being caught, I was merely referring to things of a very minor nature which was not deliberate but on reflection wrong, and yes I to have paid the ocassional speeding fine.

Thank you seenitall, Thank you for the positive words. :) I hope all goes well for us.
Regarding the comment on things done. We are all guilty of that. Even the thought of ' I could take that & no one would know' is stealing. Small as it is it is still there waiting for an opportunity. Picking up a coin off the pavement is the same. It is taking something that we have not earned. we've all done it at some stage. Our own morals keep us in check for the bigger things. Anyway that is my own observations.
Thanks again
Sandy

Hi Seen it all
I am in need of your knowledge again. My boyfriend's mother has just been given 1 - 12 months to live. She lives in a different state and has decided she does not want a funeral. Brett doesn't really want to get a transfer away from me. Are there any options open to him to go to see her and if he does decide on a transfer can it happen quicker under these circumstances, as he has been told it can take 12 months plus? His mother would find travel dangerous. I don't know of any solution but I thought asking you would be worth a try! I just feel so useless.

His prison infridgement case was finally heard last week and he was cautioned. He should be out in the cottage next week. One good thing did come out of this - he got a sentencing plan! A first for Alice Springs!

Thank you for your help

Hi Seen it all
I am in need of your knowledge again. My boyfriend's mother has just been given 1 - 12 months to live. She lives in a different state and has decided she does not want a funeral. Brett doesn't really want to get a transfer away from me. Are there any options open to him to go to see her and if he does decide on a transfer can it happen quicker under these circumstances, as he has been told it can take 12 months plus? His mother would find travel dangerous. I don't know of any solution but I thought asking you would be worth a try! I just feel so useless.

His prison infringement case was finally heard last week and he was cautioned. He should be out in the cottage next week. One good thing did come out of this - he got a sentencing plan! A first for Alice Springs!



Hi Positive

Firstly let me say I am sorry that you have found yourself in such circumstances. As to your questions Given that his mother is terminally ill the authorities would allow him to go by way of a normal external escort if she was located nearby but if it were say an interstate this would not be allowed.

I know it would be hard on him , however I do not feel that a transfer would be the best thing for him , if he gets a full transfer then he will have trouble getting back. My advise to you is for him to put in for a temporary transfer provided its in the same state and make this application on compassionate grounds.

The classification committee do at times allow for a temporary transfer on these grounds if the prison population is not one of overcrowding and a bed is available , in these circumstances though he would only be granted this for a few months before being returned.

Your man will need to provide evidence in support of this application ie: get her doctor to write a letter addressed to his case officer detailing the extent of the illness and her inability to travel. Ask his case officer to start the paperwork and keep it on file ready for when he needs it should it be by way of external escort or submit an application together with the letter to the local Review and Assessment committee. Be prepared thats what I am trying to say, because I have seen to many prisoner who leave things to the last minute and unfortunately they have not been allowed to go. Your man should also submit a personal letter to the Main Classification committee asking for the leave or transfer explaining the close relationship with his mother and re-enforcing that this may be the only chance to see her before she dies.

If he is in the cottages, he would be a minimum security prisoner and as such he could apply for an emergency leave to see his mother but this will only be granted once to see her whilst she is still alive and once at the funeral.

Get him to speak with his case officer about what is available to him at the moment .

Well a sentence plan , so he finally got one , excellent !!!
Now provided he follows the plan it should be clear sailing through his sentence with doors opening for him as he completes each part of it. Well done!!!

HI seen it all
I have a question for you which I hope you can help me on.
My partner is in medium security in Vic. He has been granted family visits and for myself to be approved I must write a letter to family visit manager. My partner became very shy when telling me what to write in the letter. So I am hoping you maybe able to advise me on the contact of this letter. Details I presume should be included are - I have been friends with him for 10 years and we have recently became closer, I visit every week although recently I didnt visit for 6 weeks due to people saying they were going to visit him on those days I could visit and then not turning up. his family and mine are all very good friends, I have 2 children from a previous relationship who are both very close to him, (their father is deceased). We plan to get married later down the track. Is that too much info and what am I leaving out?
Thanks in advance Em

HI seen it all
I have a question for you which I hope you can help me on.
My partner is in medium security in Vic. He has been granted family visits and for myself to be approved I must write a letter to family visit manager. My partner became very shy when telling me what to write in the letter. So I am hoping you maybe able to advise me on the contact of this letter. Details I presume should be included are - I have been friends with him for 10 years and we have recently became closer, I visit every week although recently I didnt visit for 6 weeks due to people saying they were going to visit him on those days I could visit and then not turning up. his family and mine are all very good friends, I have 2 children from a previous relationship who are both very close to him, (their father is deceased). We plan to get married later down the track. Is that too much info and what am I leaving out?
Thanks in advance Em


Hi, Em77

The information you have stated thus far should be included in the letter and are very important points which carry a lot of weight in respect to his application. The Residential Visit program was set up to ensure that the prisoner has the ability to maintain family ties especially with his partner and children if any, and this program in the main is for long term prisoners who are not at a point in their sentence where they can do this by way of the leave program.

The criteria to join the family visits program can be a little bit different from location to location but the main criteria content is the same and is as follows:

The prisoner must be able to prove "Long standing relationship" with the person/s who he wants on the visit program, this long standing relationship must have been demonstrated for a period not less that 18 months prior to the application and is supported by the prisoners own visit records. The application is also supported by the visitors themselves by way of letters ,statutory declarations and documents which reflect a joint relation prior to the prisoner being incarcerated say a phone bill, gas bill etc: with both names on it. Children are also important in respect to an application because the prisoner must be allowed to bond with a young child/children.

