I recently heard that it has been shown that the #1 indicator for failure for a released prisoner, is not having someone met them at the door.

What are your thoughts on this?

JJT

If I had a loved one being released there would be nothing to keep me away from that door!!! I can't imagine that happening - it is so far beyond my comprehension.

Andi

I think it would be not having a stable place to live....

Various reasons:
-not having someone to pick them up from the gate.
-getting in an argument with someone in the house.
-unawareness of good survival skills that doesn't mean "survival of the fittest".
-bumping into an old acquaintance.
-mind clouded by drugs.
-loved one not open-minded enough to hear what they got to say.
-released inmate in society is like a fish without water - environmental shock.
-accustomed to prison life, it is predictable with security.
-going back in prison for protection from someone out there wanting to bust ass.
-unable to get shelter, bed, food, water, and writing materials on the outside.
-et cetera................... should I go on?

My husband is the picture of recidivism.

His reasons for going back:
- cops who won't leave him alone
- dope buyers/dealers who set him up
- property owners who reported their stuff stolen

His real reason for going back:
- HIS attitude and lack of sincere change in his life

He's always had somebody at the gate to pick him up. He's always had a bed to sleep in and more often than not, a job waiting for him when he got home from prison. He's not on his second chance, he's on his forty-second one.

For all the reasons I could come up with, it is his actions that land him back in prison. What prompts those actions? His desire to do dope. It's a never-ending, viscious cycle.

If lack of ties to the outside world is the number 1 reason for recidivism, you would think the DOC would make more of an effort to give inmates access to the people in the outside world who care about them (visits, phone calls, mail actually getting to the inmate in less than three weeks, etc.)... okay, I know I'm preaching to the choir but sometimes it's so frustrating.....

Jessica

Recidivism isn't something that can be lumped into one reason. Just like the people who return to prison, each situation is different. Mississippi subscribes to the notion that keeping families in tact. That is why they were THE first states to inact conjugal visitation. (Just read that yesterday...still kind of shocking) However there are so many in the prison system that are not married. How would anything like that effect them?

Then there are the situations, like Danielle mentioned, where the crimes are, for lack of a better phrase, drug induced. To stop the crimes committed by a person who is addicted, you first have to stop the addiction. Sure most prisons have A&D or other rehab programs, but the inmates also know that most times it is a condition of release. They have to want rehabilitation, not just a way out of prison.

We also have to remember that some people have lived a life of crime for so long that they don't know anything better, or they have been in prison for so long that the world has advanced without them. The don't understand the new technologies that are out here so they are at a major disadvantage when it comes to getting a job and creating a new life. This is why I feel it is very important that some kind of practical education be taught in the prison system. While there are corresponse courses available to some, it doesn't teach them how to use the new technology with computers and the internet. This can become a bigger issue in the state of Mississippi where the most largely available classes are for biblical studies and agriculture. Also, there are laws that prohibit certain offenders from recieving financial aid if they have been convicted of certain felonies. How is one expected to change their life if they aren't allowed the same avenues as everyone else?

Lastly, everyone knows, or knows of, a person who just doesn't mind being in prison. As strange as it sounds, some are just not as effected by being locked up as others. They are not scared of returning to the system, because they have somewhat grown acustomed to that lifestyle. Of course many that feel this way do so because they never had anyone to visit them, write them or care about them and have never felt the pain that can only be felt by someone who has been ripped away from the ones they love. Even if someone is there at the gate to pick them up, that doesn't mean they feel the same love and concern as maybe they should feel from their family.

I am not sure I could come up with a #1 reason, however, if I had to, I guess it would be lack of a good support system, that would include a place to stay, a way to make a living, food to eat, transportation.

I know that we here at PTO are in for the long haul and are willing to provide what we are able, however, there are so many inmates who have no one on the outside. No one at all.

It has to be very difficult to be released with no place to go, no food to eat, clothing, transportation. Those are the basics of everyone's life. We all need them to survive.

Just my opinions of course.

I agree. I belive that having someone to believe in them and to still see them as an important person. Not enabling the behavior that got them in prison. Too see that they are accountable for the past by supoporting and encouraging them to stay on the right track. How? Be an example to them.