The prisoner must have a psychological report done on him or her as the case maybe if the prisoner is serving a term of imprisonment for a sexual or violent crime and if children are to be present at the family visit the authorities are also required to make relevant checks with the child protection agency to see if there is any concerns or orders from their department or the courts.

The prisoner must be of good behavior and must not have a current IDU status and of course he or she would be subject to a intel check as well.

Getting back to your letter, even if the children were from another relationship this does not matter provided that you can demonstrate that a bond exists between your man and them.

For your part , the intel section will also obviously do a check on you to see if you have had a Crn at any time and if so what these offences were and any involvement in drug activity would almost certainly blow your application out the window initially.

Hope this information helps

Regards
Seenitall

:D Thank you so much seenitall. I have just finished my letter thanks to you.:D
I will have to get a statutory dec. to provide proof as he has never had his name on my bills. although his parents are wanting to write a supporting document to show we have know each other for 10 years, would that do instaed of a stat. dec?
I have never had a crn but he is in for murder so it might be hard. He has had to one family visit with his parents and younger siblings. So i am hoping a little luck goes my way.
I have been told the rules are changing to family visit rooms in Vic, would you know of the new changes and if so what are they?
again thank you so very much your imput is so very much appreciated.:D

Hi Em77

I have not heard of any new changes to the family visit criteria.
If there are any changes to the routine it will be at the local level only , that is the individual prison may change its routine or policy ,but all prisons in Victoria must comply with the main criteria as specified by the Commissioner for the Department of Justice.

A support letter from his parents will assist , however a statutory declaration is mandatory . If he has had a family visit before with his parents and siblings it should be any easier process because he would have had the psychological report done for that visit and in this case once your relationship has been established they will merely put it to the local Review and Assessment committee for approval you three quarters of the way there already, should only be a formality once the paperwork has been put together.

Just one thing you should be aware of ,if your man gets transfered to another prison you will have to go through the whole process again and further that in most cases he will not be considered for family visits at the new location for about three months sometimes longer, annoying but just the same a fact that you should be aware of.

Please let me know how you went with it all oKay.:)

Regards
Seenitall

Thank you Seen it all once again you make life easier by providing information. I am guessing when you talk of emergency leave to see his mother and for her funeral this is only if she is close by. She is in SA and Brett is in NT.

Thank you Seen it all once again you make life easier by providing information. I am guessing when you talk of emergency leave to see his mother and for her funeral this is only if she is close by. She is in SA and Brett is in NT.


Hi Positive

Yes When I was referring to Emergency leave it is a leave that can be done within a reasonable distance of the prison. As far as an interstate escort , well I have never heard of it happening before. He can still apply for interstate transfer but this will take some time and is not assured very complex procedure and if he gets it he will not be able to apply to come back afterwards and will be required to complete the rest of his sentence and Parole up there.

Regards
Seenitall

Hi again seenital
I have another question for you in reference to family visit application I have previously spoken to you about. As the statutory declaration is mandatory I just wanted to double check so I get it right first time.
In this declaration I know I must included how long I have my partner but does it need to contain anything else?
I really just want to cross all my t's!
Thank you
Em

Hi Em77

The Statutory declaration is only to verify that you and your man have been together in a relationship which would be considered by any reasonable person as a "Long term " relationship.

In your stat dec you need to declare that it is a bonafied relationship and not just a long standing "Friendship" and that is why they ask for such documentation such as joint bills etc: to prove that.

In the case of children, even if they are not his, you should emphasis the bond between him and the children, this carry's a lot of weight, and should also be included in the stat dec.

Hope this helps

Regards
Seenitall

Hiseenitall, Well Joe had his SMR this week. No he won't be going anywhere. In their eyes he has refused the S.O. course and that is all that matters. Not the good behaviour or work or other courses will really help, they say. What to do now?
It only helps him to maintain his sense of balance in that place & continue to observe himself & become a better person. He has maintained his innosense of these charges from the first moment.
His application of parole will be by feb next year for july & the next SMR will be in March. At the moment we can only hang in there together & be positive.
Regards
Sandy

Hi Sandyg

Hmmm, I was unaware of the SO and if the SMR have asked him to do the course well then has little choice in the matter.

The SMU and the Parole board will want him to be acceptant of the crime and complete courses to address offending behavior.

Your man can stand his ground as others have done before him and I have seen them do their full time as a result. Your man obviously has taken the stance that to do the course is an admission of guilt , but regardless whether he does the course or not he was convicted and this will always be on record.

In respect to his protest , I ask to what end, the only people who would know about it would be the other prisoners or himself whilst he rots in a prison cell for years to come and for what gain.

If he loves you , he will swallow his pride and do the course and then hopefully be home to give you a cuddle instead of his pillow.

I feel for you , but you have to remember , its upto him in the end, what will it be his silly pride or his love for you. If it were me and I had to make the choice I would tell them I was the Grim reaper if thats what they wanted to hear.

He is lucky to have you on the outside waiting for him and I am sure he doesn't appreciate how it is effecting you , ask him to weigh it up and if he has any sense about him at all he will do the program and come home to you.

Sorry Sandyg for being so blunt , I haven't said this to hurt you okay.

Hi Seenitall, I thank you for your honesty & understanding. I will put it to him and see what comes out of it......I do want him home sooner than later. We can all learn from all trials in life. Pride is a curse really.
Thank you again.
Sandy

Hello
I am searching for a friend named jason who was in junee correctional in approx. 1999. Can anyone help me???? Not sure what else to say.
Thanks, Amanda

Hi members

Seenitall has many forums to visit and I can see that all is well on the AUS front with no questions raised.

This being the case if you have a problem PM me and I will answer your questions, apart from that I will drop in form time to time to view the forum.

Thinking of you all

Seenitall

HI Seenitall,
Rumors are going around about day release going back to 3yrs or maybe 18 mths. As to it being 1yr, before being eligible. Have you heard anything? Do I stop getting excited about this and take it with a grain of salt?
Can understand if this puts you in a awkward position to answer.
Thank you
Em

Em: I can't speak to it from a position of knowledge, but I would advise you to take things with a grain of salt, and until you hear things from a confirmed source within the DCS, don't believe it. The prison system runs on rumours, it gives people something to do. :P

hi i'm jersey911 myson is in prison up here bayside ancora can any one tell me what ancora is would appreciate any help on this thks. jersey911

Hi jersey, welcome to PTO. Are you certain you are in the right forum? You might be able to find more information in the New Jersey section: http://www.prisontalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=157 :)

I hope this helps.

HI Seenitall,
Rumors are going around about day release going back to 3yrs or maybe 18 mths. As to it being 1yr, before being eligible. Have you heard anything? Do I stop getting excited about this and take it with a grain of salt?
Can understand if this puts you in a awkward position to answer.
Thank you
Em

Hi Em77 nice to hear from you

I can only comment on the leave program in Victoria , because obviously the leave program criteria would be different from state to state.

As far as Victoria goes, there is no plans or changes to the leave program that I am aware of and I have heard nothing in relation to any proposed changes.

Given the length of your mans sentence ie:Over ( 6 ) years I would suggest that his would be MCAC leaves which would be applied for in a block. In this case, he would have to do 12 months community work two years out from his EED and the last twelve months would be open to him on the leave program. The criteria for MCAC leaves is very strict now , and the activities are to be solely directed at pre-release activities which is based on identified need. What I mean by that is if you man was to apply for a leave with the reason being to meet with and spend time with his family only , then all most certainly the leave would not be granted.

I would strongly suggest that your fellow sit down with his case officer to develop a sentence plan which identifies those needs well before the EED and lowering of security rating. Once the sentence plan has be formalized through the R&A process it will be easier to obtain the leaves given that he won't be sitting there thinking of things that need doing , this would have already been done.

Hi Seenitall,
Thank you for the information as I did not know that.
My partner is in medium security in Victoria. He has 6yrs left (before parole) and has sat down with his case manager and done the plans but where he is at, he is constantly being told he has too long left to do.He has to wait til he has less left to serve to do the programs, he has organised with his case manager he would do.Altough he is starting a phys ed course in feb.
Also have another question we got engaged on 16/9/05!!!:D :D
I don't know anything about Australian prison weddings, please could you let me know.
I appreicate your help.
Thank you
Em

Hi em77

Well with 6 years to go, I can see what the case officer is saying but your man needs to focus now on what he will do when the time is appropriate.
Even 6 years out he needs to start planning and thinking about it , yes there are a lot of variables to consider and things will change as things go by but this should not deter him from the end goal.

If you like Em can I call you that for short, I will send you a document which will help you understand what I am talking about, I notice you have not given an email option so if you want I will pass it on to the forum moderators to pass on to you if you like.

As to the wedding plans , I am not sure of the criteria at this stage but I will make some enquiries for you and get back to you when I can.

Has he popped the question , or are you waiting in anticipation oh la la a wedding no less.

You never know I might be one of your witnesses and you would never know lol:)

Thanks Seenitall,
Em for short is fine. I Have edited my profile so you can email it through. I would love to read what your talking about.
Yeah you could be one of the witness's! Gee, we wouldn't even know each other if we looked at each other, I will be the one in the dress! LOL:D
I asked him. Yeah, up front I am.
Thank you seenitall.
Em

I was just curious, Is there a maximum amount of time that an inmate can be kept in custody after being remanded, without a trial date being set?

Hi Lauren1984

Interesting question

I can't speak with authority on this one, but what I can say is that I have known of many who have spent years behind bars on remand.

Dependant on the severity of the alleged crime and the belief held by the court as to whether enough evidence is present to convict would be the guiding force as to the length of time one may be incarcerated on remand, needless to say that a review of the case must occur at regular intervals by the court in relation to a continuation of a remanded prisoners Incarceration.

Thanks for taking the time to answer the question.
Well hopefully things will start moving soon as the brief for my brother's case has been served and there will be a mention on the 5th of October in court, So maybe we will find out more then :)

You should find out a date then... a mention is one of those annoying things where you have a date at court to get another date to go back to court. :P But the wheels must grind before things happen I suppose.

I was just curious, Is there a maximum amount of time that an inmate can be kept in custody after being remanded, without a trial date being set?


If the court has remanded them, they can stay on remand until the trial/court date is set for sentencing. The judge will take into account the time that person has been on remand when he hands down the sentence though, so the actually sentence will be reduced, in Australia, we dont do "time served" on remand, the judge will say something like, with the time on remand taken into consideration, and take some time of the sentence (If sentenced). If magistrates court has denied bail, and he feels he should be released on bail, you can take it to supreme court, and apply for supreme court bail. YOu need to state your case to supreme court, why that person should be released on bail, and normally, with great charactor references, and perhaps a course taken (like drug and alchohol, anger management), you can show the higher court you are making an effort to improve yourself, and it usually does get granted. BUT... it does depend on the circumstances, the judge, etc.