I am not sure I could come up with a #1 reason, however, if I had to, I guess it would be lack of a good support system, that would include a place to stay, a way to make a living, food to eat, transportation.

I know that we here at PTO are in for the long haul and are willing to provide what we are able, however, there are so many inmates who have no one on the outside. No one at all.

It has to be very difficult to be released with no place to go, no food to eat, clothing, transportation. Those are the basics of everyone's life. We all need them to survive.

Just my opinions of course.

Okay, some fellas don't have a support system, someone to meet them at the door. Let's forget about them for the time being and let's talk about the men who do have all of that and more. Those guys return at the same rate, I do declare at a higher rate than the men who have no one. And I do have the number 1 reason why: they do not listen.

The men are all ears and very attentive on the in side of the wall, but on the out side of it many times their woman becomes the last person they want to listen to because they'll regard us as not knowing what we're talking about or nagging them because we're trying to tell them things that we cee which they don't. They do not listen to the people they are supposed to listen to but will listen to the people they are not supposed to listen to.

Then when they get locked back up they tell the woman, and SHE WILL do the next bid with him regardless of her saying she won't -- "yeah Honey, I should of listened to you." That's because when they're on the in side they can cee things clearer and think clearer. That's why relationships are always so blissful on the inside. On the out side they cee things differently, they think differently, they act differently and they treat their woman differently. They still love her, it's just different. On the inside they'll listen to anything she has to say, but on the outside, they're not as apt to be all ears.

I think one of the main lessons men need to learn in prison is to listen to their women. They spend years doing that while we are there for them so you'd think by the time they get out the one thing that they should of mastered would be listening to the loving arms waiting at the gate waiting to welcome him into her supportive home. The reason they need to listen to us is because God made woman for man because we were made and built for helping them to stay on track so they can meet their accomplishments in life. A woman can cee trouble and conflict a mile away and tell her man, yet he won't listen and won't realize she was right until he's standing in the middle of that trouble and conflict. She could also see goodness a mile away, yet he may get on the other road because he wants to do it his way.

Also, many of the men are addicts. If they don't acknowledge and address that, relapse is inevitable and they could wind back up sittin in a jail cell. If they don't acknowledge and address it the man himself won't even understand why he's exhibiting relapse symptoms and then here comes the use and now he's gone. He's got to learn that he has to want to quit to quit, and the addict may not even know that. This is why he has to take treatment serious because in treatment he'll learn this things and then it's up to him to decide if he wants to take sobriety serious. It's NOT easy. Neither is losing weight naturally, but it's been done so it can be done. If the man don't want to quit, he's goin back.

Also, you have your quick money makers and because the police have issues with that because taxes aren't paid on quick money, they ride your back or set you up or deploy snitches until they've gathered enuf to close in on you, and back you go.

For the ones who don't come back -- it's because they've got on point thinking skills which means they're thinking, they're weighing options, pros and cons, they may be doing bad for a minute but they're smart enuf to realize with a supporting woman like the one he's got that he doesn't have to stress because she's got his back and that actually he's not doing bad at all. Instead, he's just experiencing the "tuff" in "tuff times".

There are other reasons, but I've named in my opinion the top reasons among men with supporting women with open arms why they come back to a place that they say they hate being in.

I had one guy tell me its too stressful on the outside- Likes it better in the inside !
I thought that was very sad.He is only 33yrs but age shouldnt really make a deference I guess time should?

This subject touches my heart as if it was outside my body...

I gave myself to a man for the past ten-years, waited faithfully, encouraged and strengthened his relationship with our son, built him up and defended him to family and friends, stuck by him through domestic violence, drugs, no job, infidelity, fourteen months in jail, countless drug rehabs, marriage counseling and realized in the end he never loved me. He is now in jail again and divorce papers are enroute to him as we speak.

I would love an answer to this question...it floats around my mind, body and soul with no ending in sight...what did/didn't I do? Why wasn't I enough to motivate him to stay clean for me and our son? Why can't he change? Will he ever know how much I sacrificed to love him?