Hello Kyla

Your right as usual , good source of information for all.

so how is the NZ forum going don't get many questions for that crowd at all. lol

Hi Seenitall,
I have another question for you. At my partner's prison they have banned magazines and newspapers from being brought in. My question is why? Also are all local papers banned? I asked the officers at the front desk if local papers are banned and no-one knew. Every week I send in the local papers as we plan to live here when he's released. I find the local papers helpful for him to stay in touch with our town.
Thank you again Seenitall
Em

At my partner's prison they have banned magazines and newspapers from being brought in. My question is why?

Hi Emm good to hear from you again

As to your question, well there could be a number of reasons I would suspect.

1. They could have found a lot of contraband coming in hidden in newspapers and magazines

2. They might have adopted this as a strategy to reduce the chances of contraband coming in.

3. Where your partners is , I have heard that there has been a number of incidents relating to ethnic or racial matters. If the authorities believed that this being generated because of articles in newspapers and magazines then they will prevent them from coming in. Back in the old days you may or may not know but they used to cut out the articles from newspapers and magazines before the prisoners got them or they would black out the offending paragraph etc:

I am of course only speculating as to the reason , but I would suggest that I am not far of the mark.

Thank you for your question

Regards
Seenitall

Thank you Seenitall
Somethings I don't even think of!! Your speculaction makes sense though.
Thanks again Em

Hi again Seenitall,
Hope all is well for you. We have been approved for the wedding and we have been very lucky as all is going well with the plans. Our date is set for 7/2/06. I have couple of questions for you. In my partners prison they can do courses by correspondence, do you where I get get the information for these courses? Also it has been suggested to me about being able to do apprenticeship's while inside. Have you heard of this happening? Can that happen?
Thank you
Em

In my partners prison they can do courses by correspondence, do you where I get get the information for these courses? Also it has been suggested to me about being able to do apprenticeship's while inside. Have you heard of this happening? Can that happen?


Hi Em

Congratulations, and I hope all goes well with your wedding plans:)

Correspondence courses can be sourced using TAFE who are contracted to the DOJ. They will get him all the information required and help him start the course and monitor his studies.

As you would expect there will be some costs associated with doing external studies and Dependant on the course undertaken these can be expensive.

As to the apprenticeship side of things , I have not personally heard of anyone completing an apprenticeship whilst inside, although having said that I do know of prisoners that have completed the theory side of an apprenticeship say in Cooking and Cleaning and some others . The practical side can also be taught in some fields but as to being signed up as an apprentice never heard or seen of it in my time.

If he does start external studies , this could be the key to his sentence plan and will open a lot of doors down the track for him as in the example I sent to you, it is more important now then ever for him to start structuring the sentence plan with his case officers or at the very least plan to commence it in line with his personal studies.

Wishing you the best

Seenitall

we have progressed from being the thug to a very professional organisation
Thug? I am sure the prison guards at that time didn't see themselves in that light. The environment would have compelled any decent prison guard to be a "thug" or else leave the job.

I knew one prison guard that had a very bad reputation within Fremantle Prison. Years later when we were both at Karnet he seemed like a different man but was obviously scarred by what he was previously. Some of the things I remember him saying at Karnet, revealed he was a moral person.

It is well known that prison guards serve a sentence of sorts. It would be one of the last jobs I would recommend to anyone. The cost of doing that work is very high.

I am referring to the 1980s in Perth and obviously matters have changed.

I did see a dynamic shift in the prison guard culture and the prison makes a great difference to. At the end of the day people are people and I did meet some decent prison guards, like OB the chef at Karnet. He was very popular because he was simply a great person, and he was a prison guard, but rarely in uniform, being a professional chef with some impressive achievements such as an OBE (Order British Empire) and more for services rendered in his younger days in the forces.

Years later among my friends at our local Parish, a serving prison guard became part of the group. The group was large and diverse and I don't think I ever spoke with him nor he with me. I don't wear clothes with arrows pointing every which way so I doubt he knew. It also helps that I don't have a "prisoner" appearance.

Just thought I'd add some more insight.

PS

I did see one prison guard I knew on the outside. She had a romantic relationship with a prisoner and from memory, I think it was another prisoner (obviously petty and jealous), that had reported them. She lost her job. I saw her because she dropped her boyrfriend off for the 3-6 month work release community service we had to do because we didn't have a paid job. They seemed happy together so I guess things turned out for the best. This is going back to mid-late 1990.

Thank you again Seenitall,
We have been discussing his sentence plan and his future after release. Thats why we are interested in the correspondence course. I was hoping I could get the information without him knowing the cost as he does not want people paying alot of money. As I am aware these courses can be costly. I will tell him to speak to his case manager about all of this.
Thank you again for your insight. I appreciate it
Em

You should find out a date then... a mention is one of those annoying things where you have a date at court to get another date to go back to court. :P But the wheels must grind before things happen I suppose.

Ahhh, They set a date for another mention at the last mention. LOL. How annoying.

Why they can't just have some kind of clerk's office to organize dates for court, I will never know. Personally, I think it is just a scam for the Lawyer's to be able to charge more money. :P

Crime does pay... the lawyers.

Atleast I know he won't get himself into much trouble in there. :)

I have been coming in regularly to see if there is a question or two for seenitall, but alas not one have I seen.

Do you still need my help or advise or is everything well

Let me know

Regards
Seenitall

To all on PTO, Merry Christmas and a Happy new year from Seenitall

Thinking of you all

Your friend even if you don't know it

Seenitall

hello all, wishing all the best for the new year.
I have a question. J got a letter from one of the 2 daughters who testified against him. She is very sorry she has lied to all. She says she was coherst into it by her older sister & mum. She wants to see him next year when she is 17 & wants him to write to her in the mean time. She misses him & wants to know if he still cares about her.
He wants to do the right thing by her.
He doesn't know what to do? He will see the physc. first. What can he do legaly? He was told he could have no contact with them.
Is it something that legal aide could check for him?
His daughter may not have realized this. He thinks it could be a ploy by his ex to mess up his parole application. She has done these things before. Maybe now the truth will finally come out. What a horrible mess!

thank you all

She wants to see him next year when she is 17 & wants him to write to her in the mean time. She misses him & wants to know if he still cares about her.


Hi Sandyg

Tell J. that this would be a very bad mistake if he is having contact with her at all. If the courts have an order prohibiting contact, he may be charged and returned to court for further conviction.

My advise is this, he can apply to the court for contact with her via the mail or pehaps the phone whilst in prison , but this should be condoned by the courts and on record as having been approved.

Unless this is granted , I strongly suggest that he have no further contact with her whatsoever. Should he fail to comply with the order the ramification will be great and most definately have an effect on Parole, Prison Placement which could include the refusal to lower his security rating.

If you believe her in so much as her statement that she has lied , then ask her to make a statement to the police and have this fact recorded.

Don't be foolish about this , seek legal advise now , legal aid should be able to give you the initial advise before its to late.

Regards
Seenitall

Hi, Thank you for that info. I will pass it on. Yes J is aware of the ramifications if he contacts her. He has got a card from his youngest too & not able to reply.
At least he knows they are thinking of him & care about him. But hard all the same not being allowed to reply.
Thanks again
Sandy

I sent Joe a card incidentally Sandy. :)

hello, i just found out my partners nan is in hospital, she really isnt well and they think she may have had a stroke, i rang port phillip prison to get a message threw to him about it but the said no, i said it was about his nan being in prison and they still said no, how can i get a message to him? i cant go and see him tomorrow and he cant ring me untill tomorrow night because he dont get money in till then,
is their anyway at all i can get a message to him? tonight?

Hi leishie

Sorry I am a bit late with the answer however Christmas and all haven't been on .

I have sent you the answer by email at your request.

Again sorry , for the delay in responding.

Regards
Seenitall

Hi, I just want to find out what happens with phone calls, the guy I have been seeing went in 2 weeks ago and I still have not heard from him. He was at Arthur Gorrie in QLD and was moved to Darling Downs yesterday. Just it usually take a while before they can contact people? I am worried its because he just does not want to and I miss him. Thanks

Hi, I just want to find out what happens with phone calls, the guy I have been seeing went in 2 weeks ago and I still have not heard from him. He was at Arthur Gorrie in QLD and was moved to Darling Downs yesterday. Just it usually take a while before they can contact people? I am worried its because he just does not want to and I miss him. Thanks


Hi kasey71

Every prisoner received into custody is intitled to one reception phone call free of charge to let love ones know where he is incarcerated.

I would suggest that he is still in shock at being imprisoned and if it is his first time it will take time for him to work things out, needless to say he must learn much in a very short space of time.

You can ring the prison and enquire as to his welfare at any time or write to him to see whats happening . Some prisoners after they have been sentence tend to isolate themselves trying to deal with what has happened some feel worthless and a burden to love ones and don't ring or write to them for a period of time.

My advise is to ring the prison and see how he is going, contact the chaplain or priest or even the Salvation army if they service that prison.
Personally , the Salvo's bless their big hearts are in my book the best of the best and if they say they will chase it up they will.

Just remember , its not you thats the problem and its not your fault nor have you done anything which is preventing his contact , give it a bit of time sounds like he has a very supportive person in you , and it is bound to work itself out in the end, okay.

Please feel free to ask any question you have , I am only to happy to help where I can .

Regards
Seenitall

In QLD, the inmate asks to have the person added to their phone list. The prison calls you and asks if that is ok. He needs to have money on his phone account to be able to call you though, after its all approved. It could take a few days to approve you, so hang in there !!!

Thanks Kyla, I did not think this would be so hard but I am really struggling. I will hang in there and hope to hear from him soon.

thanks for the info Seenitall, that does make sense and it has made me feel a bit more as ease. I will just hang in there and keep writing and supporting him.

Hi Kasey71
My pleasure!!!
remember help is only a keyboard away, just ask

Seenitall

Hi Seenitall,

It has now been a month and I have still not heard a word from him. I have heard that his sister went to see him and he was not doing well and could not look at her so he is obvioulsy feeling pretty low. I have kept writing letters and sending cards to let him know that I am still here supporting him but now I am wondering if they are doing more harm then good. From your knowledge do you think I should keep this up or just give him space to work through everything.

Thanks

Hi Kasey

As to your question , I would say keep on writing, he is as I suspected feeling extremely low he feels ashamed at being in prison.
He needs to know that you are not going to leave him, even though right at this minute he probably wants you to, I know its hard to understand but being in prison is harder.

After awhile he will come around and see that you are not going to leave he will be happy!!!.
I am sure he will get in contact with you, just be patient. Ask the chaplain etc: to talk to him or indeed the prison counselors they might be able to sow the seed so to speak.

Kasey give it some more time, don't give up.
Believe it or not his actions are a good sign in a sense , he is showing remorse which indicates that all is not lost in this man and he is worth saving.

Regards
Seenitall

Thanks Seenitall

I will keep writing to him but it is getting harder and harder to know what to say. He is a good man and his sentence is only 3 months with 1 month gone already. I did call the prision and ended up being put through to a counselor but she told me that due to privacy she is unable to discuss him with me I will have to wait for him to contact me which is very frustrating. I live interstate so I cant go see him which he said he did not want me to anyway, he was scared that me seeing him in there would change what I think about him and I could not change his mind on that.