If anyone has an answer please feel free to enlighten me...Why would anyone who has a nice home, loving family, lots of outside help (doctors, health insurance, counselors etc) CHOOSE this life?

I agree completely but I also have to say that it is their mind set. They need support to make it but if they arent willing to try then they will end up right back in support or not! Those are my two cents! Anyone is capable of anything if they put their mind to it.

BigDaddysGirl wrote: No 1 Reason--THEY WANT LISTEN--this is one really good reason-- along with some receiving NO SUPPORT once they get out.my reason is listed below.
My granddaughter is back in SAFP for the second time--She had a family that supported her-help her in every way but she could not deal with a problem--being sexually abused in the past by her step-dad. She did not tell anyone until she was out of SAFP the first time. She relasped and used drugs again to be able to deal with the problem. My belief is the No 1 reason is NOT DEALING WITH THE TRUE PROBLEM--most drug users have an underlying problem that caused them to turn to drugs--most people that steal have and underlying problem etc. I did not say EVERYONE I said MOST have an underlying problem. Get to the true bottom of these problems then they are on the road to RECOVERY. My granddaughter now knows the ROOT of her problem but it is up to her if she will deal with it and quite falling back into her old habit of when things go wrong do drugs. Prisoners all need more help with their emotional and mental problems instead of just being locked up for doing bad.We need allot more GOOD counselors in the prison system on all levels--the type of counselor that can get to the root problem of why a person is locked up in the first place then help them get the help they need.
This to me is THE NO ONE PROBLEM WITH OUR LOVED ONES FAILING AND GOING BACK INTO THE SYSTEM
Just my thoughts on the subject.
Proud grannie

I worry about this al the time now my wife gets out on march 1st and i get shipped out this sat to Tamapa and then on to Spain they tell me that I will only be gone for about 3 months but the sad part is that i won't be the one to pick her up her mom is going to do that for me :(

addiction
using
drugs
alcohol
+
loneliness = prison

mrs maze, why do you think he didn't love you? you think it was never there or he isn't capable of love?
I did some reading on reentry and the help that people receive from PO's etc varies greatly from one state to another.

CET-

I feel he didn't love me for ooh so many reasons, mainly is because he continuously chose drugs over me and our son, in spite of countless resources readily available to help him, not to mention my undying devotion to him. He cheated, lied and lived a life of crime and these are the reasons why I NOW know he could NOT have EVER loved me or his kid....my stupid a-- just didn't realize these facts until it was too late.

I dont' think when a person is addicted they are thinking too clearly. have to end the addiction for true change to start! I have read that sometimes it is even several years after stopping drugs and /or alcohol that a person starts to mature and think more clearly.

This is a great topic that I'd like to see continue. You all have some fantastic insight into why people reoffend and in a few years this will help me also.

I'm not sure that it would help but I read a book called "Inside the criminal mind" by DR Samenow. I don't agree with everything he says but it's interesting reading.

I think one of the reasons could be the pressure to do right,to get reastablished when there are so many roadblocks standing in the eay.Depending on each individuals circumstances there may be more roadblocks then others.My ex is doing great BUT I know the pressure(he stated he felt pressured often) is getting to him now.The pressure of trying to maintain a relationship (having someone to answer to was a big thing for him that didn't feel right and one of the reasons we are no longer),find a good enough paying job (let alone a job)to pay his fines as well as get a place of his own,a car etc.
In his circumstances living with family is hard on him,the battle for custody of his children due to his past is hard,accomplishing everything set forth by parole and the courts (classes which he must pay for,counseling,testing etc.) is sometimes hard etc. As I said he is doing really well but sometimes feels like all the right he is doing doesn't matter as roadblocks keep popping up and the pressure to get past them and succeed is difficult to handle.