Thanks for you support

Hi Kasey , again I say don't give up keep writing to him it is very important to maintain that contact and remember when he comes out he will be hesitant to say the least.

Your continued correspondance answered or not , is still a bond.

Keep going Kasey you will be okay.

What ever the outcome , you get a big thumbs up from me , your okay!!!!!!!

Regards
Seenitall

Several of the guys who I write to don't write back, or do so very infrequently. It is difficult to write to them, not having anything to relate to them about. You can only do what you can do Kasey, it is hard, but I think that by keeping on writing you are showing him - even if it takes him some time to realise it perhaps - that you do care for him. I saw a lot of guys doing a lot of 'hard' time because they had no contact with the outside world, and a letter is always very much appreciated.

Good luck. :)

Hi Seenitall,

I had the best suprise on Friday, he was realsed on good behavior and is now home, and I was the first person that he called, I am so glad that I kept writing and he said that my letters saved him as he had a pretty tough time. We have both had quite an emtional weekend and still have lots of talking to do but we are going to be OK. Thankyou so much for you support and advise and making me not feel so alone in all this. Your alright yourself!!!

Take care

Kasey

hi Kasey, Thats fantastic news!! It's so hard to know what to do when there is no word. Trust your gut feelings, & go with it. Hope you can build a great friendship together. Does he know how lucky he is? I bet he does.
Good luck
Sandyg

Hello Kasey!!!

So glad it has all worked out for you and your man.

Just remember you will always have friends here at PTO to help and support you both.

Good luck to you both for the future

Seenitall

That's great Kasey :)

Kasey, that must be the best possible news! Good luck with everything and I hope it all works out!

Thanks everyone but I may have spoken to soon. It seems that this whole experience has deeply affected him and he has has now told me that he is just to messed up to be in any kind of relationship right now and needs to sort himself out and work on getting back to where he was before he starting getting into trouble. He cant seem to cope with any physical contact right now, with anyone. I am completley crushed but as hard as it is to admit I can see the truth in it all. Thanks to everyone for all you help, just thought I should give you an update. I know I am going to be OK.

Hi Kasey , again I say don't give up keep writing to him it is very important to maintain that contact and remember when he comes out he will be hesitant to say the least.


Hi Kasey

As I said in my post, he will be a bit hesitant at first.

This is to be expected, and he will need time to work through his own demons so to speak. My advise is to give him some space right now and just be there for him.

Keep in touch okay

Regards
Seenitall

Prison is a screwed up place, Kasey, and it affects people in all kinds of ways. When you're inside you're limited to a few hugs and a kiss every week if you're lucky, and there's no other real physical contact with other people. It won't do anyone any good if you try to push him to be someone who he isn't ready to be yet.

I'll be thinking of you guys.

Dave

absolutely madeinoz, His emotions must be running high & low, must take a lot of strength to see them all & not let them take over.
Joe tells me he has to fight to not let the negativity take over, to remain aware at every moment. He is learning a lot about himself & therefore others.
Gosh, I can smell the smoke/ burnt earth from the fires in the country this morning.
Take care
Sandyg

Thanks everyone for your on going support, I just thought that I would give you an update and let you know that I am going OK. I have not really had much contact with him and from my end have just been trying to give him space which is hard, I could not contact him while he was gone and now he is out I still cant talk to him as much as I would like. From what I hear he has pretty much been on a bender since he got out, I guess time will tell.

Hi Kasey

My guess is that he is trying to block what has happened by using alcohol to do the job, but this can only go on for a short period of time before he crashes back to reality.

When this happens he will need all the support he can get, and with you standing by him he has a very good chance.

You must really love him, to go through what you are going through, you have my admiration and as I said before your okay!!!!

Kasey, Don't ever forget about yourself, your well being is also important, take a break and go away for awhile and rest otherwise you will burn out, you will not be any good to him if emotionally your drained yourself , please give yourself some space and please look after yourself, take a break!!!!

Seenitall

Thanks! I am doing OK and yes I am looking after myself and trying to get back to being me which did get lost a bit in all this. the support I get here on PTO has really helped. I will keep in touch

HI, What changes are happening in QLD in regards to remissions & parole? J has read that remissions are to be abolished. Is this so or only a rumour?
Doesnt seem to encourage good behavour or real rehabilitation.
Regards
Sandy

Hi Sandyg, can't answer that honestly , don't know what Qld's doing at the moment. If Qld follows victorian legislation they will replace Remissions with what they call "Truth in Sentencing" meaning that the Remissions will be calculated at the time of sentencing and the court will work out the Minimum period before parole.

This came about when the public started to scream about prisoners getting a set Minimum term by the judge but were release early because of the Remissions earn't whilst in custody.

I would suggest that Qld will follow in the direction of this legislation and No your right not a lot of incentive to behave .

Seenitall

Seenitall, Truth in Sentencing would be nice, but I am not sure that Queensland will introduce it any time soon. The current Queensland political mood, and by extension the 'justice' bureaucracy is in favour of harsher and harsher penalties. Eligibility for parole is an uncertain thing, as the policy tends to be denial for everyone on their first go at it. The most ridiculous part of Queensland law is that there is room for indefinite sentences. That's over the top. :P

Do all inmates in QLD have to apply for parole? In NSW, if an inmate's non-parole period is less than three years, parole is automatically given. Above that, they must face the parole board. How does it work in QLD??

Hey,

I dont know if this is a silly question, i am very new to all this, but how long can they keep you at the watch house? like is there a maximum amount of time, and if they keep him at the watchhouse for a long time, does he get more then one phone call??

Thanks Amy

http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt/d/4;29;6/st/20070609/e/Dayne+Comes+Home+/dt/15/k/1ac2/event.png

I dont know if this is a silly question, i am very new to all this, but how long can they keep you at the watch house? like is there a maximum amount of time, and if they keep him at the watchhouse for a long time, does he get more then one phone call??



At the moment in Victoria there is something like 400 prisoners in Police cell awaiting a bed in prisons. As to your question , the Vic Government gazzetted some police cells as prisons so the answer in respect to those cell is "Indefinate".

What I believe is , if the government gazzettes police cells as prisons , that area should be run by prison officers not police , I would suspect the police would not object to this suggestion either , they just like aprehending them not looking after them, I would say also that the prisoners would be treated better under prison officer supervision.

Ok, i have another question, which also maybe silly, i'm almost finished my first letter to dayne, but i have no idea how to address it i know it has to go to arthur gorrie (which is where he will be transfered, hopefully in the next 4 days, as a guard said to me today)

and i am pretty sure this is their address (which i found on this site)

Arthur Gorrie Correctional Centre
Address PO Box 1300
Richlands QLD 4077

but i dont know how i address his name, like do i just put his name, or will he have a number or something??

Amy

At Arthur Gorrie they generally like you to put their full name (all three), no need to put his number in, followed by the address, you don't have to put the name of the institution on it.

A friend of mine was moved to Arthur Gorrie from the Watchhouse in Brisbane today (his sentencing was on thursday), so you aren't the only one waiting. :P

Hey My Dayne-o Got Transfered This Morning To Ag - I Dont Know What Step I Take Next, But I Am Extremely Excited We Are On To The Next Step - Jail Time - Lol...it Can Only Get Really Bad Before It Gets Really Good...

Thank You So Much For Tellin Me About How To Address The Letter

If you want to have a visit with him this weekend, I would suggest ringing them up asap. Visits bookings are supposed to be made on mon-wed, before midday, but they do generally make an exception for new arrivals. (I don't have the phone number, but if you ring Enquiries, they can tell you, or Dayne will have that info in his induction booklet) With AG you don't require the massive amount of ID they require at other prisons (which is kind of stupid really) but it makes it easier to get contact visits.

I found in my experience that the transient nature of the prison system was all very annoying. It is a strange thing I suppose, that one should want "To just find a home, and settle in for the long haul" but it is always good to have some stability. You take time, make some 'friends' (too strong a word?) and then just when you get used to it, they up and move you somewhere else.

Just a small request, would you mind not capitalizing every word in your posts in future. Muchas gracias. :)

Take care,

Dave

Heya,

I'm sorry about the caps, i was very excited this morning, as i am now, and i just cant wait to see him, i got an appointment for sunday, but once again, i have some questions, at arthur gorrie are they contact visitis? ( i hope they are)

Ummm...what are the rules? like the lady gave me a huge lists of donts which confused me a lot more then i thought...I was just wondering what if anything i am allowed to take him?? and what i am allowed to wear??

also how many phone calls will he be allowed a week??

Sorry for all this, i know i am annoying, just trying to get use to all this, I'm so excited i get to see my baby

Luv Amy

Amy, you aren't being a bother at all with your questions. The only way to find out things is to ask. :)

At Arthur Gorrie they are contact visits (basically it is contact, unless you cause them to not be), and they last for two hours. I recommend wearing something fairly conservative, to avoid problems on both sides of the fence so to speak. Don't wear anything that requires a belt, because you'll have to take it off (the belt). No watches are allowed if I remember correctly, most jewellery except wedding rings aren't allowed. (I was on the other end of the visits, so I'm just going on what I remember, I just remember not knowing how long we had left) Most of these rules are strict guidelines, but in the case of dressing conservatively, it is generally not good to attract too much attention (as much as I can imagine you wanting to dress nicely for your guy) Oh, I just talked to my mum, and gleaned the following: "No thongs, and no midriff tops, or other revealing stuff".

You can take in money in coins to buy things like cans of softdrink, bags of chips, chocolate, and so on. You are provided with a locker to put any handbags/purses/other loose items in for the duration of the visit.

The inmate enters first, and is given a number, this is the number of a table in the area, and they will sit in the seat which is coloured. (memory is getting a little rusty on me) There is an 'indoor' and an 'outdoor' section of the visiting area, and depending on the whether it can get quite hot in the section where the sun is.

You're allowed a hug and kiss and so on for about 5 minutes at the start, and at the end, they will generally give a warning through the PA about these times. I think the limit is holding hands, but anything beyond that during the rest of the time is generally frowned on. The screws at Arthur Gorrie seem to have less of a sense of humour in the visiting area.

You can't take anything into the visiting area apart from coins, anything that you want given to your boyfriend you have to hand in at the front desk. You are really only allowed to pass him socks and underwear (a good idea) which need to be new and sealed in plastic packets. You can take in money to put on his account. (I think it could be cash, or money orders made out to his name, there is a section in the induction handbook if I remember correctly)

Phone calls are only limited by the amount of money he has on his phone account. (There are two 'accounts' that prisoners have, a general account, which they can buy stuff on Buyup from, as well as make outside purchases, and the phone account, which obviously is used to make phone calls. Phone calls last for 10 minutes (minus a recorded message which lasts for about 30 seconds) and are charged at normal rates (either local, or long distance). The other limiting factor with phone calls is the fact that there is generally only one phone in each unit housing 50-52 guys, and at peak times (after dinner and before lock up, as well as early in the morning) there is always a queue. If it's possible to organise times to call outside these hours, it's probably a good idea. Incidentally, lockup is at 5:30, and unlock in the morning is at 7:30ish.