I truly believe if he messes up again which I am praying he won't it will be because he can't handle the pressure of trying to do right with the odds stacked against him and it is easier to just fall back on old habits and patterns even if they are self destructive

I can say for my son in Ca, he was forced to stay in a county there and couldn't get a job. he immediately moved in with several different women that he didn't know at all. So he probably thought he had a good deal, since he wasn't working and he is living there free. however, then he is not his own man, his name isn't on the lease, and the woman has got to resent him sometimes. they just got in a loud argument and someone called the police and his PO put him back in prison on a "hold". he didn't touch her, she is not pressing charges of any kind but he is back in prison. I wanted him to stand on his own two feet!
I think women here should beware of a man they have just known for months, wanting to move right in with them! I think a man should live on his own and establish himself, and come together from positions of strength, not him needing free rent. I think that is fine if it is family taking him in. in my case, he couldn't stay here as he had to be in CA.

My ex-husband got out of Algoa in Missouri on August 5. He is currently in the Honor Center. He is an addict/alcoholic. I am already predicting he is not long for freedom. He went looking for jobs, but only in restaurants with bars/liquor. He got one. The drugs and alcohol run his life, and he has been in twice for a total of over 6 years. It is a vicious cycle-I'd say the number one reason is drinking and drugs, and not staying away from the people who use them. He would go to AA/NA meetings, and come back to wasted I couldn't stand it. He couldn't deal with hearing about it. Made him want to get high. I met him at the gate first time, listened to his promises, and stayed for a few months the second time. He was using there, too, though he denied it. He is using now. Who else calls his ex-wife non-stop to ask for money, especially when it is a stipulation of his parole to leave me alone? I think it is like childbirth-you forget the labor pains once you have the baby in your arms. They forget the incarceration once they hit the gate. Until the next time.

I could not agree more, my hubby left me and our son after only 12 hours in the free world..you can read my post in drug and achol. forum
"What I have to do now"
I dont know how they can be locked down and then all of the sudden just come out and use?
My hubby was the model inmate when he was in and if you would have just seen him the way he was with me and our son, you would have never guessed it,, even the CO's said the day he got out that we would make it..
I waited 2 yrs for him to hold me all night long, and yet all he wanted to do was hold a needle in his arm all night..
Makes me sick and I dont understand..
Yet he said he will never go back to prison, my bet is that he will be there in just a few short months and if not there then he will surely die of a drug overdose in the streets.. sad but true....
and for what I dont understand.. I have tried and I cant so now I will let go
Hurts like hell but I have to do it for myself and our son...
No man is better than an addict man...as far as I am concerned in my life..

Blessing to each of you
Tina

TatsBabyNoMore

I met him at the gate, drove him to his parole officer, drove him around for a week 'till he landed a job, provided the home, the food, all that stuff. The simple fact is all that wasn't enough. So what would be . . . . I'll never know. But I doubt he will either.

IT'S A DISEASE,,, and until it is regarded as a disease by the person who suffers from it, that person, that addict, that alcoholic, will always prefer to stay on the "medicine". It's not that they dont love you, it's that they cant. The are too sick to be involved in healthy endeavors, like jobs, family, home and what most people take for granted,.

NO ONE ,,, and I mean NO ONE can reach an addict alcoholic, until they are ready to change, not until they are sick and tired of being sick-and-tired... and then after that they are gonna have to trust someone who has been that route to ever see a way out... some might die before that ever happens.... it's the sick, sad truth.

It takes a LOT of courage to stick by someone who stays sick...but it takes even more courage get out of the way to let them do what they need to do to get better.... problem is, sometimes they never do.

I have my doubts in my own situation, but I absolutely must put my own recovery first.. otherwise, I am gonna go down in that sinking ship....and I am not willing to do that.

In regards to the original question, why do some people not succeed when they get out? In my experience with my step brother, he has been in and out of juvi and prison since he was 12. He always had a lot of support and as far as i know not on drugs or alcohol but when he see's something he just takes it. Most of us save for that stereo system we had our eyes on, he doesn't, he just takes. He lived with my parents rent free, made about 6k a month and within a year he went back in for stealing some speakers. I think as someone mentions previously, it's easy for him to be in prison. A set schedule, he doens't have to fess up to his responsibilities to his family. Sad thing is he has 2 little girls, and he hasn't watched them grow up. So for a set of speakers he gave up watching them grow, helping them overcome obstacles. It's really sad. He is supposed be out this coming April, lets cross our fingers this time is for good but I doubt it.