I hope this helps you out. Good luck! :)

Dave

Thank You Sooo much, what you have just said, has made things alot easier on me, thank you thank you thank you... i am so excited about seeing him, i didnt want to forget anything, ohhh thank you Dave it means so much to me, to have this support, thank you...

OK...so the big day is about to happen, and i am very confused i've been looking and looking, and i cant find anything to wear, everyone says conservitive, but i cant find anything that suits, i dont wanna over dress or underdress, can somene help me

Amy

Hi Amy, Hmm what to wear??? Gosh, smart casual, perfume, no jewelry, no sunnies, no thongs. Just look & smell good for him..he'll love you just for being there!
Gosh, I wish I had all that info before I went there,I was so nervous, even though I was with his family. Some girls really get dressed up I noticed. Whatever feels right I guess.
Hope all goes well
Sandy

Thank you...this site has helped me soo much...everyone is telling me like what i wore to court?? like button up top slacks? is that right or is it too much...i know it wont matter to him, i just want the jail to be happy

Amy

Hi, Just need some advise on sending a reference for J parole.
Do I send it to him or the parole board?
Can I say that I understand his conviction & offer support for him to do any cources that are required. To support him while he is adjusting to the outside world. To find work, paid or unpaid. What else do I need to say?

He has put me down a his 1st preference, his Mum 2nd. I'm in Melb. She is Qld, southport. I don't know where the cources are near her or if he would have to travel to the city. He would have to travel to the city here, I believe. I'm only 10 mins walk from the station.

He actually hasn't been assessed for any more cources yet, he has only done the cog. skills...very good report there. He knows he will have to take any cources that are offered, but nothing yet.

A lot of guys have been shipped out to farms & elsewhere at the moment...a lot of movement. Big officials coming & looking & having teir say. Joe is hoping he will be moved on soon.
Hope his cooking skills are not being a hinderance...they enjoy his food too much. He has been off for a couple of days..with a burn on his hand...they keep asking him to return to the OM..quick. Ha Ha.
Thank you
Sandy

The Parole board , are looking for a release plan as such, ie:

Has the prisoner got personal/social support upon release
Where will the prisoner reside
Has the prisoner arranged employment
Has the prisoner addressed offending behaviour through program participation
What will the prisoner be doing upon release ie: followup programs
Who will the prisoner be associating will
How many times has the prisoner re-offended
Nature of offence
This one of the most important," Has the prisoner identified the factors which contributed to the offending behaviour, ie: Out of a job, , stress, family issues, drugs" etc. Having identified them "What in his plan has he put in place to prevent these factors coming into play again.

Another point is "Empathy with the victim" , not just saying sorry or I know how they must feel, but more on how the crime effected them.

I guess what I am trying to say is that a release plan is essential, yes by all means write to them but do so in a letter that is short and to the point , things like " I Love him" will not mean anything. Try and answer the questions they might have, keep it to one page , use heading for each question. The big thing is to put a case forward of what he and you are going to do to prevent further reoffending. Think as they would , what would you want to hear from a prisoner and his family etc:

You will need to talk to him , because your case for release could be blown out the window if what he says to them and what you write don't match, do you understand.

What you can do is talk to him about the release plan , and do the leg work in relation to things that he can't do such as employment enquiries etc:


Hi Sandyg

This is from an earlier post about Parole , It is the essentials for Parole

Hope this advise helps

Seenitall

Hi , Thank You, but if he has to go to any programmes or cources, how can he work full time? What is the usual proceedure for this..sorry i have no idea of centrelink. can I call someone here in Melb? Maybe start with voluntary work? Can you give me any step by step proceedure upon release?
Thank you Sandy

Hi Sandyg

If we assume that he will be granted Parole and further that the Board does allow him to transfer his Parole down here , this would probably be the normal procedure.

The Board has the right to direct Joe to do what ever courses or programs they deemed appropriate and a Community Based Corrections centre will be assigned to manage his file.

Joe will have a specified time to report to the centre after release and if he fails to meet the deadline without a very good excuse his Parole could be revoked.

If Joe has arranged full time employment they normally won't put demands on for him to attend course etc: during working hours , but they will check to make sure he is there and no where else.

In this type of situation , the course etc: can be done during the evening and on weekends depending on the nature of offence. All this will be discussed and agreed upon before he gets out on Parole with interviews taking place before the board consider him.

The main thing is to follow the points in the previous post for without those elements in place he would not be granted parole regardless.

Hope this helps

Seenitall

Seenitall would you say those points are the same when going for sentencing? DH will be sentenced in the next week or so (part 2 of his crime) and I want to have everything ready to get him home and out of jail. So if I have to organise something now for the judge to see he has changed I need to do it now. I answered yes to all those questions. So to me it looks good. Though I have my hopes up and have him coming home in a week. Reality will come crashing down real soon

Hi Kellz

In relation to sentence or plea, you are right the elements are basically the same. The main things to remember in your situation is that he shows true remorse for the crime, he has identified the factors that contributed to the crime and he has a plan in place to ensure that it won't happen again.

Remember the courts have heard it all , so to come up with a fairytale solution will be frowned on , it has to be genuine and mean something.

Ensure the support network is in place and programs to address offending behavior the courts will look favorable on any individual who has identified the faults and has done the leg work to do something about it.

Kellz , just remember though , that certain crimes have certain penalty's and regardless of what you put up the court will have to impose the appropriate penalty as a deterrent, the degree of that penalty